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OfflineTribalSeed
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For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff??????
    #708874 - 01/20/14 11:30 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Ok, my first serious grow is going great and I am going to update my journal within the next few days, however I have ran into a bit of an irritating issue.
I use soil as my medium and everytime I water it is such a huge pain in the ass because of the water draining out of the pots. I went and got the plastic saucers and they are great, but they take up a lot of floor space and I still have to empty them after a bit when they are full of runoff water.
Long story short, its just a big pain in the arse.

What tricks do you soil guys use to help with that?
I thought about getting a hydro tray and setting up a slightly slanted table-like contraption with it and drill a hole in the lower side to allow the water to just drain out the hole and into a Rubbermaid or something like that so the water doesn't sit under the plants and cause any type of rot.

I dunno, just a thought of a how to make things abit easier on us stoners with the greenthumb.

Thanks for any tips and suggestions guys.

:baaaam:  <---------I love this.lol.


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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: TribalSeed]
    #708878 - 01/20/14 11:44 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Use containers without holes. I had the same problem and eventually said "screw it, no holes". 5 gal. buckets without drainage works like a charm.


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“Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.” -Dr. Seuss


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OfflineTribalSeed
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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: DrGreenThumb] * 1
    #708879 - 01/21/14 12:09 AM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

DrGreenThumb said:
Use containers without holes. I had the same problem and eventually said "screw it, no holes". 5 gal. buckets without drainage works like a charm.



Really? What about root rot? Isnt that a worry?


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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: TribalSeed]
    #708903 - 01/21/14 02:27 AM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Root rot was a worry at first, but turns out, it's not an issue. The trick is in the transplant.

When you take your clones or seedlings out of the starting cup they need to have a real good root zone, almost root-bound by some people's standards. When you transplant, use moistened soil so you don't need to add water after transplanting.

The next day, water just the area of the original container with a watering can. The idea is to keep the plant thriving while the roots stretch through the new bucket. Do this for about 3-5 days.

You will notice that the bucket gets lighter by the day and the surface of the soil getting dry and crusty, this is good. You will eventually  a feel for when it's light and needs it first real watering.

For the first real watering use an entire 1 gallon jug of nutrient water. Pour gently but fast and try not to disturb the soil surface, it happens though.

After this you're in the clear, when the bucket gets light again, give another full gallon. Eventually the surface will harden as the roots circle to the top and watering becomes a breeze, as you can just pour it right in. Makes a tedious job quite easy.

Once the roots fill the bucket, they start using water really quick. Just make sure the bucket is light when you water. They go from watered  to dry so quickly that the roots are unaffected.

While it's true that irrigation runoff contains an average of 10% more "salt" than the original irrigation water, the amount that builds up over the 3-4 month life span of a plant is so insignificant that it won't affect your plants.

I had no way to drain runoff personally, so I eliminated it. Now I know that everything that goes in my jugs, goes in the plants and you're not washing money down the drain.


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“Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.” -Dr. Seuss


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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: DrGreenThumb]
    #708908 - 01/21/14 06:49 AM (5 years, 4 months ago)

I just take a big Rubbermaid tub, place an oven grate over it, and sit the plants on that while I water. :shrug:


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OfflineTribalSeed
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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: DrGreenThumb]
    #709051 - 01/21/14 11:07 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

DrGreenThumb said:
Root rot was a worry at first, but turns out, it's not an issue. The trick is in the transplant.

When you take your clones or seedlings out of the starting cup they need to have a real good root zone, almost root-bound by some people's standards. When you transplant, use moistened soil so you don't need to add water after transplanting.

The next day, water just the area of the original container with a watering can. The idea is to keep the plant thriving while the roots stretch through the new bucket. Do this for about 3-5 days.

You will notice that the bucket gets lighter by the day and the surface of the soil getting dry and crusty, this is good. You will eventually  a feel for when it's light and needs it first real watering.

For the first real watering use an entire 1 gallon jug of nutrient water. Pour gently but fast and try not to disturb the soil surface, it happens though.

After this you're in the clear, when the bucket gets light again, give another full gallon. Eventually the surface will harden as the roots circle to the top and watering becomes a breeze, as you can just pour it right in. Makes a tedious job quite easy.

Once the roots fill the bucket, they start using water really quick. Just make sure the bucket is light when you water. They go from watered  to dry so quickly that the roots are unaffected.

While it's true that irrigation runoff contains an average of 10% more "salt" than the original irrigation water, the amount that builds up over the 3-4 month life span of a plant is so insignificant that it won't affect your plants.

I had no way to drain runoff personally, so I eliminated it. Now I know that everything that goes in my jugs, goes in the plants and you're not washing money down the drain.



I see how this would really work. I just didn't know if it was an issue or not.
My question to this explanation though is what about mother plants? Since they go way past the 3-4 month mark most times, would you want to keep mothers in a pot with holes for runoff?

The Rubbermaid idea is a decent idea, but it still takes the time for them to drain. I got 3 kids brother, lol, I don't ger a whole lot of "me" time with the plants.lol. However this would definitely cut down on mess and travel with the plants. (i.e. taking them back and forth to the bathroom.lol)


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InvisibleMagashM
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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: TribalSeed] * 3
    #709060 - 01/22/14 12:05 AM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Ok, keep the plastic saucers and water less. There is no need to empty the saucers. You can't empty the pot if you plug the holes right? What you can't do is flush. What if you overfeed the plants? you're putting yourself in a position that you can't flush the plants to save them. You also can't flush before harvest. This really isn't something that should be done when you're new to growing.


:happyweed:


--------------------
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OfflineTribalSeed
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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: Magash]
    #709063 - 01/22/14 12:57 AM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Magash said:
Ok, keep the plastic saucers and water less. There is no need to empty the saucers. You can't empty the pot if you plug the holes right? What you can't do is flush. What if you overfeed the plants? you're putting yourself in a position that you can't flush the plants to save them. You also can't flush before harvest. This really isn't something that should be done when you're new to growing.


:happyweed:



Before I read your last sentence I thought to myself that a person with a lot of experience wouldn't run into this problem as often. I agree someone like me definitely wouldn't want to try this. Also you bring up the point of flushing, what do you do for the final flush at least, DrGreenThumb?

I would definitely think you would want to flush out the chemicals/ferts so you would have a decent tasting bud, right?

Mag: You say water less, what about the water till you have some runoff rule? Would the water that sits in the saucer cause any sort of problems? Rot? Fungi or pests? Or is it not enough to really matter?

I thank you guys for all the responses!

:baaaam:


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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: TribalSeed]
    #709077 - 01/22/14 03:06 AM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Well first I wasn't saying Dr. Greenthumb was wrong I was just saying it's not gonna be easy for somebody new. I'm sure he stops feeding at a certain point a few weeks before harvest and just waters with plain water for a few weeks. Myself that is what I do with soil drainage holes or not.


Quote:

what about the water till you have some runoff rule?




Yeah you can do that in two ways. Just water till you get the runoff. You can give a half a watering and let it sit for a few minutes so the water absorbs then finish watering a few minutes later. You will still get runoff but less of it.
Myself I just do it the first way when I was in soil.

:happyweed:


--------------------
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Offlinebudgrowerwannabe
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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: Magash]
    #709097 - 01/22/14 07:29 AM (5 years, 4 months ago)

I like the second way. I think it gives the soil time to really get wet. I grow in bags and if I just water till run off it just runs out the easiest way. When I go to put it back it would be way to light. Meaning not watered enough. So I now water a little at a time till I see run off. I catch the first couple drops of run off to see the Ph of my soil.

Im like Res. I water over a Rubbermaid with a bread grate:thumbup: works great.  I start watering. Roll a joint. Then I check them give them more water! Now I sit back smoke the jammer!!  By that time I can put them back  under the lights but I still use the plastic trays:wellidunno: lol









In this pic I built a table with a drain like you were talking about so I didn't have to move them. It works but I still move my plants to the tub to get watered. The table would just let all the extra water run into a bucket.:bigjoint:


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InvisibleMagashM
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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: budgrowerwannabe]
    #709114 - 01/22/14 11:28 AM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

budgrowerwannabe said:
I like the second way. I think it gives the soil time to really get wet. I grow in bags and if I just water till run off it just runs out the easiest way. When I go to put it back it would be way to light. Meaning not watered enough. So I now water a little at a time till I see run off. I catch the first couple drops of run off to see the Ph of my soil.

Im like Res. I water over a Rubbermaid with a bread grate:thumbup: works great.  I start watering. Roll a joint. Then I check them give them more water! Now I sit back smoke the jammer!!  By that time I can put them back  under the lights but I still use the plastic trays:wellidunno: lol









In this pic I built a table with a drain like you were talking about so I didn't have to move them. It works but I still move my plants to the tub to get watered. The table would just let all the extra water run into a bucket.:bigjoint:





Oh I fully agree with you the second way is better but when you have several gardens of this (these are in bags like yours)

your talking about hours of work so I'd just go the first way and let excess water soak in from the bottom but like I said the second way is better.


:happyweed:


--------------------
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Offlinebudgrowerwannabe
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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: Magash]
    #709197 - 01/22/14 03:09 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

When I saw your pic a while back I noticed they were bags too . They work good . As I can see LoL

Don't know how many are there but you are right there is a lot of hours watering .


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InvisibleMagashM
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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: budgrowerwannabe]
    #709204 - 01/22/14 03:28 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

In those pics it was 4 per sq ft. 64 under each 1000watter.


:happyweed:


--------------------
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Offlinebudgrowerwannabe
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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: Magash]
    #709210 - 01/22/14 03:40 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

:bigjoint: There nice as hell .what strain are those monsters?










I can only flower about 16 in I gal. bags in  my tent. If I want to go bigger im going to have to figure something out.


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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: Magash] * 1
    #709216 - 01/22/14 04:44 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Magash makes a very good point as it does limit you to an extent. If you happen to overfeed (which I have done), then your only option is to give them plain water until the issue corrects itself. It usually takes no more than 2 waterings to correct itself, unless you really poisoned it.

As far as flushing them before harvest, Magash nailed that one also. He was half the inspiration for the flush test I conducted, along with a patient who claimed that he LOVED how thoroughly my plants were flushed and he could easily tell the difference between mine and others.

Normally I do just as Magash stated, plain water for the last 2 weeks before harvest. The flushing with 2X the volume of water is super overrated. So anyway, I took 2 identical looking plants (both clones from the same mom) not far from harvest and fed 1 plain water like normal. The other I marked and kept feeding for the rest of it's life. Both were harvested, dried, cured and put side-by-side in a blind taste test with 5 different people. 3 out of 5 picked the one that got fed until the end. I actually preferred the fed plant myself. There was no difference in the way it burned but the fed one seemed to have a fuller flavor in my opinion.

Does this mean I should keep feeding until harvest? Hell no, I don't see where it makes a significant difference, except you save money and time feeding plain water for the last 2 weeks. During the end of a plants life cycle they naturally shut off the nutrients it doesn't need anymore, regardless of what you put in the soil. It works the same for all plants, weed isn't special.

After reading The organic myth. by Magash, it got me on a crusade to debunk a lot of well ingrained growing practices. Having a network of fellow growers helps, as it's easy to recruit their resources also. The myths run deep folks; nutrients, light leaks, stresses of all kinds, water quality, temps, flushing, all kinds of garbage out there. It's no wonder new growers get overwhelmed and frustrated and as a result their plants suffer.

Back to the topic, if you have time to wait for your plants to drink it up then gradually watering to full capacity is your best bet. I do this with my clones. The clone cups NEED drainage holes so they go in a baking dish and get watered a few times and left in there until they get heavy. But it's time consuming.

Watering a flowering 5 gal. bucket gradually or lifting it up to put in a Rubbermaid is impossible later in flowering as I'd end up with broken  branches and falling buds. Not to mention the time involved. I came up with this method out of necessity to save time watering. It's so easy to just mix a jug and be able to pour in as fast as you can and walk away. When you go larger and start getting overwhelmed by the plants keep this in mind. Personally, if I could drain the floor I'd use holes.


--------------------
“Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.” -Dr. Seuss


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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: DrGreenThumb]
    #709231 - 01/22/14 07:18 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Hey Dr GreenThumb when you did this

Quote:

After reading The organic myth. by Magash, it got me on a crusade to debunk a lot of well ingrained growing practices.




Weren't you amazed by the amount of bullshit that is out-there and thought of as the right way to do things?

I could write a book just on the bullshit alone. :facepalm:


:happyweed:


--------------------
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:growingweed: Join us at the Growery! :growingweed:


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OfflineTribalSeed
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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: Magash]
    #709235 - 01/22/14 07:51 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Damn, thanks for the read guys. You are right Greenthumb, it is extremely frustrating reading thru shit and most of it contradicting the last thing you read. Thanks again guys!


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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: DrGreenThumb] * 1
    #709268 - 01/23/14 03:47 AM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Watering a flowering 5 gal. bucket gradually or lifting it up to put in a Rubbermaid is impossible later in flowering as I'd end up with broken branches and falling buds. Not to mention the time involved. I came up with this method out of necessity to save time watering. It's so easy to just mix a jug and be able to pour in as fast as you can and walk away. When you go larger and start getting overwhelmed by the plants keep this in mind. Personally, if I could drain the floor I'd use holes.




This right here is one of the biggest reasons I do hydro rather than soil. In a room that's packed wall-to-wall with flowering plants, you can't always reach everything. In hydro, everything always gets watered (provided no pump or controller failures) perfectly evenly and you have complete control of the entire system from one point (the main rez).


--------------------
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OfflineTribalSeed
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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: Tank333]
    #709503 - 01/23/14 08:33 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Tank333 said:
Quote:

Watering a flowering 5 gal. bucket gradually or lifting it up to put in a Rubbermaid is impossible later in flowering as I'd end up with broken branches and falling buds. Not to mention the time involved. I came up with this method out of necessity to save time watering. It's so easy to just mix a jug and be able to pour in as fast as you can and walk away. When you go larger and start getting overwhelmed by the plants keep this in mind. Personally, if I could drain the floor I'd use holes.




This right here is one of the biggest reasons I do hydro rather than soil. In a room that's packed wall-to-wall with flowering plants, you can't always reach everything. In hydro, everything always gets watered (provided no pump or controller failures) perfectly evenly and you have complete control of the entire system from one point (the main rez).



That's what is making hydro really attractive to me, but I am still a n00b to the growing experience so I went for soil because of the forgiveness that soil gives. I thought about doing a little Rubbermaid 4 or 6 site hydro setup just to get a feel for it and see if its the route I want to take later on, but for now I gotta stick with the dirt.lol.


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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: TribalSeed]
    #709548 - 01/24/14 12:02 AM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

TribalSeed said:
Quote:

Tank333 said:
Quote:

Watering a flowering 5 gal. bucket gradually or lifting it up to put in a Rubbermaid is impossible later in flowering as I'd end up with broken branches and falling buds. Not to mention the time involved. I came up with this method out of necessity to save time watering. It's so easy to just mix a jug and be able to pour in as fast as you can and walk away. When you go larger and start getting overwhelmed by the plants keep this in mind. Personally, if I could drain the floor I'd use holes.




This right here is one of the biggest reasons I do hydro rather than soil. In a room that's packed wall-to-wall with flowering plants, you can't always reach everything. In hydro, everything always gets watered (provided no pump or controller failures) perfectly evenly and you have complete control of the entire system from one point (the main rez).



That's what is making hydro really attractive to me, but I am still a n00b to the growing experience so I went for soil because of the forgiveness that soil gives. I thought about doing a little Rubbermaid 4 or 6 site hydro setup just to get a feel for it and see if its the route I want to take later on, but for now I gotta stick with the dirt.lol.




It's a myth that beginners shouldn't do hydro.

Remember with hydro there is complete control. Find a problem and it's taken care of in minutes rather then flushing the shit out of a bunch of soil pots. Watering, ph control, nutrient strength to the plants, all easier to do with hydro. Last as long as everything is on timers and dialed in you can leave for days without needing a person to check the plants. :wink:


:wink:


--------------------
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:growingweed: Join us at the Growery! :growingweed:


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OfflineTribalSeed
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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: Magash]
    #709552 - 01/24/14 12:18 AM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Magash said:
Quote:

TribalSeed said:
Quote:

Tank333 said:
Quote:

Watering a flowering 5 gal. bucket gradually or lifting it up to put in a Rubbermaid is impossible later in flowering as I'd end up with broken branches and falling buds. Not to mention the time involved. I came up with this method out of necessity to save time watering. It's so easy to just mix a jug and be able to pour in as fast as you can and walk away. When you go larger and start getting overwhelmed by the plants keep this in mind. Personally, if I could drain the floor I'd use holes.




This right here is one of the biggest reasons I do hydro rather than soil. In a room that's packed wall-to-wall with flowering plants, you can't always reach everything. In hydro, everything always gets watered (provided no pump or controller failures) perfectly evenly and you have complete control of the entire system from one point (the main rez).



That's what is making hydro really attractive to me, but I am still a n00b to the growing experience so I went for soil because of the forgiveness that soil gives. I thought about doing a little Rubbermaid 4 or 6 site hydro setup just to get a feel for it and see if its the route I want to take later on, but for now I gotta stick with the dirt.lol.




It's a myth that beginners shouldn't do hydro.

Remember with hydro there is complete control. Find a problem and it's taken care of in minutes rather then flushing the shit out of a bunch of soil pots. Watering, ph control, nutrient strength to the plants, all easier to do with hydro. Last as long as everything is on timers and dialed in you can leave for days without needing a person to check the plants. :wink:


:wink:



That sounds really attractive. Me and my wife are celebrating our 8th anniversary this April 20th (yeah we got married on 4/20 on purpose.lol) and we were wanting to go out of town for about a week, but have been thinking about calling it off since we don't have a "caretaker". We could keep something going if we learned some hydro techniques.


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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: Magash]
    #709553 - 01/24/14 12:19 AM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Magash said:
Quote:

TribalSeed said:
Quote:

Tank333 said:
Quote:

Watering a flowering 5 gal. bucket gradually or lifting it up to put in a Rubbermaid is impossible later in flowering as I'd end up with broken branches and falling buds. Not to mention the time involved. I came up with this method out of necessity to save time watering. It's so easy to just mix a jug and be able to pour in as fast as you can and walk away. When you go larger and start getting overwhelmed by the plants keep this in mind. Personally, if I could drain the floor I'd use holes.




This right here is one of the biggest reasons I do hydro rather than soil. In a room that's packed wall-to-wall with flowering plants, you can't always reach everything. In hydro, everything always gets watered (provided no pump or controller failures) perfectly evenly and you have complete control of the entire system from one point (the main rez).



That's what is making hydro really attractive to me, but I am still a n00b to the growing experience so I went for soil because of the forgiveness that soil gives. I thought about doing a little Rubbermaid 4 or 6 site hydro setup just to get a feel for it and see if its the route I want to take later on, but for now I gotta stick with the dirt.lol.




It's a myth that beginners shouldn't do hydro.

Remember with hydro there is complete control. Find a problem and it's taken care of in minutes rather then flushing the shit out of a bunch of soil pots. Watering, ph control, nutrient strength to the plants, all easier to do with hydro. Last as long as everything is on timers and dialed in you can leave for days without needing a person to check the plants. :wink:

:wink:





Magash, you totally just explained my favorite reason why I love hydro. I like having that complete control... Maybe it's some sort of "god complex", I feel I have to be the one who determines how well they live or die... lol

So why do you do soil instead of hydro, Magash?

And yea, I can usually go three our four days without checking if need be. They grow better when I'm adjusting the PH on a daily basis though... Gotta get that good swing from low to high to get all the right nutes to uptake.


--------------------
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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: Tank333] * 1
    #709561 - 01/24/14 12:43 AM (5 years, 4 months ago)

I shop-vac my drip trays then dump it outside.


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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: Tank333]
    #709578 - 01/24/14 05:59 AM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:


So why do you do soil instead of hydro, Magash?




What? I stopped using soil back in 2008. I've always gone back and fourth but my main gardens are hydro. I use the Multi-Flow system in all of them.




Then back in the day there was this system. Wood, plastic liner, dixie cups filled with lava rock that you use in front yards.



Hydro or soil I love growing both ways but if I had to choose one hydro all the way.


:happyweed:


--------------------
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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: Magash]
    #709601 - 01/24/14 11:56 AM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Im looking for EASY hydro/Aro set up..... Shit i can build at home (Im pretty handy)... any links or tips ?


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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: P-O]
    #709618 - 01/24/14 01:12 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

P-O said:
Im looking for EASY hydro/Aro set up..... Shit i can build at home (Im pretty handy)... any links or tips ?




Dude, I would make yourself a DIY RDWC. Go to Lowes or Home DePot and get a large Yellow lidded Tuff box. They're like $12 each. You can put two sites on each. For the growsites, take a 5-gallon bucket and cut off the bottom 8" or so. Put two of these on each lid (just cut out a hole for each one and the bucket's ribbing holds it on top of the lid), and you have an easy universal top for your setup. You can tie multiples of these bins together with 1" bulkheads and black tubing to make a large system, or just use two in a 4x4 tent. You'll need a headbucket and a good-sized pump, but they're a really good system... Let me see if I can find the tek I'm gonna be using to build one in another month or so...


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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: othyem]
    #709628 - 01/24/14 01:46 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

othyem said:
I shop-vac my drip trays then dump it outside.



I thought about buying a little shopvac and going that route. I honestly love the time I get with the plants. I feel guilty at times though because sometimes I am in the garden for like 3 to 4 hours while the kids are up and playing. If I stay up late then it doesn't matter cause they are all asleep, but damn it sucks waking up at 7am the next morning doing the whole routine.lol.

The hydro thing has kinda scared me because of the monetary needs of a hydro garden. Guys at the grow shop show me meters and shit that are like 2 to 3 hundred bucks. Also I am colorblind so I have to have my wife read the GenHydro PH tester we got. I have a digital one on the way that I ordered to help out with the PH so I don't have to ask her every time I water.lol.

Is hydro a more expensive route of growing? I know you gotta keep buying bags of soil if you go with dirt. Or is the hydro thing a one time expense and then your good? I think I am making this all harder than it needs to be, but I want the most cost effective way and I can't play with my money ya know. lol. I'm sure you guys cant either.
I guess I will never know unless I just buy/build one and try it out.
:shrug:


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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: TribalSeed] * 1
    #709641 - 01/24/14 02:04 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)






http://www.hydroponicsonline.com/


if you want to be a killer soil grower you need the same meters as hydro. Nutrient strength and ph are just as important.

:happyweed:


--------------------
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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: Magash]
    #709711 - 01/24/14 05:40 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

That's fucking slick, Magash! What do you use on top of the 2-liter bottles? Will a 3" net pot sit on there well?


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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: Tank333]
    #709728 - 01/24/14 07:23 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Tank333 said:
That's fucking slick, Magash! What do you use on top of the 2-liter bottles? Will a 3" net pot sit on there well?




When I made it I used it as a flood and drain. I filled the bottles with geolite. I put a little piece of screen in the bottom of the bottles to keep the roots from plugging them but it was never a issue. I don't think the screen was needed.


:happyweed:


--------------------
All creatures tremble when faced with violence. All creatures fear death, all love life. If we can only see ourselves in others, then how could we possibly hurt another creature?


:growingweed: Join us at the Growery! :growingweed:


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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: Magash]
    #709784 - 01/25/14 12:26 AM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Magash said:





http://www.hydroponicsonline.com/


if you want to be a killer soil grower you need the same meters as hydro. Nutrient strength and ph are just as important.

:happyweed:



Dude Thank you so much Mag! That's just killer. For real. I've already got a PPM meter. Would that be about like a EC meter or would I wanna invest in a solid EC meter?


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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: TribalSeed]
    #709792 - 01/25/14 01:35 AM (5 years, 4 months ago)

If you already have a PPM, there's no need for EC


--------------------
Dude she isn't as young as she use to be.

-niteowl


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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: Magash]
    #709859 - 01/25/14 07:08 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Magash said:
Hey Dr GreenThumb when you did this

Quote:

After reading The organic myth. by Magash, it got me on a crusade to debunk a lot of well ingrained growing practices.




Weren't you amazed by the amount of bullshit that is out-there and thought of as the right way to do things?

I could write a book just on the bullshit alone. :facepalm:





I can go on for days about all the false ideas, methods and sales gimmicks surrounding and permeating our profession. I often do and it drives my girl nuts.

Once I got my previous boss growing herb he taught me a vast amount of info about growing in general. This guy grows more of a variety of plants every year than I could even list.

The most important thing was that weed isn't "special" as many growers (but mostly grow stores) would like you to believe. It's a plant, just like any and many others, that have certain needs (water, light and food). And quantity and quality go hand in hand given all other factors are the same.


--------------------
“Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.” -Dr. Seuss


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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: DrGreenThumb]
    #709861 - 01/25/14 07:19 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Sure, they're just plants like any other plants.  But the nutrient lines that are out there, ARE developed specifically for MJ needs.  Different plants have different needs.  A fern can't survive in a desert, and a cactus can't survive in a rain forest. 

So designing nutrients solely for MJ is necessary, when you are wanting to get amazing results.  Just throwing it in soil and giving it light and water and "food" isnt sufficient.  Tailoring the products to MJ's specific needs is quite beneficial.


--------------------
Dude she isn't as young as she use to be.

-niteowl


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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: Hawksresurrection]
    #709863 - 01/25/14 07:25 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

hawksapprentice said:
If you already have a PPM, there's no need for EC



Right on, just wasn't sure if EC reads something different than PPM.
Blonde moment.lol.

What are some of the gimmicks that's been oversold?
I am one of those guys that goes in and listens to grow shop guys because they seem pretty down to earth. However I catch them trying to sell me shit even I know I don't need.
Just curious as to what is bull and what is for real.


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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: TribalSeed]
    #709864 - 01/25/14 07:28 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Funny thing. I had a grower from around my area tell me to put regular grain sugar in my water when I water and it will sweeten the taste of my plants. I know guys use molasses sometimes, but I highly doubt regular kitchen sugar will have the same effect.lol.


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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: TribalSeed]
    #709865 - 01/25/14 07:32 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Gravity was one of the big ones that I remember, it never did shit and has horrible ingredients.  I pretty much think anything from Humboldt, at least the additives, is a joke an not worth the money. 

I know they cut the strength of Karma down, but I still like that supplement. 


Budswell was another joke of a product they tried to turn me onto.  It's just a watered down bat guano tea basically.  You're better off just using regular bat guano, and making your own teas.

The "flavored" sweet additives I also think are a big fucking joke.  There's no way adding a "flavor" to the root system is going to have an effect on the flavor of the bud.


--------------------
Dude she isn't as young as she use to be.

-niteowl


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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: TribalSeed]
    #709866 - 01/25/14 07:34 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

TribalSeed said:
Funny thing. I had a grower from around my area tell me to put regular grain sugar in my water when I water and it will sweeten the taste of my plants. I know guys use molasses sometimes, but I highly doubt regular kitchen sugar will have the same effect.lol.





Adding raw carbohydrates isn't to sweeten the flavor.  It's to help bulk the plant up.  Carbs are a base building block for plants.


--------------------
Dude she isn't as young as she use to be.

-niteowl


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OfflineTribalSeed
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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: Hawksresurrection]
    #709868 - 01/25/14 07:44 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

hawksapprentice said:
Quote:

TribalSeed said:
Funny thing. I had a grower from around my area tell me to put regular grain sugar in my water when I water and it will sweeten the taste of my plants. I know guys use molasses sometimes, but I highly doubt regular kitchen sugar will have the same effect.lol.





Adding raw carbohydrates isn't to sweeten the flavor.  It's to help bulk the plant up.  Carbs are a base building block for plants.



He meant in the way of the taste of the buds. Anything that's vegan or whatever I just kind of ignore. The grow shop guys recommended FloraBlend to me and said it was like steroids for plants. Huge pile of BS. Its ok stuff, but I don't see anything different it does for the plants that the main nutes don't already do.

When you're saying carbs, that's like the blackstrap molasses right? Grandma Eggys I think right?


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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: TribalSeed]
    #709873 - 01/25/14 09:11 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Budswell was another joke of a product they tried to turn me onto.





I remember that crap I think it's still around. They had a powdered version that was just as much of a ripoff. Mostly dirt with some earthworm castings and almost no guano at all. There was a vegetative version called super tea mix also.

:happyweed:


--------------------
All creatures tremble when faced with violence. All creatures fear death, all love life. If we can only see ourselves in others, then how could we possibly hurt another creature?


:growingweed: Join us at the Growery! :growingweed:


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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: Magash]
    #709897 - 01/25/14 11:27 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

TribalSeed said:
Quote:

hawksapprentice said:
Quote:

TribalSeed said:
Funny thing. I had a grower from around my area tell me to put regular grain sugar in my water when I water and it will sweeten the taste of my plants. I know guys use molasses sometimes, but I highly doubt regular kitchen sugar will have the same effect.lol.





Adding raw carbohydrates isn't to sweeten the flavor.  It's to help bulk the plant up.  Carbs are a base building block for plants.



He meant in the way of the taste of the buds. Anything that's vegan or whatever I just kind of ignore. The grow shop guys recommended FloraBlend to me and said it was like steroids for plants. Huge pile of BS. Its ok stuff, but I don't see anything different it does for the plants that the main nutes don't already do.

When you're saying carbs, that's like the blackstrap molasses right? Grandma Eggys I think right?





I know what he was saying, Products like sweet try and play on the same idea.  And straight sugar like he was talking about is just simple carbohydrates.  I answered with full understanding of what he was getting across.

Quote:

Magash said:
Quote:

Budswell was another joke of a product they tried to turn me onto.





I remember that crap I think it's still around. They had a powdered version that was just as much of a ripoff. Mostly dirt with some earthworm castings and almost no guano at all. There was a vegetative version called super tea mix also.

:happyweed:





Yeah, pure shit.  The owner of the grow shop was trying to tell me that it would just make your plants stink to high heaven.  What a load of bullshit.


--------------------
Dude she isn't as young as she use to be.

-niteowl


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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: Hawksresurrection]
    #709907 - 01/26/14 12:36 AM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Damn maybe he wasn't crazy, lol. Thanks for clearing that up for me Hawk! So straight sugar is a decent idea?


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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: TribalSeed] * 3
    #709908 - 01/26/14 12:38 AM (5 years, 4 months ago)

No it's not.  Black Strap Molasses is a good idea.


--------------------
Dude she isn't as young as she use to be.

-niteowl


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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: Hawksresurrection]
    #709911 - 01/26/14 01:28 AM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

hawksapprentice said:
No it's not.  Black Strap Molasses is a good idea.



Cool thanks for the tip Hawk!
Why so sad today? lol.
Got a few fans on the site it seems.


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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: TribalSeed]
    #709912 - 01/26/14 01:34 AM (5 years, 4 months ago)

What do you mean man?


--------------------
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-niteowl


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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: Hawksresurrection]
    #709916 - 01/26/14 05:18 AM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Why so sad today?




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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: P-O]
    #709918 - 01/26/14 06:59 AM (5 years, 4 months ago)

I said what do you mean :kingcrankey:


--------------------
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-niteowl


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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: Hawksresurrection]
    #709970 - 01/26/14 10:08 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

hawksapprentice said:
I said what do you mean :kingcrankey:



Sheesh Nothing Cranky.lol.
That's why you're cool.

As Mag says. JOKE! . lol.

We love you hawk. Group HUG!!!!


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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: TribalSeed]
    #709973 - 01/26/14 10:42 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

NEVER :megacrankey:

I don't like stinky hippies :loldongs:


--------------------
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-niteowl


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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: Hawksresurrection]
    #709976 - 01/26/14 11:07 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

hawksapprentice said:
NEVER :megacrankey:

I don't like stinky hippies :loldongs:



Man I ain't stinky I had a shower like....wait....what's today? Sunday, right? Well I had a shower on sunday, but it wasn't today.

:baaaam:

lol


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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: TribalSeed]
    #710524 - 01/30/14 12:49 AM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

TribalSeed said:
Quote:

hawksapprentice said:
No it's not.  Black Strap Molasses is a good idea.



Cool thanks for the tip Hawk!
Why so sad today? lol.
Got a few fans on the site it seems.





Hawk is right. Black Strap Molasses is great because it contains a bunch of magnesium, potassium, phosphorus and occasionally sulfur along with a few other minerals that plants often lack. The carbs are important, but not the only selling point for molasses over plain sugar.


--------------------


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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: Harry_Ba11sach]
    #710552 - 01/30/14 02:43 AM (5 years, 4 months ago)

How well does molasses work in hydro? I want to stop buying that expensive ass sweetener that comes in the lineup and work with something a little more basic...


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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: Tank333]
    #710564 - 01/30/14 10:08 AM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Depends on the hydro setup, but I would be very cautious.


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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: Harry_Ba11sach]
    #710567 - 01/30/14 10:47 AM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Why's that?


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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: Tank333]
    #710605 - 01/30/14 02:06 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Well cannabis isn't the only thing that loves sugar. Bacteria and fungi will eat the shit out of it and multiply like mad cunts (and possibly produce harmful byproducts like ethanol in the process), so if your setup has sprayers of any kind or tiny regulator valves or even a diaphragm pump it could definitely clog and fuck it all up. It really depends on your setup but I haven't heard a lot of good results from using molasses in hydro.
I don't think you need it though, the plant makes sugar via photosynthesis so as long as you're feeding it appropriately and have grow lights it'll be fine.


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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: Tank333]
    #710660 - 01/30/14 06:17 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Tank333 said:
How well does molasses work in hydro? I want to stop buying that expensive ass sweetener that comes in the lineup and work with something a little more basic...



Don't put molasses in your hydro setup! I've seen bad things happen.

I used molasses for a while in soil and a friend saw this and figured, "It's working for him, I'll give it a shot." He was halfway through flowering in a hydro setup and needless to say it never made it the rest of the way.


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“Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.” -Dr. Seuss


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OfflineTank333
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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: Harry_Ba11sach]
    #710666 - 01/30/14 06:37 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Harry_Ba11sach said:
Well cannabis isn't the only thing that loves sugar. Bacteria and fungi will eat the shit out of it and multiply like mad cunts (and possibly produce harmful byproducts like ethanol in the process), so if your setup has sprayers of any kind or tiny regulator valves or even a diaphragm pump it could definitely clog and fuck it all up. It really depends on your setup but I haven't heard a lot of good results from using molasses in hydro.
I don't think you need it though, the plant makes sugar via photosynthesis so as long as you're feeding it appropriately and have grow lights it'll be fine.




M'kay... Well, I actually use molasses to feed the microbes in my foliar and root drench. I use EWC, alfalfa meal, molasses and the foliar and root packs from OGbiowar's line of beneficials. It's produced by one of the moderators at THCfarmer.com, and its supposed to be the most concentrated source of beneficial microbes available. There's lots of people who've used his recipe with great success, hydro and soil... I've been using it for about three weeks, and I'm liking the results... It leaves less gunk behind than the last stuff I used for beneficials. That crap left floaties in my rez all the time. Thank god I don't have any little sprayers or drippers or anything...


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OfflineTribalSeed
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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: Tank333]
    #710675 - 01/30/14 07:13 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

So the molasses is a good idea, but not essentially needed if you have adequate nutrients and a good light setup?
The reason I ask is because I am about to start flowering for the first time and I want to make sure I have what I need before I start.
I agree the Sweet type of nutes are just expensive. I don't wanna buy shit I don't need, like I did with the calmag. lol.


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Offlineothyem
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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: TribalSeed]
    #710789 - 01/31/14 03:45 PM (5 years, 4 months ago)

I had no issues without using it, but I have noticed improvement since using molasses with every water.


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Offlinebudgrowerwannabe
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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: budgrowerwannabe]
    #710881 - 02/01/14 09:08 AM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

budgrowerwannabe said:
I like the second way. I think it gives the soil time to really get wet. I grow in bags and if I just water till run off it just runs out the easiest way. When I go to put it back it would be way to light. Meaning not watered enough. So I now water a little at a time till I see run off. I catch the first couple drops of run off to see the Ph of my soil.

Im like Res. I water over a Rubbermaid with a bread grate:thumbup: works great.  I start watering. Roll a joint. Then I check them give them more water! Now I sit back smoke the jammer!!  By that time I can put them back  under the lights but I still use the plastic trays:wellidunno: lol









In this pic I built a table with a drain like you were talking about so I didn't have to move them. It works but I still move my plants to the tub to get watered. The table would just let all the extra water run into a bucket.:bigjoint:








I took a pic of how I water for ya


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OfflineTribalSeed
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Re: For Soil Growers, WTF to do with water runoff?????? [Re: budgrowerwannabe]
    #710974 - 02/02/14 12:07 AM (5 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

budgrowerwannabe said:
Quote:

budgrowerwannabe said:
I like the second way. I think it gives the soil time to really get wet. I grow in bags and if I just water till run off it just runs out the easiest way. When I go to put it back it would be way to light. Meaning not watered enough. So I now water a little at a time till I see run off. I catch the first couple drops of run off to see the Ph of my soil.

Im like Res. I water over a Rubbermaid with a bread grate:thumbup: works great.  I start watering. Roll a joint. Then I check them give them more water! Now I sit back smoke the jammer!!  By that time I can put them back  under the lights but I still use the plastic trays:wellidunno: lol









In this pic I built a table with a drain like you were talking about so I didn't have to move them. It works but I still move my plants to the tub to get watered. The table would just let all the extra water run into a bucket.:bigjoint:








I took a pic of how I water for ya




Awesome man. Those bread racks are the shit. I used an oven rack the other day and I cut my time down by like 30 to 45 minutes. I really appreciate you taking the time to snap that pic for me.
Righteous man.


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