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OfflineKing Koopa
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Re: Like, how scared should we be of zika?? [Re: ninjapls]
    #817797 - 08/06/16 12:26 PM (3 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

ninjapls said:


The CDC is completely denying this.




Really?

http://www.cdc.gov/zika/


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Alcoholics Anonymous is a fellowship of men and women who share their experience, strength and hope with each other that they may solve their common problem and help others to recover from alcoholism.

The only requirement for membership is a desire to stop drinking. There are no dues or fees for A.A. membership; we are self-supporting through our own contributions. A.A. is not allied with any sect, denomination, politics, organization or institution; does not wish to engage in any controversy; neither endorses nor opposes any causes. Our primary purpose is to stay sober and help other alcoholics to achieve sobriety.


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Offlineninjapls
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Re: Like, how scared should we be of zika?? [Re: King Koopa]
    #817799 - 08/06/16 12:37 PM (3 years, 4 months ago)

Lol, you're obviously not paying any attention, smart guy.


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OfflineKing Koopa
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Re: Like, how scared should we be of zika?? [Re: ninjapls]
    #817800 - 08/06/16 12:44 PM (3 years, 4 months ago)

Do you think people here are taking you seriously with replies like that? Posting YT videos and not forming your own argument. The only thing i see you saying is ,"Theyre lying to us."


--------------------
Alcoholics Anonymous is a fellowship of men and women who share their experience, strength and hope with each other that they may solve their common problem and help others to recover from alcoholism.

The only requirement for membership is a desire to stop drinking. There are no dues or fees for A.A. membership; we are self-supporting through our own contributions. A.A. is not allied with any sect, denomination, politics, organization or institution; does not wish to engage in any controversy; neither endorses nor opposes any causes. Our primary purpose is to stay sober and help other alcoholics to achieve sobriety.


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Offlineninjapls
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Re: Like, how scared should we be of zika?? [Re: King Koopa]
    #817802 - 08/06/16 12:52 PM (3 years, 4 months ago)

Like you'd care what my opinion is anyway.
I'm just providing information so you all can research the issues further yourselves. Plain and simple. The videos are just good icebreakers into these issues. Nothing more. Relax.


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InvisibleDataM
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Re: Like, how scared should we be of zika?? [Re: ninjapls]
    #817806 - 08/06/16 03:23 PM (3 years, 4 months ago)

The links you posted regarding Naled seems to support what I've said regarding chemical control.

However, according to the MSDS for Naled, the acute LD50 dose in rats is ~300mg/Kg, and chronic effects are only seen in test subjects exposed to 28mg/Kg for 9+ weeks. The recommended application instructions call for 0.1 lbs of naled per acre of land sprayed. Not only that, but the solubility in water is <1mg/L, and the maximum half-life of Naled in water is 2 days. Knowing this, a normal 70Kg male would have to literally eat all surface vegetation, and all surface soil of 462 acres of sprayed soil within a few hours in order to possibly (50% chance) die from exposure, and 43.12 acres every few hours for at least 9 weeks in order to see any chronic ill effects. For water consumption, this works out to an average male having to drink 5,547 gallons of water within a few hours to possibly die from exposure, and 518 gallons of water every few hours for 9 weeks in order to experience chronic effects.

Additionally, the recommended concentration for pyriproxyfen in drinking water is 0.3mg/L. According to several studies on reproductive, carcinogenic, developmental, and physical effects caused by chronic exposure to pyriproxyfen, most abnormalities did not present until dosages above 300mg/Kg of body weight, and all abnormalities were not present below 100mg/Kg. This would mean that a pregnant mother (62Kg) would have to drink  at least 5,459 gallons of water per day during the entire term of the pregnancy in order to experience any developmental or reproductive effects.  In addition, there are plenty of articles explaining that only 1 group (PCST) is claiming birth defects from pyriproxyfen in drinking water, the rest came forward after the initial "quoting" and stated that they were being misquoted, and never claimed that the use of pyriproxyfen is causing birth defects. :shrug:

The reason acetylcholine breakdown inhibition is so effective in insects is because they lack an enzyme that breaks down the inhibitor (naled), causing their nervous system and muscles to seize up. Mammals on the other hand, do possess an effective means of breaking down these chemicals, which is why the toxicity is so effectively reduced.

Its amazing that all you seem to be looking at are news articles, rather than actually looking up MSDS's and toxicological studies on the chemicals involved. Beyond that, its really just simple math. :pipesmoke:


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“The Universe is under no obligation to make sense to you” -NDT


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Offlineninjapls
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Re: Like, how scared should we be of zika?? [Re: Data]
    #817825 - 08/06/16 11:06 PM (3 years, 4 months ago)

It's amazing all you're posting is pretty irrelevant information trying your hardest to look smart while not providing sources.
Exactly how much of the 1 million pounds per year is being sprayed each time they spray a given area?
You also gotta take human error into consideration, how do we know they're not over spraying?


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InvisibleDataM
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Re: Like, how scared should we be of zika?? [Re: ninjapls]
    #817829 - 08/06/16 11:38 PM (3 years, 4 months ago)

And you have yet to post anything but articles about chemical control of mosquitoes (not references), while ignoring all of the other misinformation put forward by your videos.

How do we know anything? How can we trust anything? Do we 100% know we aren't just some fantasy story cooked up in some cosmic entity's mind? Come on man, municipal water supply testing is pretty simple, and if the PCST wants to make claims like they are making, then it should be very easy for them to provide relevant patient data at the very least (widespread lowered cholesterol levels, which would indicate an accidental overdose of pyriproxyfen). Additionally, since the water is freely available for sampling, it would be very easy to determine the actual concentration of pyriproxyfen in the water.

Since none of this data seems to exist, I would think the prudent conclusion is that either the product was administered correctly, or the PCST is wholly unqualified to backup their ridiculous claims.

In the case of Naled, the product is not pure when it is sprayed, but rather heavily diluted in order to evenly distribute. Even if human error were taken into account, it would have to be an error of 1,000,000 the recommended application density. Since all invertebrates are incredibly sensitive to this compound, at the magnitude of human error you are suggesting we would see a mass die-off of all invertebrate and aquatic life, and more than likely plants and major herbivores in the region would also show symptoms of acute toxicity. Since there are no reports of mass cattle deaths or fish die-offs in the region, I'm inclined to rule out human error for the application of Naled as well.

No how about those references for the rest of the video ramblings that you keep ignoring :nyan:


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“The Universe is under no obligation to make sense to you” -NDT


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Invisibledrawde
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Re: Like, how scared should we be of zika?? [Re: Data] * 1
    #817831 - 08/07/16 12:37 AM (3 years, 4 months ago)

Yeah but if it weren't for this dude we wouldn't have any of this interesting reading you've authored.

Also,  :burke: this thread


--------------------
King Koopa said:
The amount of pot that Gask smokes is equivalent to a guy shooting heroin on weekends


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Re: Like, how scared should we be of zika?? [Re: drawde] * 1
    #817833 - 08/07/16 01:33 AM (3 years, 4 months ago)

Indeed, I actually had a ton of fun writing all of this up :bobmarley:


--------------------
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Offlineninjapls
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Re: Like, how scared should we be of zika?? [Re: drawde]
    #817834 - 08/07/16 01:46 AM (3 years, 4 months ago)

Ughh. Fuck it, it's Florida, who gives a fuck anyway.

Nah, fuck that, i give a fuck. I don't care if i'm the only one.
If you fuckers can't care for your fellow man that's on you.
On the whole mass deaths, there's a bunch of unexplained mass bird and fish deaths all around the US.
Naled has been used all over the US since the 50's. Could be responsible.

Doesn't look like anyone bothered to read that 2nd link i posted about naled so ill just post it all here. Cheers.
Quote:



NALED Insecticide Fact Sheet
NALED Insecticide Fact Sheet
from Sonoran Sunsets

Naled is an insecticide in the organophosphate pesticide family that is commonly used to kill adult (flying) mosquitoes.

Naled has been registered for use in the U.S. since 1959 and is sold under the brand name Dibrom. AMVAC Chemical Corporation has been the major manufacturer of NALED since 1998.

Use:

About one million pounds of naled are used every year in the U.S. Approximately 70 percent of this is used for mosquito control; almost all of this is applied aerially.

The remaining 30 percent is used in agriculture. Major agricultural uses are on cotton in California and Louisiana, on alfalfa in Idaho and Oregon, and on grapes in California.

Efficacy of Mosquito Treatments

The U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention has written that “adulticiding, application of chemicals to kill adult mosquitoes by ground or aerial applications, is usually the least efficient mosquito control technique.

Naled is no exception. For example, researchers from the New York Department of Health showed that 11 years of naled spraying was “successful in achieving short-term reductions in mosquito abundance, but populations of the disease-carrying mosquito of concern “increased 15-fold over the 11 years of spraying.

Mode of Action

Like all organophosphate insecticides, NALED (DIBROM) Naled is an insecticide in the organophosphate pesticide family used primarily for mosquito control. Dibrom is a common brand name for naled products. About one million pounds are used annually in the U.S. Like all organophosphates, naled is toxic to the nervous system. Symptoms of exposure include headaches, nausea, and diarrhea. Naled is more toxic when exposure occurs by breathing contaminated air than through other kinds of exposure. In laboratory tests, naled exposure caused increased aggressiveness and a deterioration of memory and learning.

Naled’s breakdown product DICHLORVOS (another organophosphate insecticide) interferes with prenatal brain development. In laboratory animals, exposure for just 3 days during pregnancy when the brain is growing quickly reduced brain size 15 percent.

DICHLORVOS also causes cancer, according to the International Agency for Research on Carcinogens. In laboratory tests, it caused leukemia and pancreatic cancer. Two independent studies have shown that children exposed to household “no-pest” strips containing dichlorvos have a higher incidence of brain cancer than unexposed children.

Aerial applications of naled can drift up to one-half mile. According to the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency, naled is moderately to highly toxic to birds and fish. It also reduced egg production and hatching success in tests with birds and reduced growth in tests with juvenile fish. convulsions, paralysis, and death.

Breakdown Products

** Naled breaks down into dichlorvos **

DICHORVOS
another organophosphate insecticide, in animals and soil. THIS IS DANGEROUS!!!

Effects on Behavior

Exposure to naled has multiple effects on behavior. In a study conducted by naled’s manufacturer, naled caused reduced muscle strength, slow responses to stimulation, and reduced activity in rats.

These behavioral changes occurred at all but the lowest dose level tested in males and all dose levels tested in females, suggesting that females are more sensitive than males to naled poisoning.

Exposure to naled’s breakdown product dichlorvos causes increased aggression and impaired memory. The Indian biochemists mentioned above found that fighting aggression was increased about 5 times

Inert Ingredients

Like most pesticides, commercial naled-containing insecticides contain ingredients other than naled. Many of these ingredients, according to U.S. pesticide law, are called “inert.” Except for tests of acute effects, toxicology tests required for the registration of a pesticide are not conducted with the combination of ingredients found in commercial products.

Most inert ingredients are not identified on product labels, and little information about them is publicly available.

Symptoms of Exposure

Symptoms of exposure to naled and all organophosphate insecticides include headaches, muscle twitching, nausea, diarrhea, difficult breathing, naled kills insects by inhibiting acetylcholinesterase (AChE), an enzyme involved in the transmission of nerve impulses from one nerve cell to another. This causes a “jam” in the transmission system, resulting in restlessness,depression, seizures, and loss of consciousness.

Toxicity to the Nervous System

A symptom of exposure to naled that occurs at low doses (whether by breathing, through the skin, or orally) is inhibition of acetylcholinesterase (AChE).

In studies conducted by naled manufacturers, exposure of rats to naled in air at a dose of 0.3 milligrams per kilogram of body weight (mg/kg) per day for three weeks, skin exposures of 20 mg/kg per day for 4 weeks, and oral exposure of 10 mg/ kg per day for 4 weeks caused inhibition of AChE.

Long-term exposure also caused AChE inhibition; reduced AChE activity occurred in dogs exposed orally to 2 mg/kg per day for 1 year and in rats exposed orally to the same dose for 2 years.

In addition, the long-term study with dogs found that doses of 2 mg/kg per day also caused mineralization of the spinal cord.

Naled’s breakdown product dichlorvos inhibits the activity in rats of a nervous system enzyme called neuropathy target esterase.

In experiments conducted by biochemists at the Postgraduate Institute of Medical Education and Research (India), doses of 6 mg/kg per day reduced the enzyme’s activity by about 40 percent.

Inhibition of this enzyme causes partial paralysis of the hind legs followed by incoordination.

Toxicity Caused by Breathing Naled

Naled is more potent when exposure occurs through breathing than when exposure occurs through eating contaminated food or drinking contaminated water.

Toxicologists at the University of California found that inhalation was 20 times more toxic to rats than oral dosing (dosing through the mouth) of naled.

The U.S. Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) came to a similar conclusion based on tests submitted to the agency by naled’s manufacturer: the dose required to cause cholinesterase inhibition through inhalation exposure was less than 1/6 of the lowest oral dose causing the same effect.

An additional study by the University of California researchers mentioned above found that small droplets of naled (the size produced by ultra low volume sprayers often used in mosquito spraying) were about four times more acutely toxic than larger droplets.

Dibrom Concentrate

(EPA Registration No. 5481-480) contains the inert ingredient aromatic hydrocarbon solvent (Chemical Abstract Services number 64742-94-5), also called solvent naphtha.

This solvent contains two aromatic hydrocarbons, naphthalene and 1,2,4- trimethylbenzene. Dibrom 8 Emulsive (EPA Registration No. 5481-479) contains naphthalene. Dibrom 8 Miscible (EPA Registration No. 34704-351) contains solvents4 whose ingredients can include naphthalene and trimethylbenzene.

Naphthalene has been classified by EPA as a possible human carcinogen because it caused lung tumors in mice following inhalation.

Naphthalene exposure also causes headaches, restlessness, lethargy, nausea, diarrhea, and anemia.

Anemia in newborns can be caused by exposure during pregnancy.
1,2,4-trimethylbenzene is irritating to eyes and skin. It can depress the central nervous system and cause headache, fatigue, nausea, and anxiety. It has also caused asthmatic bronchitis.

Exposure to Naled’s Breakdown Product Increases Aggressiveness and Disrupts Learning
In laboratory animals, exposure to naled’s breakdown product dichlorvos causes more frequent fighting and hinders learning. Number of fighting episodes (per minute, with standard deviations) ore common among exposed rats than among unexposed ones.

Exposed animals also required more trials than unexposed ones to learn an avoidance behavior, indicating a “severe deterioration in their memory and learning functions.”

Eye and Skin Irritation
Naled is a “severe” eye irritant and is “corrosive” to skin. All three frequently used commercial Dibrom products pose similar hazards.

Labels of two of the products warn “causes irreversible eye and skin damage and the third states that it is “corrosive” and “causes eye damage and skin damage.” Skin irritation was documented by physicians soon after naled’s use in the U.S. began.

Effects on the Circulatory System

In a long-term feeding study conducted by naled’s manufacturer, naled caused anemia in dogs at all but the lowest dose level tested. Exposures of 2 mg/kg per day reduced the number of red blood cells and the amount of hemoglobin (the oxygen-carrying pigment) in the blood.20

Effects on Reproduction

Dichlorvos, naled’s breakdown product, interferes with prenatal brain development.

Biologists at the University of Oslo found that dosing guinea pigs with 15 mg/kg of dichlorvos twice daily for three days during pregnancy caused a significant (15 percent) decrease in the offspring’s brain size.

The guinea pigs were dosed with dichlorvos between the 40th and 50th day of their pregnancy, a time when the fetal brain is undergoing a growth spurt.

In addition, University of Michigan researchers showed that naled exposure causes delays in the development of rat embryos. For example, exposure of pregnant rats on the ninth day of their pregnancy caused a significant delay in the closing of the embryo’s neural tube.

Naled and dichlorvos can be passed from mothers to their offspring through nursing. German researchers found both insecticides in milk from cows that had been treated with naled.

Ability to Cause Genetic Damage (Mutagenicity)
Naled damaged bacteria’s genetic material in laboratory tests conducted by geneticists at Monash University (Australia)24 as well as biologists at Texas Tech University.

Naled’s breakdown product DICHLORVOS also causes genetic damage.

A team of Greek and Dutch scientists found that injections of dichlorvos at weekly intervals in mice caused a 3-fold increase in the number of mutations in liver cells.

A team of geneticists from the National Research Centre (Egypt) found that oral doses of dichlorvos given to mice, or feeding mice diclorvos-treated beans, increased the incidence of chromosome abnormalities in both spleen and sperm cells.

Ability to Cause Cancer (Carcinogenicity)

EPA classifies naled as a “Group E” chemical. Group E chemicals have demonstrated “evidence of noncarcinogenicity” in laboratory tests.

Naled’s breakdown product DICHLORVOS however, is classified as “possibly carcinogenic to humans,” with “sufficient evidence in experimental animals” for its carcinogenicity by the International Agency for Research on Carcinogens. The agency gave dichlorvos this classification because it caused forestomach tumors, leukemia, and pancreatic tumors in laborators tests with rats and mice.

In children, exposure to dichlorvos has been linked with increased cancer risks. Researchers at the University of North Carolina found an association between exposure to dichlorvos “no-pest” strips during pregnancy or during childhood and the incidence of three types of childhood cancer: leukemias, brain tumors, and lymphoma.

Missouri Department of Health researchers found similar results for childhood brain cancer.

Effects on the Immune System

Both naled and its breakdown product DICHLORVOS inhibited an enzyme in white blood cells called monocyte esterase, according to a study conducted by researchers at the Technicon Science Center.

Monocyte esterases are an “integral component”33 of the process by which white blood cells eliminate virus-infected cells from our bodies and monitor for precancerous cells.

Synergy

A study submitted to EPA by Shell Chemical Co. showed that “the toxic effects of naled were potentiated by co-administration of Ciodrin, malathion, and methyl parathion. All three are insecticides in the organophosphate family.

Special Susceptibility

Malnourished individuals may be particularly susceptible to naled poisoning. Researchers from the Institute of Hygiene and Occupational Health (Bulgaria) studied naled’s effects on rats that were fed a low-protein diet and found that naled was almost twice as toxic to them as it was to rats fed a normal diet. In addition, the rats fed a low-protein diet developed liver damage from their naled exposure.

Contamination of Food

The U.S. Department of Agriculture documented contamination of strawberries, peppers, and beans with naled’s breakdown product dichlorvos.

Water Contamination

Insecticides in naled’s chemical family, the organophosphates, are com-Malnutrition Increases Naled’s Toxicity Naled inhibits the activity of an immune system enzyme. It is also more toxic to malnourished animals than animals fed a normal diet.

Median lethal dose

(milligrams per kilogram of body weight in rats) mon contaminants of urban streams and rivers. However, neither naled or its breakdown product dichlorvos were included in the national water quality monitoring program currently being conducted by the U.S. Geological Survey.

This means that no systematic information is available about naled contamination of U.S. streams, rivers, or wells.

EPA also does not have monitoring data for naled or its breakdown products in ground or surface water.

Air Contamination

Naled can persist in air up to several days after treatment. University of California, Davis toxicologists measured both naled and its breakdown product dichlorvos in the air around a naledtreated orange grove for three days after application.

Drift

Aerial applications of naled drift (move from the target site during application) for significant distances. Entomologists from the University of Florida measured naled contamination 750 meters (2400 feet) downwind from sprayed areas. They suggest that nospray buffer zones greater than 750 meters in width “be placed around ecologically sensitive areas.

Effects on Beneficial Insects
Because it is a broad spectrum insecticide, it is not surprising that naled impacts beneficial insects, those that provide important economic benefits to farmers. In a study submitted as part of naled’s registration process, naled was “highly toxic”42 to honey bees. Follow-up studies found that this toxicity decreased rapidly during the first day after treatment.42 Naled’s toxicity to other species of bees (alfalfa leafcutting bees and alkali bees) is more persistent than for honey bees.43 It can “mimic long residual [persistent] materials,” reducing leafcutting bee numbers 48 hours after treatment.

Parasitoid wasps (wasps that lay their eggs in juvenile stages of other insects, which then are killed as the wasps hatch and develop) can also be poisoned by low-level exposure to naled.

Naled (and Dichlorvos)Inhibit the Immune System
According to U.S. Department of Agriculture researchers, a wasp that parasitizes fruit flies was killed by a naled and protein bait mixture designed to kill fruit flies.

Naled is also highly toxic to a predatory mite.

A University of Florida zoologist studied areas in Florida where regular mosquito spraying occurred with Dibrom and another insecticide. He found a “major loss” in insect diversity in sprayed sites. Wasps showed “some of the most dramatic drops in species diversity.”47 Scale insects, whose populations are normally controlled by parasitic wasps, increased.

Effects on Birds

According to EPA, naled is moderately to highly toxic to birds. The most sensitive species tested by naled’s manufacturer during the registration process was the Canada goose, killed by 37 mg/kg of naled.

According to tests conducted by naled’s manufacturer, this insecticide also affects bird reproduction. Mallard ducks eating food treated with naled laid fewer eggs, produced fewer viable eggs, and hatched fewer ducklings than unexposed mallards.

Effects on Fish

According to EPA, naled is very highly toxic to lake trout; highly toxic to rainbow trout, cutthroat trout, and catfish; and moderately toxic to sunfish, minnow, and bass. The most sensitive species in tests submitted to EPA by naled’s manufacturer was lake trout, with an LC50 (median lethal concentration; the dose required to kill 50 percent of test animals) of 87 parts per billion (ppb). Naled also causes effects on fish other than death. In a test conducted by naled’s manufacturer, a concentration of 15 ppb impaired the growth of fathead minnows

Effects on Other Aquatic Animals

Ecologically important insects are killed by naled. According to a naled manufacturer, a concentration of 8 ppb kills stoneflies.50 Research conducted by the Arctic Health Research Center (Alaska) showed that water striders were killed 300 feet from a naled fogger.

Stoneflies are important nutrient cyclers in streams and water striders are scavengers and predators. Aquatic arthropods are also impacted by naled. Waterfleas are killed by less than 0.5 ppb of naled in tests conducted by naled’s manufacturer, and less than 0.2 ppb disrupts waterflea growth. Shrimp are killed by less than 10 ppb. According to EPA, naled is “very highly toxic” to oysters. Sea urchins are also sensitive to naled exposure. University of Miami researchers showed that concentrations of less than 4 ppb disrupt normal development of embryos.

Effects on Endangered Species

Evaluations by both EPA and the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service have concluded that use of naled puts endangered mammals, fish, mussels, and other species at risk. In addition, there is field evidence of naled’s hazards for endangered species.

Dibrom spraying (along with spraying of another insecticide) was “directly correlated with the precipitous decline in the Schaus Swallowtail populations on Key Largo [FL], according to a University of Florida zoologist. This swallowtail is listed as an endangered species under both Florida and federal law.

A University of Florida entomologist studying a different rare butterfly, the Florida lacewing, found higher populations in unsprayed areas than in sprayed areas. (See Figure 7.) He concluded that “it is likely that chemical applications play an important role in affecting the population size and behavior of these species.

Effects on Plants

Insecticides are typically not expected to damage plants. However, University of California researchers showed that naled treatment caused brown lesions in celery and bronzing of strawberries.The strawberry damage was accompanied by reduced photosynthesis (using sunlight to produce sugars) and closing of leaf openings (stomata).60 Brazilian researchers found that naled also “drastically reduced” tomato pollen germination. In aquatic plants, naled reduces photosynthesis. In laboratory tests, a naled concentration of 1 ppm reduced photosynthesis by estuary algae by over 50 percent.

*********************************
http://www.pesticide.org/naled.pdf
http://www.panna.org/
http://www.panna.org/resources/gpc/gpc_200212.12.3.14.dv.html





Edited by ninjapls (08/07/16 02:13 AM)


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InvisibleDataM
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Re: Like, how scared should we be of zika?? [Re: ninjapls]
    #817835 - 08/07/16 03:17 AM (3 years, 4 months ago)

I read that link, no need to fill the thread with massive chunks of copypasta.

And this is not verified information, its yet another biased assembly of claims from various anti-pesticide, anti-corporation, anti-go groups...with no real ties to any peer-reviewed studies to back it up. :shrug:

Sure, Naled is a neurotoxin at high doses in mammals. Water is also a neurotoxin in high doses. Sure, Naled causes cancer in high doses. Bacon and smoked red meats also causes cancer in high doses.

I could have sworn that your original videos were discussing Zika and the threat of the OX315A mosquitoes? Why are you now igoring that to continue to focus on an argument that, while terribly researched and nearly impossible based on the data, still aligns with my first statement towards chemical treatment of mosquitoes?

I care too, otherwise I wouldn't be arguing with you when it's so easy to just ignore you. But when faced with a flavivirus, with multiple aggressive vector species, making its way into a vast untapped population of closely-packed people, with a documented familial history of mutating into a high mortality hemorrhagic series of viral serotypes...I think it would be prudent to employ (carefully and according to instructions) mosquito adulticides that have a documented history of ZERO acute or chronic effects at the concentrations necessary to control mosquito populations.

If you really think Naled is so bad, then why are you against the GM mosquitoes, especially now that I've explained to you why the OX315a gene is not a threat to anything but the mosquito population?

Also, I'm still waiting for some real references on all non-insecticide topics brought up in your videos. :pipesmoke:


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“The Universe is under no obligation to make sense to you” -NDT


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Offlineninjapls
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Re: Like, how scared should we be of zika?? [Re: Data]
    #817836 - 08/07/16 04:05 AM (3 years, 4 months ago)

Dude you just babble pointless stuff, make it sound good, and most people reading it are too dumb to realize maybe you're full of shit.
It's pretty funny tbh. You're good at it, i'll give you that.


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Re: Like, how scared should we be of zika?? [Re: ninjapls] * 1
    #817839 - 08/07/16 09:19 AM (3 years, 4 months ago)

And yet you can't formulate even the faintest of logical argument to prove your claim that I'm full of shit. If it's so obvious to you, then maybe you should explain how my posts are wrong, or why the information I present is pointless.

Tbh, I really don't expect you to, since you've repeatedly failed to formulate any sort of logical argument or real reference supporting your initial claims from the OP. Instead, I fully expect you to continue making insults and un-supported claims regarding the relevance or validity of anything I say. You really are quite good at doing that.

:androidlol:


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Last seen: 3 years, 3 months
Re: Like, how scared should we be of zika?? [Re: Data]
    #817840 - 08/07/16 10:23 AM (3 years, 4 months ago)

Blahblahblahblah.

I'm right, you're wrong. Forever.


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Invisibledrawde
Registered: 11/15/09
Posts: 5,266
Re: Like, how scared should we be of zika?? [Re: ninjapls] * 1
    #817841 - 08/07/16 10:46 AM (3 years, 4 months ago)

Delusion much bro?


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King Koopa said:
The amount of pot that Gask smokes is equivalent to a guy shooting heroin on weekends


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InvisibleStonethM
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Re: Like, how scared should we be of zika?? [Re: ninjapls] * 1
    #817844 - 08/07/16 11:32 AM (3 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

ninjapls said:
Dude you just babble pointless stuff, make it sound good, and most people reading it are too dumb to realize maybe you're full of shit.
It's pretty funny tbh. You're good at it, i'll give you that.



Wow bro, hope you're not a salesman irl.
Anyone with an education can see you're full of shit, and know little to nothing about this subject line.
It was a nice troll while it lasted, you were pretty good at it for a bit.
I'll give ya that.

There's no need for name calling or getting all mad.
Because an educated man owned you in your own thread.
:chillpill:


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Offlineninjapls
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Re: Like, how scared should we be of zika?? [Re: Data]
    #817849 - 08/07/16 11:58 AM (3 years, 4 months ago)

Quote:

agmotes165 said:
The links you posted regarding Naled seems to support what I've said regarding chemical control.

However, according to the MSDS for Naled, the acute LD50 dose in rats is ~300mg/Kg, and chronic effects are only seen in test subjects exposed to 28mg/Kg for 9+ weeks. The recommended application instructions call for 0.1 lbs of naled per acre of land sprayed. Not only that, but the solubility in water is <1mg/L, and the maximum half-life of Naled in water is 2 days. Knowing this, a normal 70Kg male would have to literally eat all surface vegetation, and all surface soil of 462 acres of sprayed soil within a few hours in order to possibly (50% chance) die from exposure, and 43.12 acres every few hours for at least 9 weeks in order to see any chronic ill effects. For water consumption, this works out to an average male having to drink 5,547 gallons of water within a few hours to possibly die from exposure, and 518 gallons of water every few hours for 9 weeks in order to experience chronic effects.




You're the one cherry picking information for whatever your agenda is right here, perfect example.
Why are you babbling about the ORAL LD50 of Naled, when the real issue is about the INHALED LD50, which is less than half of the oral LD50 for mice at 156mg/kg. Huge difference.

The links i provided have tons of peer reviewed studies from many different colleges, you can research all the claims further and see for yourself.

It's obvious you just want to dominate this thread for your own agenda, which is making yourself look like an expert when you're not. Very deceptive.
And people just eat it up without questioning you and that's a major ego stroke for you.
But i see right through it.


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InvisibleDataM
That Guy
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Folding@home Statistics
Registered: 08/12/08
Posts: 2,374
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Re: Like, how scared should we be of zika?? [Re: ninjapls]
    #817852 - 08/07/16 12:26 PM (3 years, 4 months ago)

My apologies, I definitely goofed on that. :shrug:

Let's assume that you are correct about the inhaled LD50 (I'm not going to validate this figure, as I'm out and about right now).

An average male (70Kg), would have to instantaneously inhale the entire spray of more than 240 acres of land, before the aerosol hit the ground, in order to have a chance of dying from exposure. If we assume that the chronic effects are the same, then that same male would have to inhale all of the spray from at least 20 acres of treated land every day for 9 weeks, assuming that the same application is of Naled is applied daily to the area around that person.

I just assumed it was impractical to assume that someone could run around and suck up all of the air on 20 or 240 acres of land before it all settled out...but then again it would be impracticle to assume that anyone could eat all of the surface material from twice that amount of land, or drink 5500 gallons of water in a few hours, so I see your point.

Thanks for the correction. :highfive:


--------------------
“The Universe is under no obligation to make sense to you” -NDT


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Offlineninjapls
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Registered: 08/03/16
Posts: 27
Last seen: 3 years, 3 months
Re: Like, how scared should we be of zika?? [Re: Data]
    #817862 - 08/07/16 11:30 PM (3 years, 4 months ago)

You're pulling those figures straight out yo ass bro.:facepalm:

And you're welcome.


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InvisibleDataM
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Registered: 08/12/08
Posts: 2,374
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Re: Like, how scared should we be of zika?? [Re: ninjapls]
    #817868 - 08/08/16 02:02 AM (3 years, 4 months ago)

Thats a solid counter-argument you've got there, but perhaps you could offer something within the realm of real information, or at least attempt at incorporating basic logic into your replies, since it appears that you are the only one here who thinks you are correct. :shrug:

Or have we simply abandoned all attempts at civilized debate, and resorted instead to responding to each other with insults that require progressively less neural activity to formulate? I find that repetitive and boring, to be perfectly honest. :rolleyes:

If you are getting tired and grumpy, I'm fine with holding off on this thread for a day or two in order to allow you to recharge your mental faculties (and perhaps do a little more research). We can resume discussion whenever you feel you are properly rested and prepared.

Otherwise, I'm done tolerating your terribly prepared responses, and your sustained ignorance in the face of my attempts to spoon-feed you a relatively simple logical argument. If you feel as though I'm incorrect, you should explain why I'm incorrect, and perhaps elaborate with a logical counter-argument that proves your claim. :doublefacepalm:

Just let me know :pipesmoke:


--------------------
“The Universe is under no obligation to make sense to you” -NDT


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