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Offlinefirst1peak
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Registered: 10/05/08
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Last seen: 15 years, 5 months
1st timer help?
    #129322 - 10/05/08 06:24 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

Hey,
    New to this whole thing. This is my first shot at this. Im running a 400w hps. 2 plants from bag seed.Im wondering what the yellowing is on the leaves. The leave eventually shrivel up and fall off. Ive been on 12/12 for 3 weeks not. Water when needed and use miracle grows house plant fert and another spray for the bugs when needed. The fert is the kind you mix in EVERY time you water.  Can you check these pics out and let me know what your thinking?  its about 75 degrees in the grow area and about 45% humidity.

Edited by first1peak (10/05/08 08:16 PM)

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Offlinefirst1peak
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Re: 1st timer help? [Re: first1peak]
    #129323 - 10/05/08 06:25 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

pic taken down..

Edited by first1peak (10/05/08 08:21 PM)

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Offlinefirst1peak
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Re: 1st timer help? [Re: first1peak]
    #129324 - 10/05/08 06:31 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

ht. "b"

Edited by first1peak (10/05/08 08:16 PM)

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Offlinefirst1peak
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Re: 1st timer help? [Re: first1peak]
    #129325 - 10/05/08 06:33 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

this is the plant on the left "A"  notice the slight yellow spots.


any ideas?

Edited by first1peak (10/05/08 08:17 PM)

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Offlinefirst1peak
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Re: 1st timer help? [Re: first1peak]
    #129328 - 10/05/08 06:40 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

forgot to add that i added some blood meal last week

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InvisibleDr. Penguin
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Registered: 05/19/08
Posts: 1,036
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Re: 1st timer help? [Re: first1peak]
    #129351 - 10/05/08 07:53 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

Could you please upload these pics onto the Growery servers? Off site links are a bit scary to some of us. If you get some new pics up I'm sure we can get to the bottom of your issue. Thanks!


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* Fan Speed Control 101
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Offlinefirst1peak
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Re: 1st timer help? [Re: Dr. Penguin]
    #129365 - 10/05/08 08:28 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)




plant A on the left    Plant B on the right.

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Offlinefirst1peak
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Re: 1st timer help? [Re: first1peak]
    #129368 - 10/05/08 08:29 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)



yellowing of plant b

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Offlinefirst1peak
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Re: 1st timer help? [Re: first1peak]
    #129370 - 10/05/08 08:30 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)



some yellow spots on plant A..

what do you think?
this is my first time around

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OfflineChronica


Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 114
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 13 years, 6 months
Re: 1st timer help? [Re: first1peak]
    #129374 - 10/05/08 08:36 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

first1peak said:


yellowing of plant b




This looks almost like a small nitrogen deficiency, is it starting from the bottom up?





This just looks like some kind of micro nutrient problem, not sure though, are you using cal mag, or magical?

edit #2, the plants look good to me the yellow in plant 1 is probably just from switching nutes from high n to low n. It happens to me too.

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InvisibleDr. Penguin
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Re: 1st timer help? [Re: first1peak]
    #129375 - 10/05/08 08:39 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

Thanks for fixing the pics. This looks to me to be nute burn, yea its a nute burn. Try picking up a cannabis specific fertilizer and decreasing the frequency of feeding. Should fix it up in a jiffy. Best of luck!


--------------------
* My Cab
* How to Build a Grow Tent
* Fan Speed Control 101
* Easy Butane Extraction

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Offlinefirst1peak
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Re: 1st timer help? [Re: Dr. Penguin]
    #129377 - 10/05/08 08:42 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Dr. Penguin said:
Thanks for fixing the pics. This looks to me to be nute burn, yea its a nute burn. Try picking up a cannabis specific fertilizer and decreasing the frequency of feeding. Should fix it up in a jiffy. Best of luck!




any suggestions of brands ?

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OfflineChronica


Registered: 04/20/08
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Loc: Canada
Last seen: 13 years, 6 months
Re: 1st timer help? [Re: first1peak]
    #129378 - 10/05/08 08:45 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

Nute burn would mean too much nutes, the yellowing shows me signs of missing nitrogen which would mean deficient. Guano and Fox farms are good to use. I use guano because its cheap. You are feeding them some kind of bloom booster right? with low n high p?

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Offlinefirst1peak
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Re: 1st timer help? [Re: first1peak]
    #129379 - 10/05/08 08:47 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

no bloom booster.

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OfflineChronica


Registered: 04/20/08
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Last seen: 13 years, 6 months
Re: 1st timer help? [Re: first1peak]
    #129380 - 10/05/08 08:49 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

what is the ferts you are usings NPK ratio? During flowering my plants like to yellow from the bottom up anyways, its kind of normal for them to yellow during flowering.

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Offlinefirst1peak
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Re: 1st timer help? [Re: first1peak]
    #129381 - 10/05/08 08:52 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

8-7-6

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InvisibleDr. Penguin
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Re: 1st timer help? [Re: Dr. Penguin]
    #129382 - 10/05/08 08:53 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

A defeciency would result in the general yellowing of the bottom leaves, not the scattered blotching with mild necrosis which his plants are displaying. This, coupled with his feeding (of mirical grow which is a harh fertalizer to begin with) at every watering are what lead me to believe it is nute burn. I personally don't grow in soil so I don't have much first hand experince with that type of fertalizer but I have heard great things about the fox farm brand of products. Give it a try and let me know how it works out for you.


--------------------
* My Cab
* How to Build a Grow Tent
* Fan Speed Control 101
* Easy Butane Extraction

Not responsible for advice not taken.

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OfflineChronica


Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 114
Loc: Canada
Last seen: 13 years, 6 months
Re: 1st timer help? [Re: Dr. Penguin]
    #129386 - 10/05/08 08:59 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

It is pretty weird how that plant done that but I pretty much have a plant out of 20 that did the same thing, and it was on the same feeding schedule and all.


That does look almost like an intervienal chlorosis which has a few different causes, lack or lock out of some micro nutes can cause it. And N deficiency also looks a little similar.

Quote:

not the scattered blotching with mild necrosis which his plants are displaying.



From googling necrosis it looks a little like that too.

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Offlinefirst1peak
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Re: 1st timer help? [Re: Dr. Penguin]
    #129388 - 10/05/08 09:00 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

suggestions?

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OfflineChronica


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Re: 1st timer help? [Re: first1peak]
    #129390 - 10/05/08 09:02 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

first1peak said:
suggestions?




Supply them with micro nutes and good ferts. Guano is cheap and so is magical and superthrive. Thats all you need really. I cant give you an exact answer on what your problem is il look into my marijuana horticulture book.

After looking plant #2 still looks like its the nitrogen, possibly interveinal chlorosis mixed with a micro nute deficiency. I dont really see how that could be the problem with the fert your using its high in N (but it is miracle grow right? Ive compared guano to miracle grow and the results are kind of amazing). The spots on plant 2 is something totally differnt and looks like a micro nute problem.

Edited by Chronica (10/05/08 09:14 PM)

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InvisibleDr. Penguin
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Re: 1st timer help? [Re: Dr. Penguin]
    #129391 - 10/05/08 09:09 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

I would give them a good flush with plain water to rinse out the excess salts from aggressive feeding, and give them plain water for the next two or three waterings. If the problem clears up then it was a nute burn, get some better ferts and feed every other, or every third watering. If the problem gets worse, then it is a micro nutrient deficiency (which I strongly doubt) in which case you will need to get better ferts and hope for the best.

One clear indicator of nute burn is a crispy texture of the leaves. How do the yellowing leaves feel?


--------------------
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* Fan Speed Control 101
* Easy Butane Extraction

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Offlinefirst1peak
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Re: 1st timer help? [Re: first1peak]
    #129392 - 10/05/08 09:10 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

thanks a bunch.  im learning as i go here.  Learning experiences!! :-)

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Offlinefirst1peak
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Re: 1st timer help? [Re: first1peak]
    #129393 - 10/05/08 09:12 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

some of them are crisping up

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InvisibleDr. Penguin
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Re: 1st timer help? [Re: first1peak]
    #129394 - 10/05/08 09:14 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

Crisping is a definate sign of nute burn, be very careful of adding any more nutes of any sort untill you flush the excess out of the soil. Adding more nutrients at this point will only make the probem worse.


--------------------
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* Fan Speed Control 101
* Easy Butane Extraction

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OfflineChronica


Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 114
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Re: 1st timer help? [Re: Dr. Penguin]
    #129396 - 10/05/08 09:21 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Dr. Penguin said:
Crisping is a definate sign of nute burn, be very careful of adding any more nutes of any sort untill you flush the excess out of the soil. Adding more nutrients at this point will only make the probem worse.





Flushing is a good idea maybe. If he was using a 3-8-4 or something the yellowing would be normal on lower fan leaves and slowly work its way up. Mine crisp on the outside after they have been yellow for a little while.

http://images.google.com/images?q=Interveinal%20Chlorosis

It is possible he has a micro nute problem thats causing both the problems, chlorosis can be caused by micro nutes. The spots are probably micro nutes too. For some reason I dont think its over feeding. Id say wait for sirius or someone before you flush.

Edited by Chronica (10/05/08 09:35 PM)

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InvisibleDr. Penguin
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Re: 1st timer help? [Re: Dr. Penguin]
    #129408 - 10/05/08 09:57 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

MG is a chemical fert which is defiantly prone to overfeeding especially when used at every watering which is never a good idea. In my experience with other plants in soil, micro nutrient deficiencies in good potting soil are very rare, in hydro yes, but soil usually contains all the essential elements for growth. But I agree, you might want to wait for a third opinion fro Sirius or the like.

Check out this thread over at another board. Pay special attention to the sections about nute burn and the sections about micro nutrient deficiencies.
http://www.icmag.com/ic/showthread.php?t=11688


--------------------
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* Fan Speed Control 101
* Easy Butane Extraction

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OfflineSirius
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Re: 1st timer help? (moved) [Re: first1peak]
    #129441 - 10/06/08 04:42 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

This thread was moved from Marijuana Cultivation.

Reason:
Moving this to Doctor's Diagnosis as it is a thread seeking a diagnosis.

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OfflineSirius
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Re: 1st timer help? (moved) [Re: Sirius]
    #129443 - 10/06/08 05:08 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

I really don't think it is nitrogen deficiency. I didn't see the pH of the soil mentioned anywhere - what is the pH of the water you're giving it, and what is the pH of the run-off. I think the pH is off, and it is causing a micro-nutrient lock-out. If not that, then the MG fertilizer (which definitely won't produce the best results with marijuana) isn't providing enough micro-nutrients in an accessible enough form for the plants.

I don't know too much about micro-nutrients to be able to say which one in particular it is, it kind of looks like calcium but it is hard to tell the color of what is happening with the HPS) as they usually just don't come up if you're working with stuff more intended for marijuana, but the best way to go about fixing it right now is to start flushing the soil with water that is adjusted to a good pH (closer to 6.3 or so for soil, from what I've read), and start using hydroponic-quality nutrients. Even if you are half-way through flowering, you'll need to get them for the next time too, and its still awhile before you'll stop feeding and only flush your plants (the plant on the left looks like it'll need around eight weeks of flowering time and the one on the right more like ten or eleven - interesting plants by the way! :thumbup:), and using the MG just isn't keeping a good chemistry.


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OfflineSirius
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Re: 1st timer help? (moved) [Re: Sirius]
    #129444 - 10/06/08 05:14 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

On that note, I'd recommend trying out the Flora series, by General Hydroponics. It is the standard in indoor gardening, pretty inexpensive, gives you a lot of flexibility in fulfilling the different nutrient requirements of individual plants, as it is a three part series, and has well-documented information on dosages for growing marijuana.

Magash also has recommended Pure Blend Pro for its easiness for anyone to use with great results.


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Offlinefirst1peak
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Re: 1st timer help? (moved) [Re: Sirius]
    #129448 - 10/06/08 07:37 AM (15 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Sirius said:
On that note, I'd recommend trying out the Flora series, by General Hydroponics. It is the standard in indoor gardening, pretty inexpensive, gives you a lot of flexibility in fulfilling the different nutrient requirements of individual plants, as it is a three part series, and has well-documented information on dosages for growing marijuana.

Magash also has recommended Pure Blend Pro for its easiness for anyone to use with great results.




thanks. thats what i was looking for.

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OfflineChronica


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Re: 1st timer help? (moved) [Re: first1peak]
    #129564 - 10/06/08 02:03 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

Deficient in Iron, Mg, Nitrogen, Sulfur, or Imbalanced PH  can all cause the Chlorosis or Interveinal yellowing.


Its possible to be mg heres what my book says on mg deficiency.

Quote:


No deficiency symptoms are visible during the first 3 to four weeks of flowering.
In the 4th to the 6th week of growth, the first signs of def appear. Interveinal yellowing and irregular rust brown spots appear on older and middle aged leafs. Younger leaves remain healthy.  Leaf tips turn brown and curl upward as it progresses. Rust brown spots multiply, interveinal yellowing increases. Rust brown spots and yellow progress, starting at the bottom and advancing to the top of the plant. Younger leave develop rust colored spots and interveinal yellowing. The leaves dry and die in extreme cases.




Your plant that has the yellow looks to have interveinal yellowing to me.

Edited by Chronica (10/06/08 02:09 PM)

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Invisiblelukeduke711

Registered: 07/06/08
Posts: 123
Re: 1st timer help? [Re: Chronica]
    #129572 - 10/06/08 02:15 PM (15 years, 5 months ago)

i always have stuff like this happen to plants....what you need to do (only if using nutrients) is water it with strait water for a week to "detox" the plant if you know what I mean, and ill bet you itll green up quite a bit

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