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Invisiblecaptain.koons
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Registered: 06/25/08
Posts: 6,163
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any of you cats use soilless beds?
    #292102 - 10/05/09 02:26 AM (7 years, 2 months ago)

I'm thinking of using straight coco(preferably) or sunshine mix with perlite in a bed.

I'm not sure if I want to top feed (unlikely) or have it all flooded(:awesome:).

I plan to use fresh coco or sunshine mix each run but I'd use the coco as worm bedding or compost the sunshine mix for an outdoor grow maybe?

-

I may even consider clay pebbles as they're reusable and less messy. It just seems like a less bed like medium :P

OKAY so, anyone have experience with hydro beds?


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InvisibleFurrowedBrowM
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Re: any of you cats use soilless beds? [Re: captain.koons]
    #292308 - 10/05/09 03:33 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Why the preferance for flood/drain vs. top feed?  I've never messed with the coco beds before.  I like the top feed method.  I just get hesitant with the flood and drain because it just makes me nervous.  I have wires and shit all over the floor in the grow room and i live in an apartment and if something terrible happened causing a flood i'd be instantly fucked.


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Invisiblecaptain.koons
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Re: any of you cats use soilless beds? [Re: FurrowedBrow]
    #292351 - 10/05/09 06:23 PM (7 years, 2 months ago)

I've ran a lot of ebb&flow tables so I'm most confident with the results of this method, basically looking at the whole table as a 200gal pot.

A lot of people say top fed is better for coco and that bottom fed coco is stupid because coco wants to drain, yata yata... but every competent grower I've seen has got excellent results with flooded coco. I want to try it with a bed.

I may try sunshine mix because I want to see if I like sunshine more than coco. Busting apart bricks of coco is friggin shitty, and the good coco is more expensive than hookers.

Ebb&Flow isn't dangerous for flooding. You have usually multiple overflows so any spillage goes right back into your reservoir. The only way I can see spillage is your reservoir leaking. I lay out some thick ass poly on my floor anyways, so it would just pool up and I'd go in with the hospital flanels. Also magash convinced me to make my own reservoirs which I made out of wood with silicone seals and lined with heavy duty insulation plastic for good measure.


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OfflineKine
Registered: 11/25/08
Posts: 374
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Re: any of you cats use soilless beds? [Re: captain.koons]
    #293186 - 10/07/09 04:30 AM (7 years, 2 months ago)

IMO; shouldnt matter top feed or flood.  If anything top feed would be worse cause you can EASILY get air pockets and such.  Flooding is just that... FLOODING the table.  Thus you get water to the top... what would be the problem with it draning?  Flooding would ensure full field cap with even draining; Flood table with Coir i think would be excellent!

How much are you paying for your golden coir?  And why are you breaking it apart before wetting it? Brick + 5 oz boiling water = field cap brick that falls apart...


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Invisiblecaptain.koons
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Re: any of you cats use soilless beds? [Re: Kine]
    #293549 - 10/08/09 12:25 AM (7 years, 2 months ago)

a brick and 5 oz of water = field capacity?

I pay 12 bucks or something for 10kg of coco with a very good texture, almost all fiber I do however need to flush the shit out of it(not sure if I actually have to but it's just to prevent excess salt buildup or to remove them)

I pay something like 26-28$ per 50L bag of coco from canna

--

A lot of people have said for the longest time that coco has problems being bottom fed, water logging, uneven watering... whatever the problem might have been. Basically every hydroponics expert has told me in the past that coco ebb and flow sucks. There`s a few growers on icmag that have had crazy results.. I want to take it a step further and use beds for more root mass.

I may also just go with hydrotron beds.


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OfflineKine

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Re: any of you cats use soilless beds? [Re: captain.koons]
    #293553 - 10/08/09 12:32 AM (7 years, 2 months ago)

yup yup.  Not just pullin figures; i do a coir brick usually once a week.  Its been slow recently tho.  Each brick is diff; but 5 oz plus a brick is field cap for me.  And $12 is rediculous.  IDK, maybe one day i'll try expensive ass coir... but for now; the $2.50 brick's doin me good!


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Invisiblecaptain.koons
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Re: any of you cats use soilless beds? [Re: Kine]
    #293557 - 10/08/09 12:37 AM (7 years, 2 months ago)

12$ for a 10kilo or 25lb brick? Not one of those dinky bricks.

You must have some shitty fucking coco if a brick holds 5ounces of water at field capacity. and yes, im thinking of those tiny ass bricks im assuming you buy for 2.50$


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OfflineKine

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Re: any of you cats use soilless beds? [Re: captain.koons]
    #293615 - 10/08/09 03:26 AM (7 years, 2 months ago)

Call it what you will... My wallets a bit fatter; and... yup; everythings lookin premo.  Dont see the need to waste that much money...

And we're not growing shrooms... so honestly... whats it matter field cap?  You water plants... who cares how much it holds; as long as it retains water...

Sure... i didnt see the 10kilo in your post; but whatever.  Mine works; yours works... dont see what makes my shit stink more then yours but whatever gets you off at night...


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Invisiblecaptain.koons
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Re: any of you cats use soilless beds? [Re: Kine]
    #293628 - 10/08/09 04:24 AM (7 years, 2 months ago)

I could say I could fit a dozen grapefruits in your ass, and if I only get to 8... you still have grapefruits in your ass.

(Don't call it field capacity if it's not, a brick of coco holds a lot more than a mouthful of water)

It matters because the internet doesn't need any additional misinformation.


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OfflineKine

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Re: any of you cats use soilless beds? [Re: captain.koons]
    #293784 - 10/08/09 08:12 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Wow.  Get a clue.  Your worried about misinformation? Stop posting.  Your telling me im wrong when im clearly not.  You have no idea what brick, what size, or anything. You can look on the back of a brick; and it will tell you just how much water it takes jackass...

Besides... wanna be a dick about it?  You've never hit field cap.  I doubt anyone ever has or if so; it was a mistake.  You can come close; but unless you measure and scientifically do it... you'll never hit field cap.  Ether over or above.

Guess thats what i get for trying to reason with a coon... :angrykidface:

Just like you said foo, Dont call me wrong; if im not.


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InvisibleFurrowedBrowM
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Re: any of you cats use soilless beds? [Re: Kine]
    #293804 - 10/08/09 08:52 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Easy guys.  The topic of field capacity isn't relavent in this discussion so let's toss it out the door now before the digression furthers.  Captain is one of the most respected horticulturists on this site.  I respect and value his opinion.  I agree with him about the misinformation.  However, i just looked at your ratings Kine and it looks like you've spread the good word too.  Thanks!  So let's get back on topic...

I am a fan of hydroton so that's what i would recommend.  You can still flood and drain those as you both know.  I like it because it's clean.  That is until you have to take the plants up and clean up everything for the next run.  But i just like it's simplicity.


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Multidisciplinary Association for Psychedelic Studies - Become a member!
The Growery's Herb Museum (post #24)
I prefer dangerous freedom to peaceful slavery.
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Invisiblecaptain.koons
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Re: any of you cats use soilless beds? [Re: FurrowedBrow]
    #293813 - 10/08/09 09:32 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

Field capacity isn't very hard to achieve, if one wanted to be anal about it there's formulations one could follow, measuring water content isn't very hard either. I've done many mushroom substrates following x amount of water content. I don't see why you think this is a feat of science.


Field capacity.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Field_capacity

1kilo of dry coco coir = 15litres of coco at field capacity. The volume increases 15x and the weight about half that.

5ounces of water = roughly 141grams or 0.25lbs which would account for at least 80% of the weight of your brick regardless of size under the assumption it was brought to field capacity with 5ounces of water. Unless you buy 15 gram bricks of coco(a bit larger than a sugar cube), you sound fucking ridiculous. Small bricks of coco are generally 500grams and would make 7-9litres of field capacity coco.


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InvisibleFurrowedBrowM
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Re: any of you cats use soilless beds? [Re: captain.koons]
    #293815 - 10/08/09 09:39 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

:lol:  You didn't read a word I wrote, did ya?!


--------------------





Multidisciplinary Association for Psychedelic Studies - Become a member!
The Growery's Herb Museum (post #24)
I prefer dangerous freedom to peaceful slavery.
~ Thomas Jefferson ~


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Invisiblecaptain.koons
Failed Botanist
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Posts: 6,163
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Re: any of you cats use soilless beds? [Re: FurrowedBrow]
    #293820 - 10/08/09 09:46 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

I just addressed the post prior to yours first, honest.


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OfflineKine

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Re: any of you cats use soilless beds? [Re: captain.koons]
    #293901 - 10/08/09 11:40 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

... Funny story; qts not oz.  haha.  Good laugh eh? :malamute:


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InvisibleFurrowedBrowM
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Re: any of you cats use soilless beds? [Re: Kine]
    #293902 - 10/08/09 11:42 PM (7 years, 1 month ago)

:lol:  You guys are silly!


--------------------





Multidisciplinary Association for Psychedelic Studies - Become a member!
The Growery's Herb Museum (post #24)
I prefer dangerous freedom to peaceful slavery.
~ Thomas Jefferson ~


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Invisiblecaptain.koons
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Posts: 6,163
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Re: any of you cats use soilless beds? [Re: Kine]
    #294182 - 10/09/09 02:59 AM (7 years, 1 month ago)

So basically, nevermind. I'll leave it at that.


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