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Offlineskullhuman
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Registered: 02/16/10
Posts: 90
Last seen: 6 years, 5 months
Light setup.. what do you think?
    #370958 - 02/22/10 09:05 PM (6 years, 9 months ago)

Alright, so here are a few different light setup ideas that could use your input.

1. Carbon Filter --> 400 W HPS Cool tube --> Duct --> Fan out
One exhaust in the entire cab which also serves to cool the light.  But the potential problem I see with this, is that perhaps particulate and such may be pulled from the filter and end up dirtying the light.  A hepa filter would handle this, but I don't really want to spend the bucks on that if unnecessary.

2. 400 W HPS Cool tube --> Duct --> Carbon Filter --> Fan out
As with prior setup, one single exhaust in the cab.  Duct and carbon filter are interchangeable in this sequence I suppose, but there are worries of pulling hot air through the filter.  What do you think?

3. Passive intake --> Duct --> 400 W HPS Cool tube --> Duct --> Fan out
The light would have its own ventilation separate from the rest of the cab.  Also, air coming from outside the cab may make for more efficient light cooling.  But this would require more fans, which translates to more bucks, because these things need to be quiet.  I'd even go so far as to say silent.  Also, an efficient fan is needed to cool the 400 W, so this method could get pricey.  Any suggestions on how to make this work with out spending $500?

So which of these would you prefer and why?

And some other questions..

Is it more sound proof to place the fan out before a duct in any of these sequences? How would this affect other aspects of the system? Would some air build up in the duct out and cause any possible problems?

Also, I understand these ducts should be coiled and what not, as not to allow light to escape through them.  Anything else one should know about light-proofing a vent?

And just how efficient of a fan is needed to cool a 400 W through a tube? How many CFM?

Aaaannnd.. a friend from Garden's Cure shared this experience about pushing air rather than pulling it to cool a fan:
"fans do seem have more suction than push force-- at room temp or lower--
but hot air propels itself and seems to need far more cfm and or ducting diameter to be adequately pulled than i currently have at least that's how i explain thinks to Self

like the heart, the primary force is in the contraction that pushes the heat thru wide open arteries --which then tugs harder at the chilled from the longer circuitry of more narrowly compressed veins"

Of course, the theory is just his own personal speculation, but what do others think of this? Any similar experiences? How many CFM's are needed to properly cool a 400 W by pulling air?


Edited by skullhuman (02/22/10 09:11 PM)


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InvisibleDrGreenThumb
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Registered: 08/09/08
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Re: Light setup.. what do you think? [Re: skullhuman]
    #371106 - 02/22/10 10:02 PM (6 years, 9 months ago)

Try this: Carbon filter > Fan > CoolTube > Duct out.

1. You want to pull air into your filter (not push through).
2. You want the fan BEFORE the cooltube, pushing through it. This keeps hot air from being sucked over the internal components of your fan. It also makes the fan more efficient by sucking cooler air.
3. Exhaust from the other side of the tube out of your space.

This is the ideal setup. :yesnod:


--------------------
“Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.” -Dr. Seuss


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Offlineskullhuman
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Re: Light setup.. what do you think? [Re: DrGreenThumb]
    #371178 - 02/22/10 10:59 PM (6 years, 9 months ago)

I see.  There'll be no problems cooling the light properly with that arrangement?


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InvisibleDrGreenThumb
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Re: Light setup.. what do you think? [Re: skullhuman]
    #371188 - 02/22/10 11:06 PM (6 years, 9 months ago)

Shouldn't be. Try to keep your sucting as straight as possible.


--------------------
“Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.” -Dr. Seuss


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Offlineskullhuman
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Re: Light setup.. what do you think? [Re: DrGreenThumb]
    #371215 - 02/22/10 11:30 PM (6 years, 9 months ago)

But if ducting is straight, will light not be emitted through it?

I also just read that one needs a fan that doesn't do more CFMs than the filter is capable of deodorizing.  Hadn't factored that in.  Can you offer any help there?


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OfflineBuddy Guy
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Re: Light setup.. what do you think? [Re: skullhuman]
    #371627 - 02/23/10 05:20 PM (6 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

skullhuman said:
Alright, so here are a few different light setup ideas that could use your input.

1. Carbon Filter --> 400 W HPS Cool tube --> Duct --> Fan out
One exhaust in the entire cab which also serves to cool the light.  But the potential problem I see with this, is that perhaps particulate and such may be pulled from the filter and end up dirtying the light.  A hepa filter would handle this, but I don't really want to spend the bucks on that if unnecessary.

2. 400 W HPS Cool tube --> Duct --> Carbon Filter --> Fan out
As with prior setup, one single exhaust in the cab.  Duct and carbon filter are interchangeable in this sequence I suppose, but there are worries of pulling hot air through the filter.  What do you think?

3. Passive intake --> Duct --> 400 W HPS Cool tube --> Duct --> Fan out
The light would have its own ventilation separate from the rest of the cab.  Also, air coming from outside the cab may make for more efficient light cooling.  But this would require more fans, which translates to more bucks, because these things need to be quiet.  I'd even go so far as to say silent.  Also, an efficient fan is needed to cool the 400 W, so this method could get pricey.  Any suggestions on how to make this work with out spending $500?

So which of these would you prefer and why?

And some other questions..

Is it more sound proof to place the fan out before a duct in any of these sequences? How would this affect other aspects of the system? Would some air build up in the duct out and cause any possible problems?

Also, I understand these ducts should be coiled and what not, as not to allow light to escape through them.  Anything else one should know about light-proofing a vent?

And just how efficient of a fan is needed to cool a 400 W through a tube? How many CFM?

Aaaannnd.. a friend from Garden's Cure shared this experience about pushing air rather than pulling it to cool a fan:
"fans do seem have more suction than push force-- at room temp or lower--
but hot air propels itself and seems to need far more cfm and or ducting diameter to be adequately pulled than i currently have at least that's how i explain thinks to Self

like the heart, the primary force is in the contraction that pushes the heat thru wide open arteries --which then tugs harder at the chilled from the longer circuitry of more narrowly compressed veins"

Of course, the theory is just his own personal speculation, but what do others think of this? Any similar experiences? How many CFM's are needed to properly cool a 400 W by pulling air?



  #3 is your best idea.

You calculate CFM's= Lenght times width times height. here is were you can look at all kinds of gear. www.HGTSupply.com. Figure that out and see what's up next.


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Offline81renaissance
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Registered: 04/20/08
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Re: Light setup.. what do you think? [Re: DrGreenThumb]
    #371712 - 02/23/10 08:04 PM (6 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

DrGreenThumb said:
Try this: Carbon filter > Fan > CoolTube > Duct out.

1. You want to pull air into your filter (not push through).
2. You want the fan BEFORE the cooltube, pushing through it. This keeps hot air from being sucked over the internal components of your fan. It also makes the fan more efficient by sucking cooler air.
3. Exhaust from the other side of the tube out of your space.

This is the ideal setup. :yesnod:




I disagree DGT...even thought the cooltube is a closed system, I prefer passive intake->hood->filter->exhaust fan, with the fan in the middle, you're losing efficiency because it has to not only pull air in over the filter, but then push the air through the ducting and light hood.  Fans are more effective at pulling air than pushing, so I always put my fan at the end of my system.


--------------------
"So it goes."
-Kurt Vonnegut


BlueBerry_Swisher said:I want French fries. No, I want a penis French. Thank you. I'm so excited. I can not contain myself. Now I eat chocolate. It is so good. I'm trying to rub it all over myself. And then lick. Now I need a hot shower. The end.


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Offlineskullhuman
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Last seen: 6 years, 5 months
Re: Light setup.. what do you think? [Re: 81renaissance]
    #371747 - 02/23/10 08:29 PM (6 years, 9 months ago)

And you have no problems with light temperature using that sequence 81?

And what of the warm air being pulled through the filter and as DGT mentioned, the internal components of the fan? See anything to worry about there?


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InvisibleDrGreenThumb
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Re: Light setup.. what do you think? [Re: skullhuman]
    #372212 - 02/24/10 06:58 AM (6 years, 9 months ago)

I totally agree that inline fans are more efficient at pulling than pushing. However, in a two reflector system or less, pushing air through a short run (reflector then out) shouldn't be a problem.

Whether or not the fan is more efficient pushing or pulling is irrelevant to an extent here. In order for the fan to work it has to push an equal of amount of air that it is pulling. It can't pull more air and push less; the amounts are equivalent.

The issue for me here is wear and tear on the fan. Seems that the components (bearings in particular) would last longer pulling cooler air as opposed to hot bulb air. I was also going to put my fan at the end of the run, but when someone pointed this out to me it got me thinking.


--------------------
“Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.” -Dr. Seuss


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Offline81renaissance
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Re: Light setup.. what do you think? [Re: DrGreenThumb]
    #372316 - 02/24/10 11:22 AM (6 years, 9 months ago)

The heat from the light becomes negligible in its effect on the fan in my system because of effective air exchange (about 3 per minute), meaning that the air flowing across my fan is only 8-10 degrees warmer than the air outside the cab-well within the working parameters for the fan.


--------------------
"So it goes."
-Kurt Vonnegut


BlueBerry_Swisher said:I want French fries. No, I want a penis French. Thank you. I'm so excited. I can not contain myself. Now I eat chocolate. It is so good. I'm trying to rub it all over myself. And then lick. Now I need a hot shower. The end.


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InvisibleDrGreenThumb
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Re: Light setup.. what do you think? [Re: 81renaissance]
    #372324 - 02/24/10 11:36 AM (6 years, 9 months ago)

This is from KaptKid's inline fan thread and my new official stance on fans (and things of that nature). Buddy was right on the spot!

Quote:

DrGreenThumb said:
Quote:

Buddy Guy said:
You guys are thinking to much. Quit sweating the small stuff...It is just a fan. Made by humans. It is not going to last forever. All I care about is spoiling my girls.  :facepalm3:




You're right. You're absolutely right. I don't know what the fuck I was thinking.

I'm just going to hook it up whatever way seems easiest. Who gives a shit??? That's what a WARRANTY is for. :grin:




--------------------
“Be who you are and say what you feel because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind.” -Dr. Seuss


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Offline81renaissance
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Re: Light setup.. what do you think? [Re: DrGreenThumb]
    #372343 - 02/24/10 12:19 PM (6 years, 9 months ago)

:lol: good one.

SOmetimes we really do get sucked into the details in this hobby, but you know what they say: the devil is in the details.


--------------------
"So it goes."
-Kurt Vonnegut


BlueBerry_Swisher said:I want French fries. No, I want a penis French. Thank you. I'm so excited. I can not contain myself. Now I eat chocolate. It is so good. I'm trying to rub it all over myself. And then lick. Now I need a hot shower. The end.


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Offlinepha3r0
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Registered: 12/21/09
Posts: 615
Last seen: 6 years, 7 months
Re: Light setup.. what do you think? [Re: 81renaissance]
    #372348 - 02/24/10 12:30 PM (6 years, 9 months ago)

exactly 81. besides it's a hobby, were sposed to waste money and do things wrong right :smile:

no but really this is the applicable part:
Quote:

81renaissance said:
The heat from the light becomes negligible in its effect on the fan in my system because of effective air exchange (about 3 per minute), meaning that the air flowing across my fan is only 8-10 degrees warmer than the air outside the cab-well within the working parameters for the fan.




as long as you plan for enough exhaust capacity the air should never be 'hot' just a bit warmer then what comes in. if the air is hot comming out you need more air flow. the point of exhausting right past your bulbs is to keep heat buildup from being a factor and increase bulb life. if air is moving that slow heat is building up outside the ventilation system also and your not saving any bulb life for sure.


--------------------
"The proverb warns that, "You should not bite the hand that feeds you." But maybe you should, if it prevents you from feeding yourself."
- Thomas Szasz

"if you arent good with electricity dont go touching it...ive electrocuted myself twice...its no fun"
- mhbound


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