Home | Community | Message Board


World Seed Supply
Please support our sponsors.


Welcome to the Growery Message Board! You are experiencing a small sample of what the site has to offer. Please login or register to post messages and view our exclusive members-only content. You'll gain access to additional forums, file attachments, board customizations, encrypted private messages, and much more!

Shop: PhytoExtractum Maeng Da Thai Kratom Leaf Powder   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order   Kraken Kratom Red Vein Kratom   North Spore North Spore Mushroom Grow Kits & Cultivation Supplies   Original Sensible Seeds Bulk Cannabis Seeds   MagicBag.co All-In-One Bags That Don't Suck

Jump to first unread post Pages: 1 | 2 | Next >  [ show all ]
Some of these posts are very old and might contain outdated information. You may wish to search for newer posts instead.
OfflineDJ_avocado
myco-botanist
 User Gallery

Registered: 11/21/09
Posts: 147
Last seen: 12 years, 8 days
GRow ROom DEsign - Improvements?
    #320064 - 11/22/09 05:03 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

After a lot of research, I trashed my plans to grow with LEDs and decided on MH/HPS.  There are still a few things that have eluded me in my quest for knowledge.

THis is my plan..  4x4x6.5 ft grow tent with a 1000w MH/HPS convertable ballast for vegging with MH and flowering with HPS. I'm a little confused when it comes to reflectors and cooling.  I know I can rig a good exhaust (shouldn't be hard, the tent comes with holes), but I'm unaware how much air should be used to cool the light.  My grow friend mentioned how important it is to blow carbon filtered air through the reflector to keep the bulb from exploding...?!?!?!.

If I use a reflector, that is not air cooled, and I rig up a GOOD exhaust sucking all the air from the top of the tent into an attic, is that enough to cool the light or do I need to have ventilation AND a fan on the light?

Are aircooled reflectors worth it or necessary?

Any input would be greatly appreciated.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offline81renaissance
Coachella '13 KKOTY
Male


Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 4,182
Loc: State of Mind Flag
Last seen: 1 month, 13 days
Trusted Cultivator
Re: GRow ROom DEsign - Improvements? [Re: DJ_avocado]
    #320091 - 11/22/09 05:48 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

:lol: Not important to "blow carbon filtered air" at all.  That's just silly. 
As far as air movement is concerned, you do want an oscillating fan or some other method of moving air around your plants to keep them moving and help them develop strong stems.  If you have a good exhaust, and a clear intake then the temps in your tent should be okay.


--------------------
"So it goes."
-Kurt Vonnegut


BlueBerry_Swisher said:I want French fries. No, I want a penis French. Thank you. I'm so excited. I can not contain myself. Now I eat chocolate. It is so good. I'm trying to rub it all over myself. And then lick. Now I need a hot shower. The end.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleDataM
That Guy
Male


Registered: 08/12/08
Posts: 3,975
Loc: Southwestern US Flag
Re: GRow ROom DEsign - Improvements? [Re: 81renaissance]
    #320171 - 11/22/09 08:31 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

well as far as the air flow is concerned...

if you want the temperature in the tent to never exceed 80 degrees F, you will set that as your exhaust temperature.

Then you can take the temperature of your air outside of the tent, we'll assume 70 degrees F for the inlet temp.

And knowing the humidity the of the exhaust and the outside air will aid in the accuracy of this. But for this I will assume a 5% increase in humidity between the inlet air and the outlet air...just to demonstrate the effect it has.I will use 45% RH inlet and 50% RH outlet for this.

Using a Psychrometic Chart for Air at 1 atmosphere of pressure, you can look up the enthalpy of your inlet and exit conditions.

Inlet enthalpy: 38 KJ/KG of dry air
Outlet enthalpy: 54 KJ/KG of dry air

Using this, you can assume a 1000W input of heat energy to the system from the light, which is equal to 1 KJ/s.

You can then plug these into the equation for heat loss through the air flow, where m = mass flow rate of dry air, and Q equals the heat flow out of the system:

Q = m (54 - 38)

substituting 1 KJ/s for Q, we find that m = .0625 kg dry air/second

from the psychrometric chart at the temp and RH of the exhaust, we find that the specific volume of the exhaust is .864 meters cubed/KG dry air.

and by multiplying m by the specific volume, we then find the volumetric flow rate of the exhaust needs to be .054 meters cubed / second.

This then converts to 114.4 cubic feet per minute, or about 115 CFM minimum.

Obviously, no one should run at the absolute minimum, and differences in inlet and outlet temps and humidity will effect the required flow rate, and this flow rate does not take into account the actual rate of water loss from the plant...so in order to keep the humidity down you may need to run higher flow rates.

If you need anymore help with this method or have questions feel free to ask.

Hope this helps, :cool::thumbup:
agmotes165


--------------------
“The Universe is under no obligation to make sense to you” -NDT

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineDJ_avocado
myco-botanist
 User Gallery

Registered: 11/21/09
Posts: 147
Last seen: 12 years, 8 days
Re: GRow ROom DEsign - Improvements? [Re: Data]
    #320364 - 11/23/09 01:23 AM (14 years, 4 months ago)

hmmm...I concur. Thanks! I can't wait to hook it up. :grin:

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleDataM
That Guy
Male


Registered: 08/12/08
Posts: 3,975
Loc: Southwestern US Flag
Re: GRow ROom DEsign - Improvements? [Re: DJ_avocado]
    #320388 - 11/23/09 05:22 AM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Ive also heard that replacing the entire volume of your grow room every minute usually works fine...and would probably be a lot easier to calculate haha

peace
agmotes165


--------------------
“The Universe is under no obligation to make sense to you” -NDT

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflinePilze
Funky Monk


Registered: 10/11/09
Posts: 770
Last seen: 10 years, 9 months
Re: GRow ROom DEsign - Improvements? [Re: DJ_avocado]
    #320413 - 11/23/09 10:49 AM (14 years, 4 months ago)

are you talking about those sun huts?



i want to get the 4'x4'x7'

Edited by Pilze (11/23/09 11:07 AM)

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineDJ_avocado
myco-botanist
 User Gallery

Registered: 11/21/09
Posts: 147
Last seen: 12 years, 8 days
Re: GRow ROom DEsign - Improvements? [Re: Pilze]
    #321350 - 11/25/09 01:51 AM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Yea thats the one.  4x4x7.  I hope I win that...I bid on an inline aircooled fan.  I don't know much about where the air is moving or if the aircooling even doubles as exhaust but my main concern is can an aircooled inline light be set up in a 4x4 space??? I already bid on the lights and stuff, the dimensions of the reflector are 18x15x7.5 in.  To rig up the cooling looks like it takes more space than I have, does anyone know for sure?  Also, if it doubles as exhaust too, that would be great...

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflinePilze
Funky Monk


Registered: 10/11/09
Posts: 770
Last seen: 10 years, 9 months
Re: GRow ROom DEsign - Improvements? [Re: DJ_avocado]
    #321411 - 11/25/09 10:15 AM (14 years, 4 months ago)

i would get one of those reflectors that has a place to connect the air tubes to blow air through it, so you can put the light closer to the plants. then all i would worry about is air flow on the plants and that wouldnt be too hard.

new air comes in through the bottom, up through the plants, and out the top.

i cant wait to get a sun hunt. i only have a 150 watt HPS right now. its not like thats going to do a hell of a lot, but im going to get what i can from it while i safe up money for a 4-600 watt HPS

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleHarry_Ba11sachM
cannoisseur
 User Gallery


Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 11,753
Loc: Nepal Flag
Trusted Cultivator
Re: GRow ROom DEsign - Improvements? [Re: Pilze]
    #321415 - 11/25/09 10:27 AM (14 years, 4 months ago)

I have 2 of these; http://www.hydrofarm.com/pb_detail.php?itemid=4173

not the highest quality I'm sure, but it's air cooled, sealed glass lens, and was only $90 each.


--------------------

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflinePilze
Funky Monk


Registered: 10/11/09
Posts: 770
Last seen: 10 years, 9 months
Re: GRow ROom DEsign - Improvements? [Re: Pilze]
    #321416 - 11/25/09 10:31 AM (14 years, 4 months ago)

ooo thats very nice... thanks for the link. :smile:

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleHarry_Ba11sachM
cannoisseur
 User Gallery


Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 11,753
Loc: Nepal Flag
Trusted Cultivator
Re: GRow ROom DEsign - Improvements? [Re: Pilze]
    #321418 - 11/25/09 10:35 AM (14 years, 4 months ago)

if you're looking for a 600W still I also have a link for a 600W lumatek (VERY nice light) for only $150


--------------------

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflinePilze
Funky Monk


Registered: 10/11/09
Posts: 770
Last seen: 10 years, 9 months
Re: GRow ROom DEsign - Improvements? [Re: Harry_Ba11sach]
    #321654 - 11/25/09 05:13 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

ooo that sounds nice. can i see???

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offline81renaissance
Coachella '13 KKOTY
Male


Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 4,182
Loc: State of Mind Flag
Last seen: 1 month, 13 days
Trusted Cultivator
Re: GRow ROom DEsign - Improvements? [Re: Pilze]
    #321719 - 11/25/09 09:11 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Harry: when you were growing with the tent, did you just set up the fan exhaust, and do the passive intake? Are there pictures of your setup somewhere?
My grow space just got a whole lot smaller (as in about 2x2) and I'm trying to figure out the best way to use it.  Might be my first ever SCROG grow!


--------------------
"So it goes."
-Kurt Vonnegut


BlueBerry_Swisher said:I want French fries. No, I want a penis French. Thank you. I'm so excited. I can not contain myself. Now I eat chocolate. It is so good. I'm trying to rub it all over myself. And then lick. Now I need a hot shower. The end.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleHarry_Ba11sachM
cannoisseur
 User Gallery


Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 11,753
Loc: Nepal Flag
Trusted Cultivator
Re: GRow ROom DEsign - Improvements? [Re: 81renaissance]
    #321758 - 11/26/09 12:34 AM (14 years, 4 months ago)

yep, I had a 95cfm squirrel cage fan that I had sealed on the exhaust, and then I left only one of the 2 velcro windows open and one of the weird little drawstring sleeves on the opposite side for maximum passive intake.

I found that that arrangement actually created enough wind inside the tent that I didn't even need another fan inside. the passive intake facilitated evapostranspiration, it was magnificent


--------------------

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineDJ_avocado
myco-botanist
 User Gallery

Registered: 11/21/09
Posts: 147
Last seen: 12 years, 8 days
Re: GRow ROom DEsign - Improvements? [Re: Harry_Ba11sach]
    #321925 - 11/26/09 12:51 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

So if I'm running a 1000w in a 4x4x7 tent, is a 6in vortex fan, (449cfm) and a small oscillating fan, just for a breeze,good enough passive intake? How about with a carbon filter?

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleHarry_Ba11sachM
cannoisseur
 User Gallery


Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 11,753
Loc: Nepal Flag
Trusted Cultivator
Re: GRow ROom DEsign - Improvements? [Re: DJ_avocado]
    #322014 - 11/26/09 02:56 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

lol dude you have 112 cubic feet. 449cfm is HUGE overkill, but I'm sure it'll only make the buds nicer. it's not so much overkill that'll it'll be bad, it's just about 5 times more than the minimum :smile:


--------------------

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineDJ_avocado
myco-botanist
 User Gallery

Registered: 11/21/09
Posts: 147
Last seen: 12 years, 8 days
Re: GRow ROom DEsign - Improvements? [Re: Harry_Ba11sach]
    #322022 - 11/26/09 03:15 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

I was kind of thinkin for overkill.:smirk: I figured it would keep everything way cool and ventilated.  How bout if i put the fan on a timer? maybe every other 5mins or something? Has that ever been done before or is it better to keep it on?

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Offline81renaissance
Coachella '13 KKOTY
Male


Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 4,182
Loc: State of Mind Flag
Last seen: 1 month, 13 days
Trusted Cultivator
Re: GRow ROom DEsign - Improvements? [Re: Harry_Ba11sach]
    #322231 - 11/27/09 10:44 AM (14 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

Harry_Ba11sach said:
yep, I had a 95cfm squirrel cage fan that I had sealed on the exhaust, and then I left only one of the 2 velcro windows open and one of the weird little drawstring sleeves on the opposite side for maximum passive intake.

I found that that arrangement actually created enough wind inside the tent that I didn't even need another fan inside. the passive intake facilitated evapostranspiration, it was magnificent




In the 2x2 how many plants did you have going?
I can't recall if you had a grow log...link if so?
good to hear that you were able to create enough air movement with just the passive.
To clarify then, you didn't duct/air cool your light; temps were controlled by the exhaust fan+passive intake.
Do you think its wise to max out the wattage inside the tent at 600 or could she handle a 1000w setup if you had a higher CFM fan?


--------------------
"So it goes."
-Kurt Vonnegut


BlueBerry_Swisher said:I want French fries. No, I want a penis French. Thank you. I'm so excited. I can not contain myself. Now I eat chocolate. It is so good. I'm trying to rub it all over myself. And then lick. Now I need a hot shower. The end.

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
OfflineDJ_avocado
myco-botanist
 User Gallery

Registered: 11/21/09
Posts: 147
Last seen: 12 years, 8 days
Re: GRow ROom DEsign - Improvements? [Re: 81renaissance]
    #322308 - 11/27/09 02:47 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

These are my final plans.  My only concern is the position of the carbon filter and the length of ducting used. There is also going to be an oscillating fan not shown in the pic.1) Will the 449cfm Vortex fan work well enough for passive ventilation and light cooling despite the sharp bends in the duct and its length into the attic?  I want to place the fan in the attic to reduce noise, my room is next to the front door.:grin: Should it be inside the tent?2) Noise reduction ideas? I was going to stuff foam or something into my windows but was wondering if anyone had any tips to muffle noise without sealing the room and probably making it real hot.3) Is the carbon filter ok there, over the light?

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
InvisibleHarry_Ba11sachM
cannoisseur
 User Gallery


Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 11,753
Loc: Nepal Flag
Trusted Cultivator
Re: GRow ROom DEsign - Improvements? [Re: 81renaissance]
    #322326 - 11/27/09 03:44 PM (14 years, 4 months ago)

holy shit man, 600W? I ran it with 250W of CFL's and 2 plants, and 3 more in solo cups (barely even count as plants in there)

I suppose you can try it, but that's a pretty frickin' insane amount of light for only 4 square feet

this is the only grow I did in it
http://www.growery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/251624/fpart/1/vc/1


--------------------

Extras: Filter Print Post Top
Jump to top Pages: 1 | 2 | Next >  [ show all ]

Shop: PhytoExtractum Maeng Da Thai Kratom Leaf Powder   Unfolding Nature Unfolding Nature: Being in the Implicate Order   Kraken Kratom Red Vein Kratom   North Spore North Spore Mushroom Grow Kits & Cultivation Supplies   Original Sensible Seeds Bulk Cannabis Seeds   MagicBag.co All-In-One Bags That Don't Suck


Similar ThreadsPosterViewsRepliesLast post
* taking the plunge for first time grow
( 1 2 all )
Ulala 13,214 32 01/29/10 05:30 PM
by Ulala
* Ideas for making my cabinet for a grow box? skuller512 688 0 09/15/15 02:23 AM
by skuller512
* Diffrent Grow Systems/Grow Methods dankakanat 17,450 9 04/19/13 08:43 PM
by dankakanat
* Grow Cabinet design general questions. Any advice welcome inthefl3sh 9,415 5 01/27/10 08:27 AM
by pha3r0
* First Grow - Outdoor, Greenhouse Ped 2,436 7 06/08/13 02:21 PM
by Ped
* New Grow Room Design - 400 W - peat soil - single container
( 1 2 all )
Annom 15,676 24 02/16/11 07:49 PM
by muse42
* Small hydro grow in fridge bI0HaZ 15,623 9 07/19/09 06:10 AM
by bI0HaZ
* First time closet stealth grow, advice wanted (pics)
( 1 2 all )
wensleydale 12,180 22 12/29/14 10:49 AM
by Chemical Addiction

Extra information
You cannot start new topics / You cannot reply to topics
HTML is disabled / BBCode is enabled
Moderator: FurrowedBrow, Magash, Data, Dr. Siekadellyk, phychotron
19,490 topic views. 0 members, 217 guests and 136 web crawlers are browsing this forum.
[ Show Images Only | Sort by Score | Print Topic ]
Search this thread:
High Mountain Gold Compost
Please support our sponsors.

Copyright 1997-2024 Mind Media. Some rights reserved.

Generated in 0.028 seconds spending 0.005 seconds on 14 queries.