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OfflinePed
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Updated 08/30 - Almost Harvest Time! - Royal Medic, AK47 - 1 kW MH/HPS - First Grow (Medical) * 2
    #676520 - 06/28/13 07:40 PM (6 years, 6 months ago)

Updated August 30 || Day 56:


It's almost harvest time!  Well, at least for the auto-flowering AK-47.  The Royal Medics, which are easily 3-4x taller, are only just beginning to bloom. 

Most recent pics:








Original Post (full updates at bottom of thread):

Hey everyone,

Welcome to my first grow!

This will be a medical grow.

The main objective is to realize the highest possible concentrations of CBD, a known anti-proliferative (anti-cancer) agent.  Our principle motivation is to get in touch with the cultivation of this medicine, acquire the skill, and to deliver the loudest possible "fuck off" message to any and all cancer cells, as well as address a number of other medical concerns.

I've been lurking these boards for a while, posting here and there, soaking up as much information as I can.  Now the ball is rolling, and I'm excited to share this first grow with you all.

The Setup

- 19 sq. ft (151 cu. ft) grow room covered with black/white poly from top to bottom
- Digital ballast, dimmable, 650w, 750w, 1000w, SL
- 1000w MH (veg), 1000w HPS (flower)
- Cooltube reflector
- 6" Canfan + Carbon filter (200 CFM)
- 8x 20L (5 gal) pots
- Sunshine mix #4




The Genetics

 

There will be two strains cultivated on this first go-around.  As an avid trekkie, I'm tickled to have planted five Romulan seeds on June 26, my birthday.  Ten of these regular seeds were purchased from Single Marijuana Seeds Canada. This strain has a great reputation for its analgesic effects, and its sleep-inducing effect.  Update: of 10 seeds ordered, nine arrived intact, and only one germinated, promptly mutating and dying.  The vendor has cut off communication

Expected in the mail any day now are 5 feminized Royal Medic, purchased directly from the breeder.  Royal Medic is a high-CBD strain, a cross between Critical and Juanita La Lagrimosa.  This was the highest CBD strain (and thereby the most notably anti-cancer) I could find from a reliable source.  Update:  Royal Queen also included a bonus seed, an autoflowering AK.


Germination

I decided to germinate the first five directly in soil, as this came highly recommended.  While germination rates are not as predictable with this method, I'm told that successful sprouts tend to develop into stronger plants.  Using sunshine mix #4, I adjusted 1 litre of store-bought spring water to a pH of 6.5, poured it through a volume of soil, and tested the run off.  This returned a welcomed pH of 5.5.  Five styrofoam cups were gently packed with this moist, unsterilized mix, with seeds planted approximately 1 cm below the surface.  Update: This was a complete failure with the first 5 Romulan seeds.  So with the next batch I used paper towel method with a bit of H2O2, as fungus seemed to be the problem with the Romulan seeds. 

Only one Romulan seed popped.  The rest quickly succumbed to fungus, in spite of two aggressive oxidation treatments.  All of the Royal Queen seeds germinated quickly and healthily.






Help! I have no water! Update: On the advice of the community, I installed a reverse osmosis system.


I'll keep this updated.  Thanks for following!

Ped


Edited by Ped (08/29/13 10:25 PM)


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Offlinefunnyfart
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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: Ped]
    #676528 - 06/29/13 03:34 AM (6 years, 6 months ago)

Hey man, I hope ur grow turns out well!
I don't know how your finances are but when u can go for the osmosis system.


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OfflineGreenHorns
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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: funnyfart]
    #676534 - 06/29/13 09:08 AM (6 years, 6 months ago)

Sounds like a great setup. I would consider a fan that moves more air. My 1000w hps has a 430cfm and heats like a bastard still. I just fill up large containers with purified water from the machines at the stores for 25¢ a gallon. Not cheap but also not that expensive at maybe $10 a month.


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OfflinePed
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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: GreenHorns]
    #676624 - 06/30/13 10:12 PM (6 years, 6 months ago)

Thanks guys for the input!

It's been four days and still no sprouts.  I finally gave in to my impatience, and using a sterilized pin I pushed aside some of the top soil.  To my relief, I saw that a few of the seeds had begun to split.  It's progress, albeit slow going.


>> I would consider a fan that moves more air.  My 1000w hps has a 430cfm and heats like a bastard still.

I would have preferred a larger fan as well.  However, the build was already significantly over budget and I could not justify the added expense.  On the plus side, I live in a cooler climate, and the room is situated against concrete walls which are about 75% under ground.  This makes for a much cooler space.

I did a dry run on the system through one 18/6 cycle, and found that the lumen cycle held steady at 26 C (78 F), while the dark cycle was actually a bit cool at 20 C (68 F).

I'm curious, is yours a cooltube/reflector or are you just blowing air under a bat wing?


>> I just fill up large containers with purified water from the machines at the stores for 25¢ a gallon.

How much water do your plants take?  I'm using 5 gallon pots.  What are you using?



>> I don't know how your finances are but when u can go for the osmosis system.

Yes, after much deliberation, I'll be making a considerable sacrifice in order to afford the RO system.  This project is already "too big to fail" (and certainly too important), and I'd rather my bank account suffer a bit than potentially delay the procurement of this medicine.


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OfflineGreenHorns
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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: Ped]
    #676644 - 07/01/13 05:27 AM (6 years, 6 months ago)

Damn lucky with the weather. My tent averages 80-81f with light on and 77 light off and ac set to 77f My electric bill is going to suck a life time supply of dicks this month :frown:
my light is in a ducted hood with glass. And I use 3 and 5 gallon pots. The 3 usually uses half gallon and the 5 usually uses a whole gallon every 3 days or so. One of my plants in 5 gal is a monster and needs to be watered every other day almost. But I expect it to yield big so I'll endure.


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OfflinePed
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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: GreenHorns]
    #676936 - 07/03/13 01:26 AM (6 years, 6 months ago)

My very first sprout!  I've dreamed of this day for fifteen years.  If only this was purely for fun instead of gloomy medical woes.  It took longer than expected, and I was getting tired of staring at cups of dirt.  Finally, some green!



(I can't wait until I have some pics that aren't easily mistaken for a cup of coffee from a used car lot.)

Now that this sprout has appeared, should I raise it to the light?  Right now it's about 6 inches below the bulb.  Should I be trying to get it as close as possible?


The other four Romulans haven't shown any signs of making an appearance.  It's been a week since I dropped them directly into the soil.  Fearing the worst, I went ahead and started soaking the remaining 5 of those seeds on July 1st.  They've been in that paper towel for nearly three days now, and all that's happened is that they've darkened in colour.  What's up here?  Have I done something wrong?  Temperature is 25 (78 F).  I used a couple layers of regular paper towel soaked with sterile water from a medical supply shop (pH 5.5), and sandwiched it between a folded scrap of poly.

I'll be really disappointed if I don't get a least one fem Romulan plant out of ten seeds.  I've been really looking forward to that strain.

On the plus side, the Royal Medic seeds came in today.  Royal Queen Seeds dropped a bonus seed in there, an AK auto.  This time around, I'm soaking them for 24 hours in a cup of water, after which I'll place them in a paper towel and wait for taproots before I put them in soil.


That little propagator I built turned out to be less of an asset and more of a pain in the ass.  The air stone kept getting clogged, such that I was having doubts about there being enough fresh air entering the environment.  A couple times, it got up to 90+% rH and 30 degrees (86 F).  I scrapped it.

In it's place I built a loosely constructed box out of styrofoam, ramming the CFL light socket into the top. There's an exhaust vent at the top for rising air, and holes in the front wall for passive intake, partially covered with wet paper towel for humidity.  Currently it's at 74% rH, 24 degrees (75 F).








Questions:

Is it too soon to say the other four Romulan seeds are toast, considering that only one of these has sprouted after eight days?

What does it mean that the remaining five of these seeds have shown no perceptible changes after nearly three days in damp paper towel (other than their darkening colour)?

Should I try to get the one sprout as close to the light as possible, or should I let it settle in for a while first?

Is there anything I should be aware of as far as raising an auto-flowering plant under the same bulb as my photoperiod plants?

Man, I haven't had this "lol I'm a noob" sensation since the first time I went through the PF Tek.  That was back in 1999!  Anyway, just as soon as I'm ready to fire up the HID, I'll post some pics of the grow room.  :peace:


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OfflineGreenHorns
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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: Ped]
    #676941 - 07/03/13 05:37 AM (6 years, 6 months ago)

I'm not sure how long before they starts rotting. I'd say keep them at it. Wonder if there's not enough o2 in the soil? Your light is fine if its 6".


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Offlinefunnyfart
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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: GreenHorns]
    #676986 - 07/03/13 01:21 PM (6 years, 6 months ago)

Klick
I always used this method, i acutally don't know why their not comeing out?!
maype it's to compressed in that sandwich? Just one clue
And when there small I just put them infront of my window


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OfflinePed
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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: funnyfart]
    #677039 - 07/04/13 12:55 AM (6 years, 6 months ago)

I can't put them infront of the window because I'm in an area that gets a lot of rain during this time of year.  There's still another couple weeks of relentless gloom ahead.  The internal temperature of main floor also fluctuates a lot between day and night, especially when the sun makes an appearance.


>> i acutally don't know why their not comeing out

This morning, the last of the Romulan Seeds looked pretty dismal.  They're nearly black.  Apparently this indicates a fungal attack.

I germinated the Royal Medic and AK seeds in exactly the same way (6 in total) - sterile water, paper towel, folded in poly.  In less than 24 hours, 3 of them had popped.  Now, about 36 hours later, 5/6 have popped.  The first three are ready for soil already, and the remaining unpopped seed (AK) looks about ready to burst.

Suffice to say, my impression is that the Romulan seeds came with a fungus or fungals spores attached to them, or had been stored in such a way that they were highly susceptible to fungal attack.  Once the seeds from Royal Queen arrived, I could see a difference between them immediately.  The RQ seeds looked more vibrant, more vital.  They just had a healthier look to them.  Certainly they're living up to that impression.

In a last ditch effort to get some Romulan germination happening, I dropped them in a glass of H2O/H2O2 solution at 1.5% v/v, bubbling the solution rigorously to encourage H2O2 decomposition.  After 1 hour, I introduced an equivalent volume of heavily alkalized water at a rate of 10mL/minute to critically accelerate the liberation of oxygen, and drained this through a coffee filter.  The aim was to aggressively oxidize any invasive organisms without over-exposing the seeds.  The seeds came out looking OK, and I put them back in paper towel about 12 hours ago, this time using pH-adjusted water at 0.05% v/v H2O2.  We'll see what happens.

Can you tell I'm more into chemistry than I am into gardening?  Hopefully this proves to be an asset and not a hinderance as I gain experience.


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OfflineGreenHorns
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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: Ped]
    #677042 - 07/04/13 05:08 AM (6 years, 6 months ago)

If you don't see any progress I would hit up the breeder and see what they will do for you. Seems like obvious genetic defect if just that strain is not germinating.


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OfflinePed
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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: GreenHorns]
    #677062 - 07/04/13 11:03 AM (6 years, 6 months ago)

>> If you don't see any progress I would hit up the breeder and see what they will do for you.

Yeah, I agree.


Royal Medic, at 48 hours:




Romulan, at 10 days:



Same method.


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OfflineGreenHorns
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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: Ped]
    #677067 - 07/04/13 12:45 PM (6 years, 6 months ago)

I pollinated a plant for the first time some months back and the seeds from it won't germinate either. I put them back in for a soak for days and finally just put the one that popped a bit in a jiffy pellet and its sloooly growing. I'm wondering if its just a sign of poorly made seeds?


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OfflinePed
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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: GreenHorns]
    #677206 - 07/06/13 01:13 AM (6 years, 6 months ago)

Stretching?  Question:

Every time I check on the seedlings, the stems seem to have increased more noticeably than the emergence of post-cotyledon leaves.  I've been reluctant to bring them closer to the light, as I don't want to stress them out, but at the same time I don't want them to stretch.  How much stretching is normal and how much is too much?  Considering that the CFL's are quite cool, giving off almost no heat -- is it better to err on the side of elongated stems, or on the side of too many lumens?  At the present time, the bulbs are 3-4 inches from the seedlings.


The RO system was installed today, which has been quite a relief.  No more water woes.

Here's some family photos:







The curling of the cotyledons seems to suggest the soil is too wet.  Is there a means to correct this other than time?

All but one of the seedlings here (the one in the smaller cup) are just 80 hours out of the envelope they were shipped in.  My impression is that these seeds are above average in quality, but seeing as how the dismally failed Romulan seeds are my only frame of reference, I'm not confident in my objectivity.  Let me know what you think using the poll below.

The frontmost left seedling of the lot (in the smaller cup) is the Romulan.  That one is 14 days from sowing (June 26).  The others are all Royal Medic, save for the rearmost seedling on the right, which is the auto AK.  In just 80 hours (July 3), they've caught up with and are rapidly charging past the Romulan.

The Romulan seems to be settling in nicely, deepening in colour and firming up well, but it's slow goings.  The remainder of the Romulan seeds are now visibly corrupt, my attempts to rescue them sadly in vain.  I guess I'll have to whip up a new signature and change the name of this post.  I emailed the vendor about it yesterday.  We'll see what they say.


The Medic/AK seeds came alive with such thrust that the emerging taproot forced the seed right up through the soil and into the open air, the husk dangling from the hooked ends of their taproots, giving the appearance of streetlights.  This happened to all but one of them.  Is this common?  Did I plant them too shallow?

Without thinking to take a photo, when I discovered this I immediately sprinkled some of the leftover pasteurized soil around the exposed portion of the taproots, misted them sparingly, and then added sufficient soil to even out the surface.  Instinct told me that the part of the seedling looking like it should be below ground ought to be made so immediately.  Was this the right call?

Even after the cotyledons had decisively emerged, the husks were reluctant to let go.  My feeling was that they've probably served their purpose, and that the seedlings were exerting themselves unnecessarily under their load.  Using a pair of H2O2-cleaned tweezers, and a great deal of caution, I carefully twisted the husks free, discarding them. 
 


A little bit of what looks like some sort of embryonic material is still clinging to this one.  It looks like healthy living tissue, which is why I decided to leave it there for the time being.  Is that the right call?

Poll: How are the Royal Medic and AK seeds performing so far, now at the 80 hour mark?
The quality of this seed stock is:
You may choose only one
Exceptional
Above average
Pretty typical if you're doing it right
Good, but there's lots better
Not as good as you're thinking
(Can't really tell from these photos)


Votes accepted from (07/05/13 09:05 PM) to (No end specified)
View the results of this poll



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Edited by Ped (07/06/13 01:57 AM)


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OfflineGreenHorns
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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: Ped]
    #677216 - 07/06/13 05:10 AM (6 years, 6 months ago)

I would pull the light farther. 6" is a good distance and yeah its normal for the seed pod to stick to the leafs at first. Stretching is normal but if they are getting twisty and floppy that would be a sign of light deprivation. As long as you've got nice even growth your solid. I'm not sure how moist the soil is but what I've always done is sprayed my seedlings soil till they were staring to get well rooted then switch to accrual watering. Makes it easier to keep moist without making it too boggy.


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Offlinebudgrowerwannabe
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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: GreenHorns]
    #677247 - 07/06/13 03:10 PM (6 years, 6 months ago)

Just dont over Analise your grow . Just let the weed grow .
Put the (germ.) seed in soil. Water,let dry,water.Repeat that the whole plants life:stayfunky:


Edited by budgrowerwannabe (07/06/13 03:11 PM)


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OfflineLONGPIG
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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: budgrowerwannabe]
    #677282 - 07/06/13 08:47 PM (6 years, 6 months ago)

.


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AOTEAROA


Edited by LONGPIG (11/24/15 10:56 PM)


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OfflinePed
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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS [Re: LONGPIG]
    #677370 - 07/07/13 09:37 PM (6 years, 6 months ago)

Yeah, I do have that tendency.  It's simply that I want to get the best results, not overlook anything, and most of all I want to gain a complete understanding of the process.

So, today was a really hot day, and to check on the temps in there I lifted my CFL's and peered inside.  I dropped the fixture.  They didn't hit the seedlings, but both bulbs shattered.  So now I have no light.

So I fired up the metal halide.  It's running at 600 watts right now.  Not wanting to bombard the girls too early, I have it at 30" height.  I've read so many times to wait until they're well established before putting them under an HID, but it's midnight, this happened right at the start of today's light cycle, and I have no alternative in the house.

Thoughts?


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OfflineLost Shroomerite
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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS [Re: Ped]
    #677372 - 07/07/13 09:48 PM (6 years, 6 months ago)

Best of luck! :popcorn:


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InvisibleCOOKED101
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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS [Re: Lost Shroomerite]
    #677381 - 07/07/13 10:51 PM (6 years, 6 months ago)

I'm running seedlings that were started on the 4th and popped up on the 6th of July, only a day behind your grow, I've got them under a 400 mh about 24-25 inches from them, my temps are on the cold side 60f at night and 70 during the day (middle of winter here)I know it's early but they seem pretty happy under the air cooled 400 mh. I'll be slowly starting to drop the light down in a 4 or 5days, maybe an inch every 2 days and see how they like the 20 inch mark probably more like 19 with plant growth as it will be the end of second week .I'm a bit the same with making sure everything is as good as I can get it, this is my first try indoor so I'm just feeling it out as I go with plenty of study.


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OfflineGreenHorns
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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS [Re: COOKED101]
    #677388 - 07/08/13 07:22 AM (6 years, 6 months ago)

It shouldn't be a big difference in lumen or spectrum cause they should both be pretty blue. Just keep an eye on the distance and adjust till you get new bulbs. You doing CFL or T5?


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OfflinePed
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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS [Re: GreenHorns]
    #677505 - 07/09/13 04:20 PM (6 years, 6 months ago)

>> Just keep an eye on the distance and adjust till you get new bulbs. You doing CFL or T5?

I had been using Ottlite CFL's, and they were OK.  The plan was to run out and buy another pair, but after one light cycle under the MH the plants look so vital that I think I'll hold off.  I moved the light down from 30" to 25", and after a few days I'll start bumping it down 2-3"/day, per the advice from Cooked.

Currently they are under a 1000 watt MH running on a dimmable ballast set to 600 watts.

Leaves are quite firm, open, and green, but they don't seem to be eager to jam out more of 'em.  I tend to think this means they're putting energy into their root structure, which would be a positive.


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Edited by Ped (07/09/13 04:26 PM)


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OfflinePed
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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS [Re: Ped]
    #677507 - 07/09/13 04:56 PM (6 years, 6 months ago)

Here are some pics of the setup and grow room, starting from the outside and working in.  Its a bit cramped in there, and difficult to take clear shots, but I think you'll get the picture:




Workstation.




This is the intake.  There's a lot of dust and debris down there, and bugs, so I made this little filter box out of a rubbermaid and some cut up filter medium.




Just a digital ballast.




How it looks from the outside.  I made a little roll-up blind out of another piece of poly to contain some of the leak from the zipper.  It's rolled up right now, so you can't see it.






These two were taken yesterday.  This is how the seedlings looked after I broke the CFL's and put them under the MH.






This is how they looked 24 hours later at the beginning of the next cycle.








Overhead views.  The carbon filter needn't be attached yet, so it isn't.

You'll see I those Grow-yo hook things.  I don't recommend these, and I don't trust them.  That's why I added a safety line to the reflector.  If any component of the hanging system should fail, no disaster will come of it.






This is under the table.  The table is inclined about 1/2", it's surface covered in a "tray" of poly which will conveniently funnel runoff into this handy little bin.


That's all for now!


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InvisibleCOOKED101
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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS [Re: Ped]
    #677508 - 07/09/13 05:11 PM (6 years, 6 months ago)

Quote:

Ped said:
>> Just keep an eye on the distance and adjust till you get new bulbs. You doing CFL or T5?

I had been using Ottlite CFL's, and they were OK.  The plan was to run out and buy another pair, but after one light cycle under the MH the plants look so vital that I think I'll hold off.  I moved the light down from 30" to 25", and after a few days I'll start bumping it down 2-3"/day, per the advice from Cooked.

Currently they are under a 1000 watt MH running on a dimmable ballast set to 600 watts.

Leaves are quite firm, open, and green, but they don't seem to be eager to jam out more of 'em.  I tend to think this means they're putting energy into their root structure, which would be a positive.




Remember I'm only on a 400w mh so there is a diffference in light intensity to inches away from plant from a 400 to a 600, and as I said its only my first time indoor so as much as I like to share info, I'm not sure if it should be taken as sound advice, I'm not bumping my down till I get some more growth.


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS [Re: COOKED101]
    #677509 - 07/09/13 05:33 PM (6 years, 6 months ago)

>> Remember I'm only on a 400w mh so there is a diffference in light intensity to inches away from plant from a 400 to a 600, and as I said its only my first time indoor so as much as I like to share info, I'm not sure if it should be taken as sound advice, I'm not bumping my down till I get some more growth.

Thanks for this.  It's my first grow too, indoor or out.  They responded so well to the MH that I thought I'd bump it down to find the lower limit at this stage.  I've been watching them carefully.  They're 15 hours into today's 18, and everything seems top notch.  Unless they "seem hungry" (I have no idea how I'll ascertain this), the light stays at 25" until one or two more sets of leaves come out.

One thing that's stressing me a bit is knowing when to water.  Having been told so many time that the classic downfall is to over water, I've been holding off even though the instinct is not to.  The surface of the soil is quite dry--I gave it a gentle mist yesterday--and my "test cup" (which has never been watered) still seems reasonably lighter.  They look dry - but weigh damp. 

Does it make sense to suppose that if I continue waiting before I water this will encourage the plant to go "searching", thereby promoting the growth of a solid root structure?


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS [Re: Ped]
    #677545 - 07/10/13 03:29 AM (6 years, 6 months ago)

Dont water till there dry . By weight man,Thats the best way!!:stayfunky:


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS [Re: budgrowerwannabe]
    #677564 - 07/10/13 03:50 PM (6 years, 6 months ago)

I will keep watching this! :awegroove::awegroove::awegroove:


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: GreenHorns]
    #677572 - 07/10/13 06:53 PM (6 years, 6 months ago)

>> If you don't see any progress I would hit up the breeder and see what they will do for you. Seems like obvious genetic defect if just that strain is not germinating.

I emailed Single Marijuana Seeds Canada, actually a UK outfit, about the total failure of their seeds as compared to the immediate vitality of another vendor's seeds. 

They told me that they are not able to discuss matters of germination, that they do not condone germination, and that my account was to be terminated due to breach of terms.  What an asinine, unnecessarily severe and all-too-convenient policy.  Canada has an extensive network of certified medical growers and suppliers, who are 100% within the law: what's the need to shut down all correspondence about perfectly legal activities?  Is this typical? 

On the plus side, everything's rolling along great with the Royal Medic and the AK from RQS.  After a day and a bit seeming only to bask in the light, now they're all putting out some more leaves.

7 days from seed:






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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: Ped]
    #677600 - 07/11/13 03:37 AM (6 years, 6 months ago)

Looking good man !!


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: budgrowerwannabe]
    #677674 - 07/11/13 06:26 PM (6 years, 6 months ago)

It's good to see you invested in the proper equipment to grow with, I am sure you will see much better results.  I used to try to DIY everything and go as cheap as possible and now that I am using the proper reflector/tent/fan/light combo, I am SUPER HAPPY with the results and how well my ladies are doing.  Congrats on the grow and can't wait to see the finished product.  I will be following FOR SURE!


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: Ped]
    #677676 - 07/11/13 06:38 PM (6 years, 6 months ago)

Awesome setup. :thumbup:
And the motives behind this grow make it that much more worth following.

Quote:

I emailed Single Marijuana Seeds Canada, actually a UK outfit, about the total failure of their seeds as compared to the immediate vitality of another vendor's seeds. 

They told me that they are not able to discuss matters of germination, that they do not condone germination, and that my account was to be terminated due to breach of terms.  What an asinine, unnecessarily severe and all-too-convenient policy.  Canada has an extensive network of certified medical growers and suppliers, who are 100% within the law: what's the need to shut down all correspondence about perfectly legal activities?  Is this typical?




Fuck 'em, sounds like they just wanted to put the screw to you. It's a shame, but it's how things go sometimes. 

Good luck! :awesomenod:


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: resincoatedlungs]
    #677710 - 07/12/13 01:23 AM (6 years, 6 months ago)

(Day 8)

My first seedling has died.

Please join me in a moment of silence.



The first seedling to come into this earth under my care has perished to fungal attack, just as her 9 companions did before even germinating.

This was surely disappointing, and I had a heavy heart.  Not only was I greatly looking forward to the Romulan strain, and not only did I orient this entire thread around it (revisions forthcoming), but this first seedling was symbolic, sort of like the first turn of the shovel at the construction site of a new hospital. 

Yet, I'm choosing to see it in a positive light:  no cultivator enjoys perfect success always, and this doomed little seedling has hopefully taken the brunt of the inevitable misfortune this first go around.  For this reason, and because I'm an unabashed nerd, I named this seedling Kimara before discarding it, after a Romulan senator who gave her up her freedom to protect that of others.


...moving on now...


This is probably nothing of consequence, but since knowing more is probably better than knowing less...




I noticed at the end of today's cycle that the leaves of all 5 of the Royal Medics (left) have gone from flat to slightly convex, while the auto-AK (right) has gone from flat to slightly concave.  All the plants look healthy and showed strong growth today, but nonetheless this is a noteworthy shift into which I'd love some insight.

Since all of these seeds come from the same vendor and have been exposed to identical conditions, and since to the best of my limited knowledge they all seem healthy and happy, my first instinct is to suppose that this difference has something to do with genetics, whether this has to do with the physical characteristics of the strains themselves, or with how they respond to the environment they've been nurtured under.

The Royal Medic is an incida-dominant hybrid, while the AK is a sativa-dominant with the obligatory spalsh of ruderalis.  Do these facts account for this difference in appearance at this early stage?  Or is there another factor(s)?

Preferring to be safe than sorry, I added 2.5" between them and the 600 watt MH, and tilted the circulation fan slightly up to skim an even gentler breeze over them.

Today was the first watering since the initial soak prior to planting.  Thanks very much to those who offered advice on this earlier.  The cups were still heavier than the bone-dry control cup, but it was becoming difficult to discern between them.  The top inch to two inches was very dry.

After adding 20 drops of H2O2 and 1 drop of SuperThrive to 1 litre (1 quart) of RO water, and after adjusting to a pH of 6.5 pH, the solution was bubbled for 6 hours to liberate the oxidizer, hopefully arriving at oxygen-rich and contaminant-free water.  I watered sparingly, quite consciously erring on the side of too little, as it is obviously much easier to correct for not enough than it is to correct for too much. 

No nutrients this time.  I figure the 1/4 strength DNF added during soil prep probably remains quite sufficient at this early stage, as it stands to reason that the roots are only now beginning their quest, it being just 48 hours since the first non-embryonic leaves came fully online. 

I feel a definite shift in the whole experience thus far.  This is fun.  In the beginning, I was seeking information like a relentless machine, constantly hunting for insights.  Now--if I can indulge the anthropomorphism--it's as though these little seedlings are communicating with me, telling me what they need, teaching me how it all works.  They're not even out of their party cups and they're already helping me relax!

Thanks all for following the journal, and for all the input you've offered and will offer.


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: Ped]
    #677906 - 07/14/13 03:17 AM (6 years, 6 months ago)

Day 10

So pretty..







(Royal Medic)




(AK)


Transplanting's been on my mind.  They are sucking up water much faster now, and they're giving off this "established" vibe.  It seems like the right choice to transplant just before the roots encounter the walls of the 12 oz cups, but not so early that their medium crumbles away upon extraction.  If only I knew how the plant's growth above soil reflected the growth below it.  Two hours on Google have revealed that either I've already waited too long, or that I should wait another two weeks.  The expert opinion seems conclusive:  until I shouldn't wait to transplant, I definitely should.  :justdontknow:

2-4 days, I think.


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Edited by Ped (07/14/13 03:25 AM)


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: Ped]
    #677907 - 07/14/13 03:49 AM (6 years, 6 months ago)

Those are some beautiful seedlings. Much more beautiful than mine were.

The root mass generally starts off larger than the plant mass.

I would wait until you see some rooting through the plastic up against the wall close to the bottom. Then you don't risk tearing roots out of substrate it has not fully consolidated and you can be sure you're transplanting at approx. the right time (that is when the container becomes too small.)


--------------------
andyistic said:
Ok so let me bring you idiots up to speed.
The admins are tired of this shitfest being made the joke of the weed community on the Internet.


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: TomCollins]
    #678303 - 07/16/13 09:28 PM (6 years, 6 months ago)

>> I would wait until you see some rooting through the plastic up against the wall close to the bottom.

The day after your post, three of the pots showed little roots poking through the holes at the bottom.  I pushed the button.  The timing seemed perfect, as there were straight roots trailing down the sides against the wall of the cups.  The soil was quite soild, holding together well during transplant.  Everything went quite smoothly. 


Day 11 (immediatley before and immediately after transplant)







5 gallon pots, 1/4 nutes. 


Day 12 (today)

Some of them seem to be showing early signs of nitrogen deficiency - very slight yellowing in the leaves.  I'm not sure if that's just a sign of stress from the transplant, or if I've been underfeeding.  From the very beginning, I have been very ginger with the nutrients, as underfeeding is easier to correct than overfeeding.  Thankfully, I kept the soil only lightly moistened for transplant.  Tomorrow they should be good for a feed, and I'll bump up the nutes a bit.

I've been trying to beef up the stems a bit by keeping the fan on them, at least partially.  They don't seem to like it.  Every time they get the fan, they start to look all droopy.  When I shut off the fan, they perk right back up.









Edited by Ped (07/16/13 09:35 PM)


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: Ped]
    #678315 - 07/16/13 09:55 PM (6 years, 6 months ago)

That's a bit younger than I would be moving around and feeding anything other than water. Might be a bit of shock.


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: GreenHorns]
    #678334 - 07/16/13 11:00 PM (6 years, 6 months ago)

>> That's a bit younger than I would be moving around and feeding anything other than water. Might be a bit of shock.

How much younger? 

My soil is sterilized and my water is RO.  So I gotta have some nutes, no?


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: Ped]
    #678375 - 07/17/13 04:47 AM (6 years, 6 months ago)

Yeah you do.

At this stage, it would probably be wise to give your plants a mild solution (1/4th strength) for the next week and then bring them up to the regular dose. That should avoid the shock.


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andyistic said:
Ok so let me bring you idiots up to speed.
The admins are tired of this shitfest being made the joke of the weed community on the Internet.


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: TomCollins]
    #678384 - 07/17/13 06:24 AM (6 years, 6 months ago)

For me personally I start in solo cups until the roots take it over and outgrow it then move to 1 gallon. Once they are situated in the 1 gal I introduce at about 1/2 strength but I also use hot soils so its not really needed till they start exploding.


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: GreenHorns]
    #678629 - 07/18/13 08:56 PM (6 years, 6 months ago)

>> At this stage, it would probably be wise to give your plants a mild solution (1/4th strength) for the next week and then bring them up to the regular dose.

I took your advice; so far things are looking pretty good.  The yellowing has given way to more green; hopefully this is a sign that the nutes are at least approaching their needs.

I've been pHing the water to about 7.5, thinking that the soil will bring this down a point, putting me in the target range.  The runoff tested at a pH of 4, which was a bit of a "yikes" moment.  I brought up some water up to pH 9 introduced a healthy volume of it.  Hopefully this prevents/corrects any pH problems before they become plant problems.


>> For me personally I start in solo cups until the roots take it over and outgrow it then move to 1 gallon. Once they are situated in the 1 gal I introduce at about 1/2 strength but I also use hot soils so its not really needed till they start exploding.

Yeah, I was trying to time it such that they were coming out of the solo cups at a time when the medium was sufficiently consolidated, but with a minimum amount of root mass exposed or abraded during the transplant.  The timing was perfect for that strategy - whether or not this is the best strategy, I don't know.  They seem alright though.


Day 13







This one's always been kinda runty.




The auto-AK has been a champ, of the 6 plants it was the only one which seemed to not even notice it had been transplanted.


Day 14









Runty looks like she's gonna stay runty.



I dropped the light down to 16" today, and brought the wattage up to 750.  They seem to be loving it, but the temperature got a little on the high side, at 29 C (84 F).

If you lean in real close, they're starting to smell real pretty~  :geordinod:


--------------------


Edited by Ped (07/18/13 09:08 PM)


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: Ped]
    #678645 - 07/18/13 09:46 PM (6 years, 5 months ago)

Very nice. Yeah they look like they are liking what your doing!


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: GreenHorns]
    #678890 - 07/21/13 03:18 PM (6 years, 5 months ago)

Hey Greenhorns,

Earlier in the thread, you said:

>> I would consider a fan that moves more air

It looks like you're  quite correct.  I'm having heat problems.  With the an ambient temperature outside the tent of about 70F, the interior is edging into the high 80s.  I went to the hydro store to ask about a higher volume fan, and the guy said something that didn't make any sense to me:

"It doesn't matter how much air you pull outta there and pass over the bulb, because the air you're pulling in from the outside is still going to be the same temperature."

Does that sound like it makes any sense?  It seems like more airflow over the bulb = more heat expelled from the bulb before it radiates into the garden = less gained heat and faster expulsion = lower ambient temperature.

His solution was not to sell me a bigger fan, but a CO2 system instead.  The CO2, he said, would help the plants tolerate more heat.  When I mentioned that this has no bearing at all on root zone temps, which are also on the high side, he just kept insisting that more CO2 = more heat tolerance = no need for a fan that moves more than 171 CFM in a 190 CFM room.

Thoughts?


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: Ped]
    #678891 - 07/21/13 03:22 PM (6 years, 5 months ago)

I'm not too keen on co2 but I'm sure hawk or mag are. He's trying to sell is what it sounds like to me. More cfm more heat is removed from the bulb.


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: GreenHorns]
    #678892 - 07/21/13 04:22 PM (6 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

GreenHorns said:
I'm not too keen on co2 but I'm sure hawk or mag are. He's trying to sell is what it sounds like to me. More cfm more heat is removed from the bulb.



:whathesaid: But if your just putting the hot air in the same room as your tent.air going into the tent will be what ever your room temp. is ?? Right or am I to high?


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: budgrowerwannabe]
    #678893 - 07/21/13 04:46 PM (6 years, 5 months ago)

Yeah it'll heat that way too. Its best to vent it outside.


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: budgrowerwannabe]
    #678894 - 07/21/13 04:52 PM (6 years, 5 months ago)

>> But if your just putting the hot air in the same room as your tent.air going into the tent will be what ever your room temp. is ?? Right or am I to high?

Yeah of course.  My bulb vents outside, though.



Right now, internal temperatures are about 5-10 degrees C (8-16 F) higher than the external temperature.  It seems to me that the best way to mitigate this is to pass more air across the bulb, thereby decreasing the amount of heat gained from it, while simultaneously drawing more of the cooler external air into the space.

Internal temperature is a function of external temperature plus whatever heat is gained from the bulb.  The less airflow over the bulb, the more heat is gained from its operation.  The less air exchange inside the garden, the slower the expulsion of this gained heat.  It follows therefore than more airflow equals less heat gained, that what ever heat is gained will be more efficiently displaced and extracted.

This seems like basic logic, but the guy at the hydro store would have me believe that removing more heat will not mean that less heat is gained.  Unless I am seriously underestimating the radiant heat coming off these bulbs, and seriously overestimating the extractive efficiency of a doubled CFM, the guy at the store is either lying to me to make a profit, or glaringly under-qualified for his job, both of which are disappointing.


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: Ped]
    #678980 - 07/22/13 10:43 PM (6 years, 5 months ago)

I think I'm developing a problem and could really use some advice.

All 5 of my Royal Medic plants seem to be suffering.  The AK is just fine.

Specifically, the leaves of the Royal Medic plants are sagging, drooping.  Toward the end of the lumen cycle, they drop considerably.  I understand this is a normal part of preparing for night time, and the leaves do lift substantially when the light clicks back on, but they retain a consistently droopy look for the entire 18 hours.  They sag so much that I've had to put down little squares of poly to keep the leaves from resting on the dirt and rotting away.

My first thought was that the soil was too damp, or not draining well, and that it would correct itself given a little time.  Now seven days since the last watering, the problem seems to be worsening instead.  The soil is still moist to the touch, certainly not wet, but the pots are considerably heavier than a bone-dry pot of the same size. 

The AK, which has been exposed to identical conditions, seems healthy enough.  Yet, all 6 plants seem to be growing a bit slow, seeming to prefer wide, bushy growth instead of upward, branching growth.  The stems of all six plants have thickened considerably over the past few days, and seem basically healthy.

I first noticed this nearly 20 days ago.  On July 4, a clear difference in the apparent foliar vitality of the AK was noticeable even in the first pair of post-embryonic leaves.  I called attention to it with a photo in one of my log updates, asking if there was any cause for concern, but when nobody said anything I just concluded that it must be a genetic trait.  Now that it's developed into what appears to be a situation of declining health, I'm eager to find out the why, what, and how's of understanding and correcting the problem.

Here's some pictures showing the chronology of this thing:







I should mention that on day 3 after the transplant, all six plants received more water than I had intended.  This was because I made an error adjusting the water's pH, which was discovered when the runoff tested around 3.5, which is far too acidic.  To prevent the acidic conditions from developing into a problem, I adjusted an additional gallon of water to a pH of 9 and distributed this evenly to all six plants, concentrating on the existing root zone. 

In total, three gallons were used watering all six plants, which is 2 quarts (1.8L) committed to each 5 gallon pot.

Thanks in advance for any insights and advice!

Peace ~


Edited by Ped (07/22/13 11:11 PM)


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: Ped]
    #678987 - 07/23/13 02:33 AM (6 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

In total, three gallons were used watering all six plants, which is 2 quarts (1.8L) committed to each 5 gallon pot.



1/2 gallon once a week per 5 gallon pot doesn't sound like enough water.
My guess would either be under-watering, the soil staying moist for too long because of the paper covering it, or just not fully soaking all of the roots and soil per watering from the small amount of water. I'm pretty new so wait until a more experienced grower chimes in, but it does look like a watering issue to me.


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: resincoatedlungs]
    #678989 - 07/23/13 04:51 AM (6 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

resincoatedlungs said:
Quote:

In total, three gallons were used watering all six plants, which is 2 quarts (1.8L) committed to each 5 gallon pot.



1/2 gallon once a week per 5 gallon pot doesn't sound like enough water.
My guess would either be under-watering, the soil staying moist for too long because of the paper covering it, or just not fully soaking all of the roots and soil per watering from the small amount of water. I'm pretty new so wait until a more experienced grower chimes in, but it does look like a watering issue to me.




:whathesaid:
Water by weight man! Thats what I do .Sounds like not enough water when you water and too often. 4foot plants in full flower I was watering once a week but them big ass used that much. Your little bitches might not need water for two or as long as three weeks. Happen to me


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: budgrowerwannabe]
    #678992 - 07/23/13 06:49 AM (6 years, 5 months ago)

Another reason why small jumps in pot size are more beneficial. At the size they are now a 1 gallon would have been easier to control water consumption rather than having a boggy perimeter and a dry center till the roots grow into the space. I still think they are too young to feed the AK might be ok with it but that purple may just be sensitive.


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: GreenHorns]
    #679507 - 07/28/13 02:39 PM (6 years, 5 months ago)

>> Another reason why small jumps in pot size are more beneficial.

The 7th "backup" seedling, which I will be maturing anyway, is now in a one gallon pot per your advice.  I haven't used any nutrients at all throughout the lifecycle of that one.  It's taken to the transplant well, but I'm concerned about the pale, verging-on-yellow colour in its leaves.  It was this colour which prompted me to feed 1/4 nutes with the previous generation, and while that certainly greened up the leaves it also seemed to create other problems.


>> I still think they are too young to feed the AK might be ok with it but that purple may just be sensitive.

I just watered recently, this time without nutrients.

After more than a week without watering, the pots were starting to feel quite dry.  Their weight was reaching parity with the dry control pot, and the top 3-4 inches were dry as could be.  Prompted by this, I watered the AK and three of the Royals.  The healthiest plants I decided to push back another day or two just to see.

The watered plants received 2L (0.5 gallons) each yesterday, and the same amount again today.  That feels like not enough water--and there's been no runoff at all--but after all the languishing they went through last week, I'm being quite cautious.



Edited by Ped (07/28/13 03:12 PM)


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: Ped]
    #679515 - 07/28/13 03:13 PM (6 years, 5 months ago)

July 28 update:

It's like there's just too much foliage.  Some of the bottom leaves are virtually the same size as the rest of the plant.  Inside, it is so dense that I've deployed skewers to force some foliage aside to let the light in.  I've pruned off a healthy amount too, but it just keeps growing.  Vertical growth is pretty slow, but the expansion of foliage is just relentless - is this typical?  Is this desirable?  I've heard people say that bushy plants are a good thing, but what good is bushiness if no light can get to the bush?





Day 21:




Day 22:






Day 23:




Topping

I gave the girls a top/FIM a few days ago.  I'm not certain I did it correctly.





So that's the latest.  Things seem OK - the plants seem healthy and happy, in spite of their apparently slow growth.  I'll be installing a new fan tomorrow.  It has double the flow capacity of the existing fan: this should finally bring the airflow up to an appropriate level.


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Edited by Ped (07/28/13 03:15 PM)


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: Ped]
    #679527 - 07/28/13 04:45 PM (6 years, 5 months ago)

Damn they look very healthy! The excess foliage is in no way bad. Most lower branches will be trimmed off anyway when they stretch in flower. Just keep letting them go to town.


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: GreenHorns]
    #679530 - 07/28/13 06:38 PM (6 years, 5 months ago)

Sweet, that's good to hear.  I guess I'll feed them next watering?  Seems like I want to observe a healthy transpiration rate before I start feeding.  Last time all the water just hang around in the pots and as Magash said, it no doubt contributed to my problems earlier.


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: Ped]
    #679532 - 07/28/13 06:50 PM (6 years, 5 months ago)

Yeah they seem quite lush and healthy now. By any standards in the veg stage ready for the nutes.


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: GreenHorns]
    #679788 - 07/30/13 02:23 PM (6 years, 5 months ago)

>> By any standards in the veg stage ready for the nutes.

Yeah, they sucked up the meagre water I gave them so fast that it was time for another watering this morning.  I gave them the nutes this time; so far they are loving it.

Ever since I installed the 435 CFM fan (previous fan 269), it's like night and day.  Slow and stunted has become rapid and vibrant.  Things have really taken off.  No more heat problems either. 

Humidity is a problem at 70%.  It's constantly humid here.  I'm not sure what I'm going to do about that when it comes time to flower.



Day 25



This seedling has taken well after transplant and is now in the veg stage.  I'm hoping she'll catch up with her sisters before it comes time to bloom.




This plant, which I had affectionately named "Runty", is beginning to defy her title.  She's still a bit squatter than the rest, but she's rapidly erasing that distinction.




This is the AK47 auto.  She's starting to preflower, I think.






Group photo.

Questions:

When the auto AK goes to flower, I don't intend to change the photoperiod, as I have plenty of vertical room to veg the Royals.  With that said, is there any benefit to swapping out the FloraSun MH with the Eye Hortilux HPS at that time?  If I change the spectrum more to the red side while keeping the 18/6 cycle, does this have any potential to confuse the rest of the plants?  Or should I just let the AK flower under the MH?  Will this hurt her yield?


Edited by Ped (07/30/13 02:31 PM)


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: Ped]
    #679907 - 07/31/13 10:35 AM (6 years, 5 months ago)

man the really take off! :cookiemonster:


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: funnyfart]
    #679928 - 07/31/13 01:02 PM (6 years, 5 months ago)

Yeah totally...

My only problem right now is humidity.  There's way too much, and it's relentless here.  Right now the relative humidity outside the house is 85-90%.  The dehumidifier inside the house brings this down to about 75-80%, running 24/7.  Inside the tent it's between 65% and 75%.  With the AK going to flower, I know this humidity level is asking for problems.

I bought some damp rid and put it around the intake.  It basically does nothing at all.  I don't know what else to do.


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: Ped]
    #679960 - 07/31/13 03:29 PM (6 years, 5 months ago)

They need the spectrum from the mh for the strong vegetative growth. And visa Versa. They will show preflowers through the rest of the veg process and still keep growing. I'd say keep doing what your doing another week or 2 then flip the cycle and bulbs. Some of them stretch real good make sure you've got at least height for them to double.


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: GreenHorns]
    #679965 - 07/31/13 04:44 PM (6 years, 5 months ago)

>> They need the spectrum from the mh for the strong vegetative growth. And visa Versa. They will show preflowers through the rest of the veg process and still keep growing. I'd say keep doing what your doing another week or 2 then flip the cycle and bulbs. Some of them stretch real good make sure you've got at least height for them to double.

Right on.  I've got about 4.5' vertical space yet, tons of room.  One of my plants is an autoflower, though.  It's going to start flowering pretty soon here I bet, no matter what bulb I've got going.  I'm curious if I should put the HPS bulb in there to give it the spectrum it wants for that phase, or if that will cause a counterproductive amount of stretch in the other 5 plants before I go to flip them.

Seems like I definitely want to keep them pretty squat until they're ready for the flip.  Unless flowering under an MH is a major faux-pas, I think I'll just let it do its thing.

To deal with the excess humidity, I was thinking about scaling up this carbon filter tek, using mesh baskets 14" tall and 12" diameter, and substituting silica gel in place of the carbon.  The intent is to scrub the moisture from the intake in the same way that the carbon scrubs the odour from the exhaust. 

I'll be building that tomorrow.  It's a long shot, but better than spending more money on a damn power-sucking humidifier.  Thoughts?


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: Ped]
    #679978 - 07/31/13 05:42 PM (6 years, 5 months ago)

Oh I forgot about the auto in there. Magash would know for sure about that one. My guess is hit it with the mh spectrum the whole way through if you can pull it off without negitiey effecting the other non autos.
You can buy dehumidifiers that pull the moisture from the room. You just empty a little reservoir every couple days or so when its full.


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: GreenHorns]
    #679981 - 07/31/13 05:47 PM (6 years, 5 months ago)

>> You can buy dehumidifiers that pull the moisture from the room. You just empty a little reservoir every couple days or so when its full.

Yeah I've got one in the room outside the tent.  It runs almost constantly, filling its 10L reservoir every 2-3 days.  It barely makes a dent.  I can't run it inside the tent because it dumps out a lot of heat, too.


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: Ped]
    #679984 - 07/31/13 05:52 PM (6 years, 5 months ago)

:raisemyglass:


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: UltimateDevotion]
    #679989 - 07/31/13 06:53 PM (6 years, 5 months ago)

How big is it? Can it pull air from the tent via one of the I'm sure many ports it has? If that won't work I'd be very curious to see your idea in action.


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: GreenHorns]
    #680001 - 07/31/13 07:49 PM (6 years, 5 months ago)

Here's the beast:





It's this huge, growling brown monster of inefficiency, belching heat constantly.  With electricity here up over $13, I'm not interested in running a dehumidifier, new or old, and I'm certainly not interested in running two of them.

The tent has two ports - one for the intake and one for the exhaust.  There is another port up in the ceiling for the electrical, but that's sealed up tight.  The only option would be to run the thing inside the tent itself, which I'm sure would only serve to jack up the juice bill even higher while at the same time creating a heat problem.

I'll have the "damp-scrubber" attached tomorrow afternoon; we'll see how that goes.




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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: Ped]
    #680012 - 07/31/13 08:27 PM (6 years, 5 months ago)

Yeah and that thing takes up a lot of space in sure.


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: Ped]
    #680095 - 08/01/13 04:58 PM (6 years, 5 months ago)

Well, it works, and was worth the effort and expense.  I was hoping to shave 20 points off the rH with this, but I guess I'll have to settle for 14.  Before installing this device, rH was reading 69%.  It is now at 55%.


Ped's DIY Humidity Scrubber

Concept:

Two wire mesh wastebaskets are used to create a double-walled mesh canister.  The space between the walls is filled with silica gel cat litter, a highly absorbent, low-density material.  Its large granules allow air to move through it fairly readily.

Silica gel holds 40%-50% of its weight in moisture.  12 lbs of silica gel will capture 5-6 lbs of moisture before saturation, at which point the canister can be emptied, and the silica gel baked to drive out the moisture.  The reusability of the silica makes it an economical option for people whose humidity exceeds their budget.

This can also be used to make a home-made carbon filter.  Just substitute activated carbon instead of silica.



Materials:

12 lbs silica gel - I used Fresh4Life silica cat litter
Two wire mesh wastebaskets of different sizes - mine are 11" and 9" diameter
8" to 6" reducer
Foil pizza pan
Pre-filter medium, any department store
Tuck Tape




To extend the 8"-6" reducer to 9"-6", I cut a 6" hole in this foil pizza pan and taped it to the end of the reducer.  This also makes a handy "lid", holding the inner wall in place, and making it easy to remove for swapping out the silica.  The ends of the pizza pan are rolled around the outer wall to create an adequate seal.





I wrapped this with cheese cloth to cut down on the silica dust.  You can skip this step if you sift the larger granules out of your silica and use only those.




Simply plunk the inner basket inside the outer basket and pour the silica gel around the sides.  Fill it up all the way, naturally.




Wrap the exterior in pre-filter padding and you're good to go.  Now just connect the duct work.




I used a booster fan, as this does restrict the airflow a bit.  Next time, I will be sifting out the smaller silica granules, using only the larger ones.  This should minimize the airflow restriction.  Right out of the gate, this little mod seems to be effective at reducing the humidity inside the tent by 10-15%.  This is not a perfect solution, but should help prevent the humidity from getting out of control.  I imagine a two-stage system would be even more effective.


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: Ped]
    #680117 - 08/01/13 07:15 PM (6 years, 5 months ago)

Shit that should do it. So your plan is to replace the desiccant every so often or have a spare and swap it out to allow the spent cartridge to dry out?


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: GreenHorns]
    #680125 - 08/01/13 07:37 PM (6 years, 5 months ago)

Yeah I have a second 12lb bag of silica.  Once the first batch is spent, I'll remove the canister, empty it out onto a pan, and refill it with the fresh stuff.  I'll either wait for a dry day (they do happen) and just leave it out in the sun, or if need be I can bake it, after which it'll be good as new.  Rinse repeat.


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: Ped]
    #680138 - 08/01/13 08:53 PM (6 years, 5 months ago)

Very creative. I like the idea. Would have been ideal for me when I was by the coast.


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: GreenHorns]
    #680304 - 08/03/13 12:20 PM (6 years, 5 months ago)

Well, I need some stretch because the foliage is getting insane.  The plants continue to bush out, vertical growth remains slow, and they're beginning to crowd each other out.

I switched to the Eye Hortilux SuperHPS at the start of today's light cycle, hoping that the redder spectrum would start brining the girls up.  It's running a lot hotter than the FloraSun MH.  Temps inside the tent are 31C (87 F) right now.  The AK doesn't seem to mind, but the Royals seem unhappy.  Dropping the wattage to 750 doesn't seem to help at all. 

The ballast is putting out a lot more EM radiation with this bulb too.  It knocked out my WiFi, forcing me to log into the router by hardline to change the wireless control channel.  The EM interference is clearly detectable on AM radio more than a block away.

I'm not sure what to do.


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: Ped]
    #680336 - 08/03/13 08:47 PM (6 years, 5 months ago)

Wow that's wacky I haven't ever heard of that.


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: GreenHorns]
    #680365 - 08/04/13 10:48 AM (6 years, 5 months ago)

Today is much better.  I was reading on Eye's website that all HID bulbs have a "break in period".  This makes sense:  heightened resistance in the first few dozen hours generates more heat.  Today the bulb is putting out a lot less heat, and temperatures are much more manageable.  The EM interference coming from the ballast has also narrowed to within the property line.  The bulb is coming up on 36 hours total uptime now.

I had some fun with panoramas today:




Even with only limited experience so far, I must say: the Eye Hortilux SuperHPS presents itself as one hell of a bulb.  I have to wear sunglasses in there, otherwise I come out virtually blind. 

The plants have a footprint of about 15 square feet.  At 145,000 initial lumens, the bulb is dumping 9,666 lumens/sq.ft. (60 watts/sq.ft) right now.  They cost a little more, but so far it sure seems worth the expense to me.



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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: Ped]
    #680529 - 08/05/13 03:37 PM (6 years, 5 months ago)

A transformer nearby was struck by lightning today, knocking out the power for almost three hours.  Today being a civic holiday, I was home to manage the situation, bringing the girls upstairs to the nearest window.







I've read that power failures can confuse the plants, causing them to misapprehend what time of year it is, leading to hermaphrodites.  Moving them to the window seemed like the best option.

After the power was restored, I took the opportunity to give the tent a good clean and install a couple more circulators before moving the plants back in.  Literally ten minutes after I had everything back up and running, the power failed a second time.  It continued to oscillate off and on like this a third and fourth time.

Knowing this to be hard on my bulb and ballast, I did this:



Some pathetic CFL's and an even more pathetic tube.  Just trying to keep them in daylight mode.  They had an hour of this before I finally felt confident in the power company again.  What a pain in the ass!

Things seem to be stable now.  How much stress was this on my girls?


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Edited by Ped (08/05/13 03:54 PM)


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: Ped]
    #680550 - 08/05/13 06:44 PM (6 years, 5 months ago)

I wonder what's up with this?





These are from two separate plants.  Both of them Royals.  What strikes me as odd is how these symptoms only appear in exactly the locations pictured here, not anywhere else on the plant (save for a few minor chlorosis spots probably related to excess nutrients).

I have still yet to give them a full strength feeding.  They seem too sensitive for it, reacting negatively with 75% or even 50% strength nutes.


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: Ped]
    #680803 - 08/07/13 09:56 PM (6 years, 5 months ago)

The AK's flowers are coming along great.  I'm surprised at all the side-branching, as I thought autos were light on that.

The rest of the plants (The Royals) developed some problems.  I posted the worst of it above.  After some research, a strong possibility of micronutrient deficiency emerged.  My soil, Sunshine Mix #4, has only sphagnum peat moss, coarse perlite, dolomite, and a starter nutrient charge with a bit of gypsum.  It is basically deficient in every other respect, and since I'm watering with RO water and basic macro-nutes, as time progresses it seems to make sense that micronutrient deficiencies would emerge, specifically in zinc.

To address this, I bypassed my water softener and collected 2L of water directly from the well.  This water is extremely hard, and extremely rich in minerals and metals.  Because of this, I diluted this two litres into 48 litres of RO water, and distributed this between all 6 plants.  I also added 100mL to a 1L foliar spray with SuperThrive and light macronutrients, and have been spraying the underside of the foliage each morning about 20 minutes before the light kicks in.

They have responded well.  Leaves are firmer, their colour is healthier, and growth has resumed the pace I'd come to expect.  With that said, I'm not totally clear this has anything to do with the introduction of well water.  Since I did not add any macronutrients this time around, it may just be that they're happy with being flushed.

I've decided to initiate the flowering of the Royals at the end of week 5.  Beginning Friday, I will be switching to the HPS bulb, and begin trimming half hours off the light cycle each day until 12/12 is reached.  I'm not sure if this is necessary, but it does seem like a good way to minimize the stress of the adjustment while still getting the most out of the final week of veg.


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Edited by Ped (08/24/13 03:11 PM)


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Re: Medical Grow - Romulan, Royal Medic - 1000 watt MH/HPS - June 26 [Re: Ped]
    #683812 - 08/29/13 10:18 PM (6 years, 4 months ago)

It's been quite a while since the last update, but there's been very little to report!  Basically just day-by-day progress, nothing remarkable to report.

The AK's just about ready for harvest, though!  And the Royal's, now over three feet fall, are starting to bloom.

Pics:


AK-47, about a week before harvest.  When it chop-time comes, I've decided to skip curing and drying her, and to instead process the entire plant into a topical anti-inflammatory salve immediately.  By skipping decarb, and by using a low-temp ethanol extraction, the idea is to imbue a transdermal gel with high concentrations of THCA, a powerful anti-inflammatory with no psychotropic properties.


Royal Medic, 38". 

Toward the end of the stretch period, two of the Royals started showing cal-mag deficiency.  I added a cal-mag supplement to the watering regimen and have been foliar-feeding the undersides of the lower foliage with a cal-mag spray 3-4 times a day.  The stems are still a little floppy and may still require some support, but every day is an incremental improvement.  My sense is this will probably hurt yield in the end, as the plants will be putting energy into playing catch-up with their stem structure at the same time they're producing buds.

It was a valuable lesson, though.  I learned that calcium and magnesium are essential for stem and branch-building, and that these are locked out when soil pH dips below 6.6.  My runoff has been consistently testing a shade below this, but since it was still within the proper range I thought nothing of it.  Now I know:  after the flip, bump the pH up to around 7.  After the stretch, ease it back down to normal.

For all the rookies out there who might peruse this thread, this chart was quite illuminating for me:



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