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OfflineNeca
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Hexane, properly from start to finish (with photos if wanted)
    #761011 - 12/09/14 01:51 AM (2 years, 21 hours ago)

So I'm getting shit green bud (imagine the first "weed" you bought as a youngin) and making honey oil via hexane extraction, how many folks have experience with this?  I am currently working in a "3rd" world country and hexane and sub-par buds are plentiful (1 kilo for shit green for $200US AND I ONLY CAN GET THAT, no hash, no oil, just lots of shit ready for the taking) so that's no drama's and I can run multiple test different ways to dial it in but just started researching this process.  I've already made my extraction setup minus the fume hood and reclaim part to reuse hexane which will come in a few more trials plus my trip to the mainland.  but a question I have is how do you wash your hexane honey?  I normally double water boil off hexane till honey consistency and then do a water wash close to the end but does that remove all hexane as well?  I add enough water to fill a small jar (.5 ltr) full again after adding water volume (separates into an oil on top and water bottom mix).  I take a syringe minus the needle and suck out as much of the water as I can which is noticeably green from sucking up chlorophyll and then boil off any additional water at the end on a hot plate hoping that takes any free hexane with it.  Hexane boils lower than water right?, but does it also bond and stay with water?

So my question is, for you guys making hexane honey, is water enough to purge off any extra hexane/green material or do you still need to do the alcohol wash/freezing technique?  I've done two pulls with just a hexane wash, one was water washed after and came out as proper honey, the other was a different strain from the get go with no water wash and had a waxy/pudding consistency at the end that kept creating bubbles as it sat (hexane boil off I'm guessing).  Is that solely because one was water washed and one wasn't or was it the strain that made it waxy?  Biggest question is if water wash is good enough to get rid of all extra hexane and impurities or if there is another method that will give better results (alcohol/freezing)? 

With the shit green I get, I'm getting around 8-9ml product per 100 grams of blended green stuff (around a 1 cup and a half bud).  This sound right?

If anyone is interested I've been working on my "lab" and have made a pretty efficient process with different soak times/results that I can post if people want to see along with pictures of the final material (i'm an engineer and write/document everything). Hexane washing is that easy if you can get a on going supply so just wanted to feel you guys out because I can make pure strong oil versus kilos of shit grade green.  I tell them the hexane is for hull paint or thinners since I live in an industry area :smile:.

Attached is a pic of the two different pulls, the darker/pudding looking mixture is a 100g buds soaked for 30mins plus one additional hexane rinse to flush out oil (1lt hexane total) and no water wash.  The lighter looking honey pull was from a "hexane rinse" I did where the hexane was constantly flowing for 15min due to the fact I made a small exit hole at the bottom so flow was restricted.  So the green was always covered for 15 min (.75lt hexane pour), then waited for all hexane to drip out and followed with a .25ltr hexane flush and then water washed the results and came out with a "honey" product.

Let me know what you guys think, I can post pics from start to finish along with amounts used and times needed to reach end results.  Im also going to "water wash" half of my waxy pull to see if that removes any extra "contaminants" to result in a honey quality, so will update.

Just if any of you guys have experience, please save me some time with real world experience versus me reading 100's of retards post where they don't even show results let alone pull their head from their arse. 

Thanks brothers,
Neca


PS= for the attached photo of two pulls I did from similar local strains but one was water washed and one wasn't, so please give me any information possible as to how any of you doing this finish it off or how you got better results?  Ultimately, I am trying to make a med grade product in a country that is illegal but still has many patients in need.  So I need to make sure my way is safe before offering it to already sick people.  Marijuana is one hell of a healer.


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InvisibleMagashM
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Re: Hexane, properly from start to finish (with photos if wanted) (moved) [Re: Neca]
    #761019 - 12/09/14 03:55 AM (2 years, 19 hours ago)

This thread was moved from Marijuana Cultivation.

Reason:
Moved it to the proper forum. Nice write up.


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OfflineNeca
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Re: Hexane, properly from start to finish (with photos if wanted) (moved) [Re: Magash]
    #761021 - 12/09/14 05:17 AM (2 years, 17 hours ago)

Thanks Magash for moving it, man, I am ripped.  I have lived in this country for around 5 years and only got a tiny bit of hash probably 6 times the whole time and I just smoked some of that honey oil I made when I was posting that so I'm a space cadet right now for the first time in a long time.  I can't tell you how much better this is and it's that dang easy if you can get the hexane.  I'm all ramped up on this project so gonna post some pics soon of my setup and what i've learned so far.  I'm telling you, turns pure shit to pure gold and I'm kicking myself for just learning about it (i'll post pics of the normal quality green we get).  My end plan is to mix it with vg/pg so you can vape it and to make some simple small dose edibles (candies and the such) for easy medicating (all hexane, vg, pg is pharmcy grade and bought from local hospital supply stores no worries!).  Heaps of old/disabled people come here to retire but the local market in those city areas are really sketchy and if you are lucky you might find some tar like hash that has who knows what in it... and then still go to jail.  Mushrooms, drinking and underage hookers, no worries. a little bit of smoke, yep, we have your passport now pay the f up... and buy a hooker from us afterwards you cheap cunt haha.  Trippy world


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OfflineNeca
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Re: Hexane, properly from start to finish (with photos if wanted) (moved) [Re: Neca]
    #761022 - 12/09/14 06:20 AM (2 years, 16 hours ago)

Coda, man, I'd like to have a talk with you.  I read through your write up but i'm doing things a bit different.  Check out what I come up with and please give any insight you have.  You still making this regularly?  You ever try "bottling" to smoke it?  How about a water wash?


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Invisiblecaptain.koons
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Re: Hexane, properly from start to finish (with photos if wanted) (moved) [Re: Neca]
    #761053 - 12/09/14 12:55 PM (2 years, 10 hours ago)

Hexane isn't much different from other solvents but is a bit harder to get a quality product than butane.

However, Hexane is harder to purge vs butane so using a vacuum to lower the boiling point and making the oil as thin as possible to allow for purging is preferred. It's fine if you don't have a vacuum if you can do an ethanol wash after. Otherwise butane will get you a far more pure end product.


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Invisiblecaptain.koons
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Re: Hexane, properly from start to finish (with photos if wanted) (moved) [Re: captain.koons]
    #761054 - 12/09/14 01:02 PM (2 years, 9 hours ago)

What is a water wash? Hexane is completely insoluble in water so I don't know what you're trying to accomplish here.


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Offlinecheezymold
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Re: Hexane, properly from start to finish (with photos if wanted) (moved) [Re: captain.koons]
    #761136 - 12/09/14 10:28 PM (2 years, 28 minutes ago)

I honestly prefer acetone hash if it used a solvent or just some old fashion ice water hash.  The acetone should be much easier to get out without a vacuum and it tastes really clean after.  If you have access to hexane, you should be able to get acetone. 

Here is a good write-up

You want to make sure you remove the water from it(anhydrous acetone)before using it.  Just grind up some epsom salt, spread it on a baking sheet and roast it at 400F until all of it is powdery.  I put it into a mason jar with the acetone and shake it up and let it settle.  Then just take a turkey baster or something similar and take the clean liquid.  Note that you will need to do this every time because moisture is present in the air. 

Also, you want this stuff COLD.  Use dry ice.  You should be able to find it really cheap. If you are having a hard time finding it in that country, ask the next person you see operating an ice cream stand lol. I know that Vietnam and the Philippines both have outdoor vendors. I dry and freeze the buds too.  Basically you want everything as cold as possible.  If not, your end product will likely be green and have a little chlorophyll taste(which is still better than shitty butane oil taste IMO). 

I started using acetone to winterize BHO that I buy here.  Nobody seems to know how to clean their stuff up and still charge top dollar because it is so hard to get.  I like it better than ethenol since it is so easy to purge and I can touch the end product, which is something I can't seem to do with ethenol for some reason.

I'm no expert by any means but it suits me well.


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Invisiblecaptain.koons
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Re: Hexane, properly from start to finish (with photos if wanted) (moved) [Re: cheezymold]
    #761154 - 12/09/14 11:25 PM (1 year, 11 months ago)

Ethanol is as easy as it gets for purging. Part of the reason people use ethanol for a wash is because it evaporates so easily it also has a scrubbing action that will remove the small amounts of your prior solvent along with it cleaning your extract up.

Acetone is an aggressive solvent, much more so than ethanol so it's going to redissolve the lipids, wax, etc you're trying to remove in the winterization step which is what you don't want. Very poor choice.

It's a bit easier than hexane to purge but harder than butane. I wouldn't say it's a very poor choice for your main extraction but it's far from superior to butane. When using a vacuum to lower the boiling point it would be adequate.


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Offlinecheezymold
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Re: Hexane, properly from start to finish (with photos if wanted) (moved) [Re: captain.koons]
    #761174 - 12/10/14 02:23 AM (1 year, 11 months ago)

Yep.  Acetone will pull some waxes and such.  Has a little bit more of a full flavor although I doubt you can get a really clear oil with it. It has to be a very quick wash. I only winterize to get rid of the butane since nobody purges here.  Some people use ISO too but I cannot stand the taste from it.  I don't have a good place to blast butane anyways. 

Ive only had BHO that I like better than acetone twice.  These also cost $120 a gram.  I usually pass on it now because of the quality.  Mostly because people don't take the time to learn what the fuck they are doing.  The joys of living in the middle of the ocean lol.


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Invisiblecaptain.koons
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Re: Hexane, properly from start to finish (with photos if wanted) (moved) [Re: cheezymold]
    #761182 - 12/10/14 07:58 AM (1 year, 11 months ago)

You could get cheap 90-95% ethanol to winterize with if you set up a home still in your kitchen.

Here going rate is 70-80 a gram for BHO sometimes 100 when things are dry. I get ten packs from my broker for $350 or twenty packs for $600 it's made from bud and then I just winterize and purge and I end up with really quality product for cheap.

He's got a really good exchange rate trading commercial for some of the kushes, etc he gets too. :-0


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Invisiblecaptain.koons
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Re: Hexane, properly from start to finish (with photos if wanted) (moved) [Re: captain.koons]
    #761540 - 12/13/14 02:19 PM (1 year, 11 months ago)

to the op:

my understanding is you're using water to dissolve some of the contaminants then purging the hexane to get a cleaner product?

This works because the hexane and water don't mix together, but water is a very poor solvent. Try using ethanol in the freezer, strain with a coffee filter, and purge the hexane + ethanol mixture. You will get a better final product and your product will also contain less solvents as ethanol evaporates much better than hexane does. Ethanol also has a scrubbing effect when evaporated and carries away other solvents with it. Your yield will be less and even some of the cannabinoids you want will be lost but most of the yield loss will be from contaminants.


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InvisibleCOOKED101
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Re: Hexane, properly from start to finish (with photos if wanted) (moved) [Re: captain.koons]
    #761565 - 12/13/14 07:10 PM (1 year, 11 months ago)

Acetone hash.:thumbup:
Try a shorter contact time and have everything ice cold.


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Invisiblecaptain.koons
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Re: Hexane, properly from start to finish (with photos if wanted) (moved) [Re: COOKED101]
    #761572 - 12/13/14 09:25 PM (1 year, 11 months ago)

Are you talking about using it as your initial solvent or to winterize the extract?


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Offlinecheezymold
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Re: Hexane, properly from start to finish (with photos if wanted) (moved) [Re: COOKED101]
    #761575 - 12/13/14 09:44 PM (1 year, 11 months ago)

Aww yeah.  The runs I had looked similar too, although I have to say that the final product is usually a dark amber color and it is hard to get a good shot without the light.  Its very transparent and stable but a little darker than good BHO.  Ethanol is very difficult for me to obtain here unless I distil my own.  Not really down for doing that in my apartment so I'll have to wait lol.

Was just reading the OP and saw you were picking up a kilo at a time.  My setup only handles a little over a half ounce of plant at once so not good if you want to make a lot. 

Yo koons, about how much loss of yield do you lose on average from purging a 10 pack?  Purging other people's stuff in bulk is a pretty good idea.  Might be able to work a deal with my guy to let me get some product for a little labor until my grow finishes :smile:


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Offlinecheezymold
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Re: Hexane, properly from start to finish (with photos if wanted) (moved) [Re: cheezymold]
    #761577 - 12/13/14 09:56 PM (1 year, 11 months ago)

The acetone wash is from plant, but after having success with it I used it to winterize. I really don't mind the lipids and waxes, but having solvent still left in my smoke is not acceptable.  When the acetone is poured over the first time it runs right though and has a good product.  Second and third pulls come out dark green unless you use a pump to pull it through faster.  I just use a cheap hand pump.  Overall I only spent $59 on the equipment(it was $30 more because shipping rapes you here). 

I'm not saying that acetone hash is any better than BHO.  It is just the easiest way for me to get a decent quality product.  I live on a tiny rock in the middle of the ocean so accessing things that I cannot buy locally is either too expensive or not worth the hassle.


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OfflineNeca
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Re: Hexane, properly from start to finish (with photos if wanted) (moved) [Re: cheezymold]
    #761602 - 12/14/14 04:25 AM (1 year, 11 months ago)

Ok, lets get excited :smile:.  Sorry, I had to leave the island where I live to come to the main land to refit a fast boat and total travel time from our beach to the mainland took me about 2 days.  But it's all worth it :smile:

I just did a quick scan of replies and already have pics/process of my setup ready to go, so if I miss anything or anything doesn't get covered just let me know.  This was all first trail with just stuff I could find to make due on short notice so don't get all judgie on me, I live in the middle of no where. But I'll get a proper setup and then document it because I reckon I have a hell setup planned for whatever solvent you want to use to "wash" your green.

The one thing I will explain first is my water washing procedure and my theory behind it (in detail so a bit long).  Pretty much all of my knowledge comes from growing a bit, smoking a bit, or making veg cooking oil (not honey/oil like solvents get). So when I do my cooking oil normally I use coconut oil which has a low solid temp plus many other benefits (should look it up if you like edibles).  I try to keep my oil amount pretty low in the brew so what I do is add water with the oil until the green is all covered up.  This helps not only make a stronger concentration of cooking oil (2 cups oil + 3 cups water versus 5 cups oil kind of thing), but water also boils at 100 degrees C, so the max temp if you have enough water will never go over 100C but it will still extract all the good stuff fine into the cooking oil.  Plus 100C is lower then the temp needed to activate the good stuff in the green and acts as a buffer like a poor man's double boiler.  So at the end of the cooking time, I let it cool til around room temp, and then put it in a fridge or freezer to help quicken the separation process of water and oil til the oil naturally raises to the top and separates from the water, use a syringe/suction type object to suck most of the water out from underneath, and when there is only a little water left in the oil, I heat it until the bubbles (aka water) stop coming up at a controlled temp.

So how this relates to hexane (and other solvents I'm guessing) might be even better from what i've seen in the few things I've tried but maybe wiser minds can give me some input.  Hexane boils between 50-70C depending on a few things I've found out (type, quality, ext).  I'm using n-hexane (natural hexane) so either way it should be well under 100C especially if you get the water boiling for a bit depending on how much you use.  So my theory is that since water boils at 100c and hexane at a maximum of 70C, if I have adequate water and boiling time, all hexane should be removed and, to finish the process I did the same as usual with my cooking oil, pulled as much water as possible, and then did a controlled cook off of any additional water until the bubbles stopped.  But there could be something I'm missing and that's why I wanted to ask.

The second part, and why I think hexane/water wash is going to be the way I will go versus other solvents is that hexane is non-polar and so is THC and other cannibinoids from what I've read.  Water is polar  Non-polars work with non-polars, polars work with polars.  So with that being said, the hexane should only extract the good stuff (non-polar) with only trace amounts of other organic material(polar) during the actual "solvent wash".  And by following up with the water wash, water will pull out most remaining polar/organic material such as chlorophyll and waxes which have already been limited thanks to the non-polar hexane and leave you with a more pure product while also purging out the solvent. 

So if anyone has any experience or thoughts on water washing I'm all ears :smile:

Also, I weighed out the green (shit quality) to 100grams solid material and got around 9ml extract, do any of you guys have numbers that you've averaged with a hexane wash so we can compare?


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Offlinecheezymold
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Re: Hexane, properly from start to finish (with photos if wanted) (moved) [Re: Neca]
    #761604 - 12/14/14 05:08 AM (1 year, 11 months ago)

Sorry I don't have experience with hexane hash.  I would love to see your progress though so keep posting up those pics.  I remember reading an article that the original Rick Simpson oil was a hexane extract. Eventually I would like to get a vacuum pump so I can try it out. Plus I want to be able to make a different constancy than taffy from time to time.

More importantly, how do you like it?  Does it taste clean?  Your yields will be largely determined by the quality of your buds. I pulled about 4g an ounce with the acetone, which I was pretty satisfied with.  The bud quality here is about mid range and costs around $400 an O so I save about $100. Sounds like you are way in the positive on that aspect lol.


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Offlinepizzeria
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Re: Hexane, properly from start to finish (with photos if wanted) (moved) [Re: cheezymold]
    #761865 - 12/15/14 08:55 PM (1 year, 11 months ago)

Original poster ... As all have said this method sucks and their advice as to better methods are spot on (captain koons)..my observation is the grainy look texture is undesirable honestly I don't smoke iso hash and urs looks spot on with that...I'm more picky about smoking dank wax than i am about buds


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