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Offlinechucklehead
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Using 6500K CFLs
    #179866 - 01/11/09 11:54 PM (7 years, 10 months ago)

This is my first grow.  In terms of goals, I'm just doing this for fun and for my education on growing indoors.  I am only interested in growing indoors.  I'm not looking to produce a lot.  In fact I want to literally keep the plants small (for now).

So I've started reading and searching.  Of course I had already bought some of my equipment before I read about soil growing being the place to start learning. Also I used bag seeds instead of ordering Fem Seeds and proven genetics. Oh well.  I ordered some seeds from Dr. Chronic and already have them AK47x auto Blueberry F1 and Cyber Crystal.  The plants are supposed to be small.  So they are prefect for my designs (assuming the vendor's claim is legit).

Here is what I have going on...

I picked up an Aerogarden.  Started some bag seeds back on the 5th. 




I'm running the lights 24/7 (the two CFLs in the Aerogarden an 18 inch and a 24 inch FL grow light) and I have a fan blowing on them.  So far I have 4 recognizable sprouts.  Two of those four look damaged. 




So I figure they are as good as dead.  The remaining two have just germinated.  They are in my mycology room where my fungi produce lots of CO2 (although I have no measurements to back that up). 


I'm going to add 4 more 26W 6500k CFLs when the sides of the plants need additional light.  These will go on a timer 18/6 then 12/12 when I force flowering. When the plants outgrow the height of the Aerogarden (12 inches) I'll pull the top off of it and give them more head room and add additional lights as required.  I'm going to try to stick to CFLs and skip the MH and HPS + ballast for now.

I was concerned about the extra energy consumption tipping off the fuzz.  So I have been replacing some of the old filament incandescent bulbs in the house and replaced them with CFLs.  I'm hoping to offset some of the extra power consumption.  As I add more lights to the grow I'll replace more lights in the house.  Obviously I'll be limited by the number of lights I replace and I need to start being more aware of how often and how long I run the other lights considering I run my grow lights day and night and the other lights as needed.  Also I'm going to start turning off other appliances that aren't needed.  Several extra clocks, a tower PC that I rarely use but always leave on that sort of thing. 

So at this point I'm thinking I should rip out all of the  bag seeds and start over before these little guys suck up too much nutrition.  I considered letting the best two live.

Thoughts?  Have I erred in any serious fashion?  Advice?  Think I should ditch those bag seeds?

Thanks,
C.H.


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OfflineKaptKid Happy Birthday
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Re: Using 6500K CFLs [Re: chucklehead]
    #179920 - 01/12/09 12:33 AM (7 years, 10 months ago)

I just finished my 1st grow with hps lights.I used bag seed and MG for soil. That was a mistake. Did get some good weed and alot of knowledge.

Looks like your off to a good start.


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Offlinechucklehead
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Re: Using 6500K CFLs [Re: KaptKid]
    #179974 - 01/12/09 01:23 AM (7 years, 10 months ago)

So you're saying kill the bag seeds? 

I just read something that said 3000 lumens per square foot was a worthy goal.  So 6 26W 6500K CFLs will produce 9600 lumen.  I can't imagine more than the required light being a problem.  Plus that's only 156 Watts.  I wouldn't imagine that would make a noticeable difference in the power consumption such that the fuzz would even raise an eyebrow.

Also only one plant per square foot because crowding them causes plants to produce more stem and less bud.  Looks like 6 plants in the Aerogarden is out.  I wonder if I could get away with just two plants.  Maybe one on each side of the Aerogarden so long as I add the extra lights right away.  Supposedly those AK47x auto Blueberry F1 only get to be 18 Inches tall.  That could be just the ticket.  I could put them into flowering as soon as they hit 1 foot tall.

Also I have a question regarding dark cycles.  Are we talking pitch dark?  Or is a minimal amount of light ok?  For example the room I currently use has a window.  Does that need to be blacked out or is the metal shade enough?

Thanks,
C.H.


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InvisibleDr. Penguin
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Re: Using 6500K CFLs [Re: chucklehead]
    #180121 - 01/12/09 04:58 AM (7 years, 10 months ago)

Your setup needs a wee bit of tweaking before it will be fit to grow. I would ditch the bag-seed first off. They are never going to finish properly in that setting. If you want to have any sort of success using seeds, they will have to be autoflowering. The F1's you have may or not all autoflower, if they did, you wouldn't need to worry about the dark period so much, but since this is uncertain (F1 crosses can vary widely in genetic characteristics) you are better off insuring a 12 hour completely dark period. A total dark period is nessiasary as even a small bit of light from you momentarly switching the light on can cause stress which causes hermaphroditic tendancies among other things.

The problem you have with the spindly seedlings is because your light is too far away. Get those cfl's about 2 inches away from the tops of your plants at all times. You will definitely need to add supplemental lighting because the aerogarden alone will not be enough. As far as energy use is concerned, a general rule of thumb is you can run 1000w of light per bedroom your house has. You are well within this limit so you are better off using the cfl's to add even more light to your plants than to illuminate your house.

The size of that aerogarden is going to be a seriously limiting factor in your grow. I would highly doubt you could get even two plants in there without suffering loss of yield. If you let those plants get 1' tall before switching to flower, you will have three foot tall plants on your hands, much too much for the aerogarden. Plants stretch 2/3 of their final height during the first month of flower so you would most likely need to start 12/12 very early in their life cycle to keep them to a manageable height.

Keep us posted on your progress. Good luck! :thumbup:


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Offlinechucklehead
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Re: Using 6500K CFLs [Re: Dr. Penguin]
    #180136 - 01/12/09 08:58 AM (7 years, 10 months ago)

Thy will be done.  It's killin' time.

:bobafett:


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Offlinechucklehead
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Re: Using 6500K CFLs [Re: chucklehead]
    #181305 - 01/14/09 08:25 AM (7 years, 10 months ago)

Well I killed all the bag seeds and plopped two AK47x auto Blueberry F1 into the Aerogarden on 1/12/09.

They have started germinating.







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OfflineKaptKid Happy Birthday
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Re: Using 6500K CFLs [Re: chucklehead]
    #181307 - 01/14/09 08:38 AM (7 years, 10 months ago)

Looks like your off to an even better start. Good Luck


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OfflineSirius
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Re: Using 6500K CFLs (moved)
    #181373 - 01/14/09 02:46 PM (7 years, 10 months ago)

This thread was moved from Hydroponic & Agroponics.

Reason:
Going to move this on over to the Grow Journals forum for you, since you're documenting your whole grow. :smile:


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Offlinet0ad
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Re: Using 6500K CFLs [Re: KaptKid]
    #181727 - 01/14/09 08:10 PM (7 years, 10 months ago)

:this comment has been officially deleted:


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Offlinechucklehead
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Re: Using 6500K CFLs [Re: t0ad]
    #181851 - 01/14/09 10:41 PM (7 years, 10 months ago)





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Offlinechucklehead
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Re: Using 6500K CFLs [Re: chucklehead]
    #182640 - 01/15/09 10:34 PM (7 years, 10 months ago)

One of the two seedlings died.  :frown:
I think I had the FL light on top of it too close. 





I have added 3 6500K 26W CFLs.  Mean while removing the two FLs ( no idea the stats )



I added another seed today.  It's White Widow. 

I have 5 more 26W 6500K CFLs.  I'll add those as the plant grows beyond the height of the Aerogarden.  So total light comes out to roughly 16000 Lumen.  I hope that's enough for two plants.

If the spacing becomes tight I'll build a unit that will be similar to the Aerogarden.  A 1 gallon bucket with a lid and a bubbler should do the trick.  Plus I'll pick up some nutes.  It's a shame I didn't know what the Aerogarden was before I bought it.

The temps are going up with the extra lights.  I didn't think the CFLs would put out that much heat.  It's up to 83F under those lights.  For now I'm running 24/7 .  I think I'll switch them to 12 and 12 soon.


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Offlinechucklehead
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Re: Using 6500K CFLs [Re: chucklehead]
    #182656 - 01/15/09 11:12 PM (7 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

Your setup needs a wee bit of tweaking before it will be fit to grow. I would ditch the bag-seed first off. They are never going to finish properly in that setting. If you want to have any sort of success using seeds, they will have to be autoflowering. The F1's you have may or not all autoflower, if they did, you wouldn't need to worry about the dark period so much, but since this is uncertain (F1 crosses can vary widely in genetic characteristics) you are better off insuring a 12 hour completely dark period. A total dark period is nessiasary as even a small bit of light from you momentarly switching the light on can cause stress which causes hermaphroditic tendancies among other things.




I have a couple questions.  What does F1 mean?  I don't fear complicated answers.  So feel free to elaborate as much as you like.  I assure you that I'll enjoy it.

Is there a particular autoflowering strain that you would recommend for a setup such as mine?  Auto Blueberry looked good.

Dr. Chronic's description.
Quote:

Auto blueberry

Automatic Blueberry Seeds per pack : 10 Difficulty : 6/10 Type : Auto flowering indica hybrid Height : 10 – 14 inches Harvest : 10 weeks from seed Yield : 14 – 30g per plant Odour : 7/10 Ideal light regime : 20/4 from seed to harvest Ideal pot size : 5litres Environment : Indoors/Outdoors Methods : Can be grown close together, not suitable for direct ground planting Effect : Indica couch lock, medicinal, lung expanding Potency : 8/10 Everyone wants to grow Blueberry, just the name appeals to your senses. Think of Blueberry and you can almost taste it and smell it. Well I’m happy to tell you that if you grow our Auto Blueberry, your senses will be satisfied! Auto Blueberry is a cross of DJ Shorts Blueberry and the original Lowryder. A lot of growers have found normal Blueberry to be sensitive to over feeding and to not actually smell too fruity. We couldn’t fix both issues but I think we reached a good half way. Auto Blueberry is, unfortunately, still quite nutrient sensitive and as such, should be fed more lightly than other strains but on the plus side, we’ve managed to get her consistently smelling (and tasting) fruity. The difficulty rating of 6/10 is a reflection of her nutrient sensitivity and intolerance to root restriction, the growing medium should also never be allowed to get too dry or she will punish you with a severe lack of performance. If you start seeds in 5litre pots, feed lightly and never allow the medium to dry out, she will reward you with an extremely resinous and bulky main cola, medium branching with plenty of smaller, frosty nuggets and a truly delicious strong and fruity, berry-like aroma. An excellent hash making strain, her potency is amongst the best we have to offer.




Thanks!
C.H.

Time to  :bigblunt:  and go to bed.


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InvisibleDr. Penguin
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Re: Using 6500K CFLs [Re: chucklehead]
    #182750 - 01/16/09 02:17 AM (7 years, 10 months ago)

F1 means the first product of a cross between two inbred/stable seed lines. F1's have a quality known as hybrid vigor which makes them particularly useful in a yield sense (they grow faster than either inbred line) but they also mix genetics from the parent lines so their chanrictaristics may vary more wildly that other seed stock.

Now that I've explained F1's don't be afraid of them. They are the most useful kind of seed in my opinion. They are not nearly as variable genetically as F2's but they have hybrid vigor which is invaluable.

Personally I would never, ever touch an autoflowering strain. I think they are a waste of time and energy; you can find a quick finishing strain with minimal effort without resorting to a faulty AF gene. Autoflowering strains have their place though so if you cannot possibly ensure a 100% dark period, you will be stuck with them.


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Offlinechucklehead
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More Questions and exposing my ignorance. [Re: Dr. Penguin]
    #182814 - 01/16/09 09:08 AM (7 years, 10 months ago)

:frown:  Wow my outlook sounds bleak. :crymeariver:  I just don't think I can control the light that well yet.  :shrug:

What are the negative characteristics of the autoflowering plants?

Also what are the negative characteristics of a plant that gets stressed and goes herme? 


Thanks again for all of the information and advice.  You've saved me from wasting a lot of time.
:super:

:schoolgirl:  :tarareid:  :trishstratus:  :melyssaford:  :nursegellar:  :jennajameson:


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Invisiblecaptain.koons
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Re: Using 6500K CFLs [Re: chucklehead]
    #182824 - 01/16/09 09:53 AM (7 years, 10 months ago)

Quote:

chucklehead said:
So you're saying kill the bag seeds? 

I just read something that said 3000 lumens per square foot was a worthy goal.  So 6 26W 6500K CFLs will produce 9600 lumen.  I can't imagine more than the required light being a problem.  Plus that's only 156 Watts.  I wouldn't imagine that would make a noticeable difference in the power consumption such that the fuzz would even raise an eyebrow.

Also only one plant per square foot because crowding them causes plants to produce more stem and less bud.  Looks like 6 plants in the Aerogarden is out.  I wonder if I could get away with just two plants.  Maybe one on each side of the Aerogarden so long as I add the extra lights right away.  Supposedly those AK47x auto Blueberry F1 only get to be 18 Inches tall.  That could be just the ticket.  I could put them into flowering as soon as they hit 1 foot tall.

Also I have a question regarding dark cycles.  Are we talking pitch dark?  Or is a minimal amount of light ok?  For example the room I currently use has a window.  Does that need to be blacked out or is the metal shade enough?

Thanks,
C.H.




I've heard 8-10k lumens with cfls per sq ft is optimal. 6500k spectrum lights are also vegetative lights you want 2500-3200k for flowering.

Dark cycle = pitch black, no light leaks


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Re: Using 6500K CFLs [Re: captain.koons]
    #182937 - 01/16/09 02:18 PM (7 years, 10 months ago)

Autoflowering plants have two main disadvantages. They don't yield very well being the major one. The other is potency; now I haven't tried your lowryder x blueberry but my experience with lowryder in general is that its lacking.

The negatives of a herme plat is even easier, seeds. Nobody wants seeds in their weed. A stressed plant will also produce much less bud than a similar, unstressed, plant.

I'm glad to help!


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Offlinechucklehead
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Re: Using 6500K CFLs [Re: Dr. Penguin]
    #183291 - 01/17/09 12:08 AM (7 years, 10 months ago)

The Auto AK47xAuto Blueberry is doing well.



Well the White Widow hasn't popped.  I am beginning to wonder if the seed was damaged or something.  I'll try another one in a day or so if that one doesn't pop.

I'll be hanging two of these above the canopy... one day.  Total cost for the lights the plugs and the power strip was about $20.



Thanks for the tip on the light frequency.  I'll switch the bulbs out to lower Kelvin CFLs during flowering.

Good to know about the hermes and the autoflowering plants.  This is great stuff!  Thanks again.


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Invisiblecaptain.koons
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Re: Using 6500K CFLs [Re: chucklehead]
    #183296 - 01/17/09 12:23 AM (7 years, 10 months ago)

lowlife autoflowers are more potent than Lowryder#2 so you will likely be pleased. I've smoked some lowlife gear my friend grew and it was good stuff.

How big approx is the area over your aero garden?


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Offlinechucklehead
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Re: Using 6500K CFLs [Re: captain.koons]
    #184261 - 01/18/09 06:01 PM (7 years, 10 months ago)

I believe it's just short of a square foot. 

I figured I'd start some more plants in the aerogarden since the first white widow seed was a failure. :rolleyes:  I put another White Widow, a Super Silver Haze, and a Himalayan Gold in there to see if any of them germinated.  I did that two days ago.  So far nothing is sprouting.  I'll give them another couple days if they all just rot I'll post a warning about that particular vendor on the appropriate forum and in this thread.

  If they do grow I'll build some more bubble buckets once they reach roughly an inch and a half tall.  My plan is that I'll get a couple buckets and lids, air stones, some tube, a fish tank air pump, and another couple aerogarden herb kits (for the nutes).  I'll drill a hole in the lid that will let me suspend the little spongy thing.  I figured if the bucket is roughly one gallon and opaque, plus I only add 3 quarts of water and the nutes (same as the aerogarden), it's pretty much the same thing right?  The only thing is I have to monitor the water level and change/add nutes about the same time I do with the automated aerogarden that monitors the water and nute levels since I don't have a tool for accuracy in this task. 

If none of these work I'll drop in another Auto AK47xAuto Blueberry.



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Invisiblecaptain.koons
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Re: Using 6500K CFLs [Re: chucklehead]
    #184288 - 01/18/09 06:51 PM (7 years, 10 months ago)

I've never heard anything good about these aerogardens >.<

Goodluck!


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