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OfflineDr. Awesome


Registered: 01/17/09
Posts: 55
Last seen: 2 years, 4 days
Closet grow recommendations? (UPDATE WITH PICS)
    #184096 - 01/18/09 04:21 AM (10 years, 9 months ago)

i am planning a closet grow for between 3-6 plants for personal use. the dimensions of the closet are pretty small..  22"x31" and 92" high.  i plan on running HID lighting and have found a sealed reflector that will allow me to vent all the heat from the bulb directly to my attic. i plan on lining the entire closet with aluminized mylar. and i will have a fan mounted to the wall to keep the air moving. i do have experience growing, but in much larger spaces.  so i am looking for some advice on the following topics:

bulb wattage:  i was thinking 400W would be more than adequate, but i am wondering if 400W is overkill in such a small space.. maybe 250W would be more than sufficient?  or would it even still be beneficial to go to 600W if i can sufficiently deal with the heat?

Heat:  i will be ducting air directly over the bulb through the canopy, will heat become an issue still?  should i create a fresh air supply through the floor, or draw air directly from within the closet?

smell:  if im venting directly to the attic, (and assuming that i am drawing air directly form the closet and not a fresh air source) will i need a carbon filter?  im doubting that even 6 small plants(should i chose to grow even that many) will create enough odor to alert neighbors and passers bye, but naturally i need to be certain.

im also contemplating an aeroponic/hydroponic system, since i have some rubbermaid totes that fit nearly perfectly in the closet. and could easily build one.

any thoughts or suggestions?


Edited by Dr. Awesome (03/11/09 01:39 PM)


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OfflineLucas
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Registered: 01/18/09
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Re: Closet grow recommendations? [Re: Dr. Awesome]
    #184118 - 01/18/09 05:10 AM (10 years, 9 months ago)

Check out Stealthhydroponics.com, very cheap systems. I myself went with the Dual Spectrum Bubbleponics™ Complete Kit. Also check out Attitude Seed Bank, if they have Lowlife's White Russian you should get some. Autoflowering and feminized, but the best thing is that they only grow to 18" perfect for closets i'd say.


--------------------
It's called 'Moonajuana', shiz will fluff you up!


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OfflineAKSE


Registered: 08/13/08
Posts: 287
Last seen: 5 years, 9 months
Re: Closet grow recommendations? [Re: Dr. Awesome]
    #184224 - 01/18/09 02:51 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

bulb wattage:  i was thinking 400W would be more than adequate, but i am wondering if 400W is overkill in such a small space.. maybe 250W would be more than sufficient?  or would it even still be beneficial to go to 600W if i can sufficiently deal with the heat?

In that small of an area, IMO a 250w should be plenty, especially for a small personal grow.  If you could somehow deal with the heat build up in that small space, you could possibly
go with a 400w, but 600w is out of the question.  Also, by HID I am assuming you are going to use HPS.

Heat:  i will be ducting air directly over the bulb through the canopy, will heat become an issue still?  should i create a fresh air supply through the floor, or draw air directly from within the closet?

If you have a draft/breeze on the bulb it will be fine.  As far as heat build up in the room, If you have venting out you don't really need to go through the trouble on making a floor-intake.  However if you do something like use the 400w, you may have to do this just to safely use the light.

smell:  if im venting directly to the attic, (and assuming that i am drawing air directly form the closet and not a fresh air source) will i need a carbon filter?  im doubting that even 6 small plants(should i chose to grow even that many) will create enough odor to alert neighbors and passers bye, but naturally i need to be certain.

Doesn't sound like it should be a problem.  If anything, it will be your attic or house that is odorous.  And if need be, just get a filter.  solved.

any thoughts or suggestions?

Well the hydroponic idea is totally up to you, It will be a bit more maintenance than soil, but outcome could potentially be better.  Either way, I'de stick with the 250w.

Good luck!:sun:


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OfflineDr. Awesome


Registered: 01/17/09
Posts: 55
Last seen: 2 years, 4 days
Re: Closet grow recommendations? [Re: AKSE]
    #184418 - 01/18/09 09:47 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

the reason i was thinking going with a 400W is just in case somewhere down the road i decide to move the grow into a larger space, such as a spare room, where a 250W simply wouldn't be enough.  another question, can you safely hook up a 250W bulb to a 400W ballast without blowing anything up :eek:?  also, i intend to by a digital ballast that is designed for both HPS and MH bulbs.

like i said i will be drawing air through a sealed reflector and venting directly to the attic so as i understand the majority of the heat from the bulb will never even make it into the rest of the closet. 

im quite confident that this system will be able to dissipate the heat from a 400W bulb

thanks for the feedback tho guys!!  any more would certainly be appreciated.

is there anything else important that im not taking into consideration?


also could any tell me what kind of harvests i could expect from 6 plants done up SOG style?  im not a complete noob like i said earlier i do have some grow experience, and im starting to really think i will be going with some sort of home made hydroponics unit of some type.  so what kind of results could i expect on average assuming everything goes well using a 400W MH for veg, and 400W HPS for flowering?


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OfflineAKSE


Registered: 08/13/08
Posts: 287
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Re: Closet grow recommendations? [Re: Dr. Awesome]
    #184439 - 01/18/09 10:21 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

If you have a lot of money to blow on this project, then go ahead and get a MH.  However, a HPS will do a fine job in veg and flowering.:thumbup:


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OfflineDr. Awesome


Registered: 01/17/09
Posts: 55
Last seen: 2 years, 4 days
Re: Closet grow recommendations? [Re: AKSE]
    #184440 - 01/18/09 10:22 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

i dont think money will be an issue :laugh:

it's only 1 more bulb anyway


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InvisibleDr. Penguin
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Re: Closet grow recommendations? [Re: Dr. Awesome]
    #185691 - 01/20/09 09:46 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

Your plan sounds great!

As for the variables, I would say definitely get both a 400w light and an carbon scrubber. You have plenty of space to dissipate the heat with a hood so you may as well get the most light possible.

As for the smell, I have a small cab with just 2 plants at a time; they give off quite a bit of smell, enough so that without a scrubber the entire house smells.

Make sure to have an intake near the bottom of your closet space.

Definitely try out hydro, you will love the results.

Keep us updated on your progress! :thumbup:


--------------------
* My Cab
* How to Build a Grow Tent
* Fan Speed Control 101
* Easy Butane Extraction

Not responsible for advice not taken.


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OfflineDr. Awesome


Registered: 01/17/09
Posts: 55
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Re: Closet grow recommendations? [Re: Dr. Penguin]
    #185695 - 01/20/09 09:49 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

if everything is being exhausted into the attic, and there is otherwise no access to the attic, will the smell become an issue? im more concerned about a neighbor or passer by getting a whiff.  im still thinking a scrubber is a sound investment.


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InvisibleFurrowedBrowM
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Re: Closet grow recommendations? [Re: Dr. Penguin]
    #185730 - 01/20/09 10:21 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

Quote:

Dr. Penguin said:
Your plan sounds great!

As for the smell, I have a small cab with just 2 plants at a time; they give off quite a bit of smell, enough so that without a scrubber the entire house smells.






Ugh!!  That statement scares me.


--------------------





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InvisibleDr. Penguin
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Re: Closet grow recommendations? [Re: FurrowedBrow]
    #186070 - 01/21/09 07:50 AM (10 years, 9 months ago)

Good plants reek. If you vent into the attic, most likely the neighbors wouldn't smell it but why take the chance? A cheap carbon scrubber will pay for itself with peace of mind alone.


--------------------
* My Cab
* How to Build a Grow Tent
* Fan Speed Control 101
* Easy Butane Extraction

Not responsible for advice not taken.


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Offlineirradiated
a day late and a dollar short

Registered: 04/21/08
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Re: Closet grow recommendations? [Re: Dr. Penguin]
    #186072 - 01/21/09 08:20 AM (10 years, 9 months ago)

what do you think of that carbon filter material? like the furnace filter kind?



i'm using this stuff right now but venting directly outside, so i'm not really sure how well it's working. I can't smell it outside but my face isn't next to the vent either and its freezing cold temperatures so i'm sure that helps remove the smell pretty quick.


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InvisibleDr. Penguin
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Re: Closet grow recommendations? [Re: irradiated]
    #186105 - 01/21/09 09:58 AM (10 years, 9 months ago)

I've never seen that type of filter. Is it activated carbon/charcoal? Is it made to reduce odor or something like that? I would be worried it wasn't the correct kind of material but if it was, you have quite a handy product imo.

Now you've got me thinking, I could use that to make an inline carbon scrubber; a goal of mine for quite a while.

:thumbup:


--------------------
* My Cab
* How to Build a Grow Tent
* Fan Speed Control 101
* Easy Butane Extraction

Not responsible for advice not taken.


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Offlineirradiated
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Re: Closet grow recommendations? [Re: Dr. Penguin]
    #186108 - 01/21/09 10:11 AM (10 years, 9 months ago)

The one I have is activated carbon, but they make similar ones with charcoal. Right now I have it pinned over the bathroom exhaust fan. I should go outside and do a smell test later on.

I also used it with a DIY can filter - wrapped this stuff around and duct taped it in place.


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InvisibleDr. Penguin
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Re: Closet grow recommendations? [Re: irradiated]
    #186141 - 01/21/09 11:47 AM (10 years, 9 months ago)

Wow, good find! Where did you pick that up? How much? Furnace section?


--------------------
* My Cab
* How to Build a Grow Tent
* Fan Speed Control 101
* Easy Butane Extraction

Not responsible for advice not taken.


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Offlineirradiated
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Re: Closet grow recommendations? [Re: Dr. Penguin]
    #186177 - 01/21/09 01:04 PM (10 years, 9 months ago)

yea i picked it up at home depot, furnace section. I think it was about $20 for a plastic bag that contained 3 fairly large pieces.


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OfflineDr. Awesome


Registered: 01/17/09
Posts: 55
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Re: Closet grow recommendations? [Re: irradiated]
    #200020 - 02/25/09 04:00 PM (10 years, 8 months ago)

well, after much research, i finally found all of the major equipment i will need for this project, and finally ordered it today, so in about 2 weeks it will feel like Christmas :laugh:

Lumatek 400 watt digital ballast, with both MH and HPS bulbs

silverstar 6" air-cooled reflector

roll of mylar for the walls inside.

ppm meter, since it is very crucial :wink:

as well as my nutrients for the hydro unit.  i went with Advanced Nutrients



since i am custom building my hydroponic unit i am curious as to what style of hydroponics everyone tends to favor, if the results are pretty much comparable regardless of what style.

so far my plan is to build the unit out of a black rubbermaid tote, with 6-8 3.5" net baskets, and 2x360 degree micro sprinklers inside for irrigation.  a 265gph water pump i think should be sufficient to power 2 of those mini sprinklers.

if i end up building teh hydro unit as planned, should i have the sprinklers on a timer?  or running constantly?

any thoughts? suggestions?


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OfflineDr. Awesome


Registered: 01/17/09
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Re: Closet grow recommendations? [Re: Dr. Awesome]
    #200253 - 02/26/09 02:07 PM (10 years, 8 months ago)

anyone???


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InvisibleDr. Penguin
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Re: Closet grow recommendations? [Re: Dr. Awesome]
    #200255 - 02/26/09 02:17 PM (10 years, 8 months ago)

The equipment list sounds great. As far as the hydro system, I prefer recirculating DWC buckets. I tried multiple plants in a single tub and its a pain in the ass if any of those seedlings turn out to be males because the root systems are inexorably tangled; you have to damage the roots to get him out. With recirculating DWC you can get away with a much smaller pump as well, for my four bucket system I use a tiny 60gph submersible.


--------------------
* My Cab
* How to Build a Grow Tent
* Fan Speed Control 101
* Easy Butane Extraction

Not responsible for advice not taken.


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OfflineDr. Awesome


Registered: 01/17/09
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Re: Closet grow recommendations? [Re: Dr. Awesome]
    #200258 - 02/26/09 02:31 PM (10 years, 8 months ago)

i'm actually going to be working from clones, so that shouldn't be a problem.  since im trying to pack as many plants into a reasonably small space, i don't think it makes sense for me to go with individual buckets for each plant.  i have a spare room that i could use for my grow, but then security becomes a much higher risk.

i also have to give props to you for your home made carbon filter there Dr. Penguin, i'll be building one of those myself.  how much carbon does it take to fill yours up?


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InvisibleDr. Penguin
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Re: Closet grow recommendations? [Re: Dr. Awesome]
    #200264 - 02/26/09 03:10 PM (10 years, 8 months ago)

Sounds like the tub will work great then. Maybe ditch the misters, but im a fan of very simple DWC systems; less parts, less leaks/clogging.

Thanks. It was pretty easy to build, maybe an hour total. It took about a gallon and a quarter to fill mine, but don't do what I did and buy 1 gallon and have to go back to fill the last bit. If you have time to wait for an order, I would get a five gallon bucket of the stuff from e-bay or someplace like that because it will drastically reduce the price. I paid more at the fish store for my carbon than for 5 gallon of it on e-bay. You will have to replace the carbon every other grow anyway so you may as well buy a lot of it.


--------------------
* My Cab
* How to Build a Grow Tent
* Fan Speed Control 101
* Easy Butane Extraction

Not responsible for advice not taken.


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OfflineDr. Awesome


Registered: 01/17/09
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Re: Closet grow recommendations? [Re: Dr. Penguin]
    #200279 - 02/26/09 04:45 PM (10 years, 8 months ago)

i was also considering purchasing an ultra sonic fog generator, you know, like the kind that some halloween decorations have..  or that you can buy at a petstore for reptiles and amphibian cages.  i've heard those are great and since there are no moving parts to maintain, and no hoses or fittings to clog, i could just use the pump for circulation.  what about an air pump and bubbler?


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InvisibleDr. Penguin
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Re: Closet grow recommendations? [Re: Dr. Awesome]
    #200371 - 02/26/09 10:40 PM (10 years, 8 months ago)

I looked into those, It seems like they would work to me. I would build a specialized unit for the fogger head though because the commercial ones wouldn't be able to hold enough liquid and might clog/fail.

As for the pump, go and by one with 2 air nozzles and a decent gallon rating from the pet store; no need for something fancy in a closet grow. The air stones now, those will cause heated debate. I have always used the cheap blue ones but the silica reusables are looking more and more appealing.


--------------------
* My Cab
* How to Build a Grow Tent
* Fan Speed Control 101
* Easy Butane Extraction

Not responsible for advice not taken.


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OfflineDr. Awesome


Registered: 01/17/09
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Re: Closet grow recommendations? [Re: Dr. Penguin]
    #200401 - 02/26/09 11:38 PM (10 years, 8 months ago)

you can actually get the fogger unit all by itself, you basically just set it in the reservoir and viola. i mean that's how all the halloween decorations work. 

something like this  but without lights of course. dont need any light on those roots :wink: http://www.mainlandmart.com/foggers.html

there nothing there to clog.  im begging my ex gf to sell me one she has for her halloween decorations but she wont budge :frown:

teh only think i guess i would really need to do is make a float for it so that it only sits an inch or so below the waters surface no matter what the nutrient solutions level is.  i think we might have been thinking of different kinds of foggers.


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InvisibleDr. Penguin
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Re: Closet grow recommendations? [Re: Dr. Awesome]
    #200465 - 02/27/09 01:03 AM (10 years, 8 months ago)

Nope, I knew exactly what you were talking about. The same fogger heads are in every cool mist humidifier, thats what I meant by commercial units.

I would build a blower for the head in any case though, not just set it in the rez with the plants. Two reasons: first the roots will grow into the solution eventually so you would need to aerate it, defeating the purpose IMO. Secondly because the roots will strangle the fogger by growing on top of it and such, clogging it.

All you would need for the blower though is a rez to float the fogger in like you mentioned, a lid for said rez, a hose (think vacume cleaner size) and a pc fan to blow air into the rez, forcing the mist up and into the sealed tub for your plant roots.


--------------------
* My Cab
* How to Build a Grow Tent
* Fan Speed Control 101
* Easy Butane Extraction

Not responsible for advice not taken.


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OfflineDr. Awesome


Registered: 01/17/09
Posts: 55
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Re: Closet grow recommendations? [Re: Dr. Penguin]
    #200468 - 02/27/09 01:21 AM (10 years, 8 months ago)

ahh, gotcha.  that makes sense.  i'm wondering how i would protect the pc fan from moisture, it would certainly be a risk of causing a short.  im not sure if a fan of any kind would even be necessary, unless im just not following you on this one.  i've seen one of those foggers EASILY fill a large rubbermaid tote (larger than what i intend to use) full of thick fog till it was spilling over the edge.  i see what you mean about protecting the head from being strangled by roots, but that should be an easy fix.

what about a funnel or something on that sort over the fogger head?  positioned with the spout of the funnel facing upward, it shoudl effectively keep the roots away from the unit, while at the same time causing the fog to erupt from the top of it volcano style.  not sure if that would work.. just kinda brainstorming ideas right now...

so just to see if im still at least partly on the same page, i could use a pump to keep the nutes circulating, air stones to aerate, as well as an ultrasonic fogger?


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InvisibleDr. Penguin
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Re: Closet grow recommendations? [Re: Dr. Awesome]
    #200500 - 02/27/09 08:08 AM (10 years, 8 months ago)

The pump would be unnecessary I think, but an airpump and fogger should work for you. As far as keeping the roots off the fogger, I guess you could just cover it with a net pot and manually remove and roots growing into it every couple of days. The funnel is a decent idea, but I think it would limit the amount of fog that can get out. One more thing to check into is the average particle size generated by those fogger heads. There is a water droplet size range (I believe ~5-50 microns) that functions best for aeroponic gardening, you want to make sure the fogger is in that range.


--------------------
* My Cab
* How to Build a Grow Tent
* Fan Speed Control 101
* Easy Butane Extraction

Not responsible for advice not taken.


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OfflineDr. Awesome


Registered: 01/17/09
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Re: Closet grow recommendations? [Re: Dr. Penguin]
    #200587 - 02/27/09 12:23 PM (10 years, 8 months ago)

ooh, that's something that didn't even really occur to me, (droplet size)  i'll definitely keep that in mind.  and the net pot idea sounds like it would work fairly well.  manually removing rots form it every few days doesn't seem like too much of a chore IMO. 

i should be able to keep the fog unit away from most of the hanging roots anyway, the reservoir should be large enough for me to space the plants enough that the fog head can go between them with minimal interference from roots.  but i will still cover it with a net pot just to be sure.


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OfflineDr. Awesome


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Re: Closet grow recommendations? (UPDATE WITH PICS) [Re: Dr. Awesome]
    #204690 - 03/11/09 01:51 PM (10 years, 8 months ago)

well here are some pics of my closet setup, no plants yet, just finished setting everything up.  everything went fairly smooth.

i only need a couple more things, small oscillating fan that i can attach to the wall, and some weather stripping to keep the light in and out, some better cable management lol oh, and clones of course :wink:

anyway, here's the pics.  as always thoughts on what i can do to improve this grow closet are welcome and appreciated.













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InvisibleDr. Penguin
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Re: Closet grow recommendations? (UPDATE WITH PICS) [Re: Dr. Awesome]
    #204695 - 03/11/09 02:34 PM (10 years, 8 months ago)

Looking great! I just have a couple questions and comments.

What kind of fan did you end up going with? It looks like all you have is a duct booster fan which means you must have skipped the scrubber. Any idea what you will do about the smell?

That ducting you're using may be a bit too long, especially with a duct booster fan instead of a centrifugal or axial fan and its made of plastic which always concerns me when venting hot air. I suggest multiple, smaller sections of metal flex duct so that the run is as straight as possible, at as many light heights as possible. I know it will cause a bit more work, but with a decent sized HPS you have to get the most out of your cooling system.

Keep it up! :thumbup:


--------------------
* My Cab
* How to Build a Grow Tent
* Fan Speed Control 101
* Easy Butane Extraction

Not responsible for advice not taken.


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OfflineDr. Awesome


Registered: 01/17/09
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Re: Closet grow recommendations? (UPDATE WITH PICS) [Re: Dr. Penguin]
    #204699 - 03/11/09 02:49 PM (10 years, 8 months ago)

well, so far ive left the door closed for an hour and a half and the temp hasn't risen above 78 f when the thermometer was placed only 5-6" away from the glass of the reflector.  the ducting isn't attached to the reflector yet, and i will be adding the carbon scrubber before i initiate flowering.  from all previous grows ive noticed veg smell is minimal.  enough so that venting to the attic should pose no security threats.  however i will insist on having the scrubber built and in place before flowering.

i did go with a duct booster fan, it was cheap (10 bucks at home depot, and it seems to be serving well enough for the time being, tho i will be investing in a 6" vortex fan.  as well as possibly an axial fan for the intake just to boost airflow over the bulb.  unfortunately the vortex fan was outside my initial start up budget.

i will keep my eye on the ducting, if the air becomes too hot for it i will take a quick trip to home depot to cure that.  for the time being i will straighten out that ducting/cut off the excess.


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Offlineethnoguy
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Re: Closet grow recommendations? (UPDATE WITH PICS) [Re: Dr. Awesome]
    #204706 - 03/11/09 02:58 PM (10 years, 8 months ago)

Keep us posted. Its looking good. :goodluck:

EG


--------------------


My Grow Closet

My Personal Cacti Pics


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OfflineDr. Awesome


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Re: Closet grow recommendations? (UPDATE WITH PICS) [Re: ethnoguy]
    #212341 - 04/05/09 02:15 AM (10 years, 7 months ago)

so i have come across a problem, just not sure how much of a problem it will end up being...  in my closet i made an intake vent that draws air from my basement since i found that sealing the door was in my best interests security wise.  no light leaks in or out, and no sounds are audible when teh door is closed so that is good.  however with that fresh air intake, my relative humidity has dropped to around 20%.  my hygrometer could just be horribly inaccurate, cos my house doesn't seem to have super dry air, but im not sure.  how much is having a really low humidity going to effect growth?  i suspect that once the hydro unit is running and there are plants in there it will surely drive the humidity up, but i just wanna know for a worst case scenario what it will be like if i cant get the RH any higher than 20%


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OfflineDr. Awesome


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Re: Closet grow recommendations? (UPDATE WITH PICS) [Re: ethnoguy]
    #212352 - 04/05/09 03:32 AM (10 years, 7 months ago)

double post


Edited by Dr. Awesome (04/05/09 03:33 AM)


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Offlineethnoguy
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Re: Closet grow recommendations? (UPDATE WITH PICS) [Re: Dr. Awesome]
    #212357 - 04/05/09 09:23 AM (10 years, 7 months ago)

Thats kinda odd. Maybe you have high positive airflow instead of negative? I'm not sure. What is the cfm of you intake and exhaust fans. I find it strange that air from the basement would have such low RH.

EG


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Re: Closet grow recommendations? (UPDATE WITH PICS) [Re: ethnoguy]
    #212410 - 04/05/09 03:11 PM (10 years, 7 months ago)

Yea, agreed ethno, basement air is usually pretty damp around here... I would check the hygrometer first off, you can find good ones at a reasonable price at a local cigar shop. Cigar shops have good ones that will give you an accurate reading, I've always been wary of the cheap ones from walmart and the pet stores.

That said, I have never really had a problem with humidity when growing hydroponically and it gets pretty damn dry in the winter. The only thing a low humidity level will do is increase transpiration rates (unless it gets ridiculously low) which means you will have to top off your rez water more often.


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OfflineDr. Awesome


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Re: Closet grow recommendations? (UPDATE WITH PICS) [Re: Dr. Penguin]
    #212419 - 04/05/09 04:22 PM (10 years, 7 months ago)

well, that's good. im glad it shouldn't be too much of a problem.  my basement is pretty humid especially in the summer so once things start to warm up i don't think it is unrealistic for me to be fighting with air that is too humid :P


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