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Offlinennn-yan
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fungicide for organic soil
    #669915 - 05/09/13 09:26 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Hey guys I did some reading on fungcides and other mold soil treatments in The search engine and didn't find much:sad:
So I'm trying not use chemicals that are toxic.
Is that possible?
Advice or recommendations?


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InvisibleMagashM
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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: nnn-yan]
    #669920 - 05/09/13 10:19 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

What exactly are you mixing in your soil that your getting mold?


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Offlineitsaconspiracy
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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: Magash]
    #669921 - 05/09/13 10:25 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

:whathesaid: do you hove a pic of this mold and are you sure its mold and not algee?


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Offlinennn-yan
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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: itsaconspiracy]
    #669922 - 05/09/13 10:27 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

I have been using water with lemon juice to acidfy it. And 20-20-20 food every once in awhile. Ill post a pix


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Offlineitsaconspiracy
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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: nnn-yan]
    #669925 - 05/09/13 10:31 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

watering with lemon jucie? i pretty sure that'll mess up your Ph dude


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Offlinennn-yan
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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: itsaconspiracy]
    #669927 - 05/09/13 10:33 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

no I add just enough to make the water 6.8
heres the soil with white "mold?"


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OfflineSmokeSomeHash
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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: nnn-yan]
    #669932 - 05/09/13 10:52 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

That looks really bad and its not the lemon for sure. What soil is that and how often do you water and how much water do you put when you do.


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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: SmokeSomeHash]
    #669934 - 05/09/13 10:56 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

:whathesaid: wow that looks bad and the lemon juce ain't going to help with that.


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Offlinennn-yan
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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: itsaconspiracy]
    #669941 - 05/09/13 11:29 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

I haven't been using lemon juice as a fungicide. Its a ph buffer. And I shit you not this showed up in a day.....:sad:
I was gonna use h2o2
The soil is coir verm and potting soil.
I water every 3to 4 days
And I water each plant about 1/2gal to 3/4gal ( each pot is 9.5gal of soil)


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Offlineitsaconspiracy
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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: nnn-yan]
    #669942 - 05/09/13 11:34 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

use some peroxide and see if that works just not too much


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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: itsaconspiracy]
    #669950 - 05/10/13 12:11 AM (5 years, 3 months ago)

H2O2 is fungi-acid.  It will burn it down pretty well.

Does your watering method not allow the top of the soil to dry out?

Good luck,

JD


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Offlinennn-yan
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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: Javadog]
    #669951 - 05/10/13 12:24 AM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Well when I water I just fill up the water bucket with a spout and pour over the top of the soil. Is this abad method?


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OfflineJavadog
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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: nnn-yan]
    #669952 - 05/10/13 12:30 AM (5 years, 3 months ago)

No.  I think that it is good to have the top dry out between
waterings, but that is just me.

Good luck,

JD


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OfflineSmokeSomeHash
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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: Javadog]
    #669953 - 05/10/13 01:27 AM (5 years, 3 months ago)

You need to fill the container with water until it starts to drain out of the bottom. If your soil is dry sometimes it pulls away from the side so the water just runs down the side so whag i like to do is water once, wait about 5 minutes, then water again, sometimes up to 3 times just to make sure its THOROUGHLY wet with NO dry spots...sometimes i tray water but thats diff.

Once its moist, start letting it drain immediately. If you have a drip tray empty it out, do not let the plant sit in its runoff (or excess water after point of saturation if tray watering).

Let it dry thoroughly before watering again. As in top two inches super dry.

Mold and fungus is usually a sign of high humidity, not enough air flow, too much water, or all of that combined.


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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: SmokeSomeHash]
    #669954 - 05/10/13 02:04 AM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Well you may not think it's the lemon juice. Guess what? It's the juice.

http://www.hydro-organics.com/home/index.php?productID=712

http://www.hydro-organics.com/home/index.php?ukey=product&productID=713

Those are organic ph adjusters cause I can't figure out why else you would use lemon juice.


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Offlinennn-yan
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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: SmokeSomeHash]
    #669964 - 05/10/13 08:00 AM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

SmokeSomeHash said:
You need to fill the container with water until it starts to drain out of the bottom. If your soil is dry sometimes it pulls away from the side so the water just runs down the side so whag i like to do is water once, wait about 5 minutes, then water again, sometimes up to 3 times just to make sure its THOROUGHLY wet with NO dry spots...sometimes i tray water but thats diff.
.



That's how I water.
But if lemon juic is a problem, could I use vinager to lower it? I'm trying to stay away from as many chemicals as possible.


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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: nnn-yan]
    #669965 - 05/10/13 08:22 AM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Look at the post above you man.  We already linked to natural ph adjusters.  :facepalm:


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OfflineSmokeSomeHash
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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: Hawksresurrection]
    #669967 - 05/10/13 09:21 AM (5 years, 3 months ago)

If lemon juice is so bad for growing why does Grodan put it right on their package to use lemon juice to condition their rockwool if you dont have pH down.

Ive used it before in soil and seen others do it as well but ive never seen mold like that.

If it really is the juice can someone explain to me why?


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Offlinennn-yan
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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: SmokeSomeHash]
    #670002 - 05/10/13 02:02 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

I appreciate the links. But I too still have question about why? I don't think it is the lemon juice because I used lemon juice since day 1 and no mold. But since the plants got big and the room had to be rearranged I still only have one fan. I may need more air circulation!
And on the plus side the h2o2 is working quite well :thumbup:


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OfflineMaestro
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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: nnn-yan] * 1
    #670003 - 05/10/13 02:08 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Ok ok... So since when is ph down a "chemical". It's just ionized liquid (hydrogen). Once you mix it into your solution, it is no longer ionized!! Just hydrogen...


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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: Maestro]
    #670010 - 05/10/13 04:03 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Phosphoric acid is a chemical


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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: SmokeSomeHash]
    #670013 - 05/10/13 04:23 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

SmokeSomeHash said:
Phosphoric acid is a chemical






But that doesn't mean it's a bad thing.  Also, I'm pretty sure it's naturally occurring.


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-niteowl


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OfflineSmokeSomeHash
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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: Maestro]
    #670014 - 05/10/13 04:27 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Sorry i shouldve quoted what i was replyin to, just hard to click links sometimes when i post from my phone.

I didnt say it was a bad thing, i just used some today...i was replying to this...

Quote:

Maestro said:
Ok ok... So since when is ph down a "chemical". It's just ionized liquid (hydrogen). Once you mix it into your solution, it is no longer ionized!! Just hydrogen...




I dont know what hes talkin bout there but im interested to find out.


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Edited by SmokeSomeHash (05/10/13 04:29 PM)


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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: SmokeSomeHash]
    #670015 - 05/10/13 04:28 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Oh I know that, it was meant for the other people thinking it was a bad thing :cookiemonster:


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Dude she isn't as young as she use to be.

-niteowl


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OfflineMaestro
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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: Hawksresurrection]
    #670016 - 05/10/13 04:33 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

What do you mean by chemical?

Because "In chemistry, a chemical substance is a form of matter that has constant chemical composition and characteristic " - Wikipedia


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OfflineMaestro
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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: Maestro]
    #670017 - 05/10/13 04:37 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Sorry, not in a possision to type a lot, but this is what I Basically mean:http://users.rcn.com/jkimball.ma.ultranet/BiologyPages/P/pH.html

"pH is a measure of the concentration of hydrogens ions (= H+) (= protons) in a solution.

Numerically it is the negative logarithm of that concentration expressed in moles per liter (M).

Pure water spontaneously dissociates into ions, forming a 10-7 M solution of H+ (and OH-). The negative of this logarithm is 7, so the pH of pure water is 7."

So once ph up or down is mixed into your solution (making it 7ish), its not charged anymore.


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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: Maestro]
    #670018 - 05/10/13 04:38 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

"the term 'chemical substance' means any organic or inorganic substance of a particular molecular identity, including – (i) any combination of such substances occurring in whole or in part as a result of a chemical reaction or occurring in nature

Read further :cookiemonster:


The base term chemical, without more knowledge, is confusing for people without a background in it.  People assume "chemicals" are bad.  And that's not necessarily true.


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-niteowl


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OfflineMaestro
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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: SmokeSomeHash]
    #670021 - 05/10/13 04:43 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Well that's my point exactly. I was answering this
Quote:

SmokeSomeHash said:
Sorry i shouldve quoted what i was replyin to, just hard to click links sometimes when i post from my phone.

I didnt say it was a bad thing, i just used some today...i was replying to this...

Quote:

Maestro said:
Ok ok... So since when is ph down a "chemical". It's just ionized liquid (hydrogen). Once you mix it into your solution, it is no longer ionized!! Just hydrogen...




I dont know what hes talkin bout there but im interested to find out.




It's why I put the word chemical in quotations in my original comment


Edited by Maestro (05/10/13 04:44 PM)


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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: Maestro]
    #670022 - 05/10/13 04:47 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Ah....


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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: Hawksresurrection]
    #670024 - 05/10/13 04:48 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

I just thought saying ph down is just ionized hydrogen was way too of a generalization, especially for those without a chemistry background. It makes it seem like  one simple chemical solution when there are many different types of acids, although yes all acids react similarly regarding H+ and what not. And yes they are chemicals.

But i wasnt talking about what happens after you put it in another solution. I was just talking about the liquid in the bottle. Not trying to give a chem lesson, just said phos acid is a chemical.


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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: SmokeSomeHash]
    #670028 - 05/10/13 04:55 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

:rolleyes: yeah I thought we were talking about "chemicals" ( the common misconception) not chemicals(everything-.-).

The charged ions(acidity) are the only potentially dangerous part of ph buffers. So if they're gone Before its added to soil, I don't see how that's using "chemicals".


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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: Maestro]
    #670034 - 05/10/13 07:13 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Honestly...i dont follow you.

The whole quotation thing isnt workin for me. Theyre chemicals...but theyre not "chemicals"?

I gotta smoke...


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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: SmokeSomeHash]
    #670043 - 05/10/13 08:53 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

You said sulfuric acid is a chemical in reply to me saying its a "chemical". If I meant chemical as in it's definition then why put the quotes?

Anyway, I did that because someone was saying they would add sulfuric acid as ph down but they don't want to use any chemicals, so I assumed they didn't mean it literally( especially since the water they would add it too is a chemical, literally )

Idk how else to explain it


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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: Maestro]
    #670060 - 05/10/13 11:50 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

It sounds like theyre just concerned about synthetic nutes...i dunno...

Youre a chemical


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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: SmokeSomeHash]
    #670066 - 05/11/13 12:42 AM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

SmokeSomeHash said:
Honestly...i dont follow you.






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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: Maestro]
    #670072 - 05/11/13 03:06 AM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:


If lemon juice is so bad for growing why does Grodan put it right on their package to use lemon juice to condition their rockwool if you dont have pH down.




Cause conditioning of rockwool happens one time.

:potleaf:


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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: Magash]
    #670104 - 05/11/13 11:05 AM (5 years, 3 months ago)

That still doesnt explain how it would cause mold like that...what happened to the OP anyways?

Has the mold gotten better or worse? I still wanna find out what caused that to begin with.


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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: SmokeSomeHash]
    #670105 - 05/11/13 12:14 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

You gotta be kidding right? There are other things other then the citic acid that is lowering the ph. They build up in the soil and start to mold. If ya wanna keep using it keep using it. I consider the fact that the only person using it is the only one having a problem with soil mass molding.


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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: Magash]
    #670151 - 05/11/13 07:58 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Im not saying it isnt the juice ive just been wondering cuz ive thrown whole lemons in the soil and never had a mold problem.

And thats cuz i got 15 acres of citrus....meyer lemon, tangerine, grapefruit, key lime...so lets just say its more than just a couple rotten fruits that have been used...i dont use the juice to balance ph but oh theres a lot of veggies ive grown and theres juice all over the place.

Shit our city compost facility sprays down tons of compost with tanker trucks full of spoiled citrus juice.

The only thing i can think of is cuz its in containers and didnt properly compost? Ive never had a mold problem like the OPs pics... but maybe ive just been lucky all these years.


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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: SmokeSomeHash]
    #670158 - 05/11/13 08:13 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Your soil may dry out faster and allow you to use it but it's not working for him. As far as yourself if it works don't change a thing. I'm all for the don't fix it if it ain't broke theory. I've got 40 acres in Mendo and 40 acres on the big island of Hawaii but no citrus growing but have been wanting to for a long time.

:happyweed:


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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: Magash]
    #670178 - 05/11/13 10:37 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Personally i use gh ph down or botanicare but after reading another thread i might try an.

I was just wonderin if it was like somethin specific cuz i wouldve attributed the mold more due to moisture conditions...i dunno...im askin too many questions lol.

And dude wheres the butt. Those tittays are scary.


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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: SmokeSomeHash]
    #670218 - 05/12/13 04:55 AM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Ok, so it sounds like you were talking about using it in an outdoor setting.  Outdoors you have a natural balance that will equal things out, but in a container a bunch of sugar from lemon juice will throw off the equilibrium.


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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: Hawksresurrection]
    #670226 - 05/12/13 05:17 AM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Hey guys I see this has become quite the conversation :lol:
My purpose with my grow is to stay and organic as possible in the sense that I only wanna work with organic chemicals. No inorganic/synthetic. I know there are ph uppers and downers and I appreciatethe links
The mold is nearly gone now tthat I got a second fan blowing in the room and I have been lightly misting with H2O2 (which is about as far as inorganic compound as I wanna go) I mean shit I will be smoking it :ganja:
I also just water with some nutritious phosphate (10-54-10) so my girls have plenty of food for budding:crazy2:


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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: nnn-yan]
    #670227 - 05/12/13 05:18 AM (5 years, 3 months ago)

I don't think you know what inorganic and organic really means man.


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Dude she isn't as young as she use to be.

-niteowl


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Offlinennn-yan
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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: Hawksresurrection]
    #670235 - 05/12/13 06:12 AM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Why do you say that?


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OfflineMaestro
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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: nnn-yan]
    #670243 - 05/12/13 10:29 AM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Well define organic chemicals
Quote:

nnn-yan said:
Why do you say that?






Edited by Maestro (05/12/13 10:29 AM)


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OfflineSmokeSomeHash
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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: Hawksresurrection]
    #670252 - 05/12/13 12:40 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

hawksapprentice said:
Ok, so it sounds like you were talking about using it in an outdoor setting.  Outdoors you have a natural balance that will equal things out, but in a container a bunch of sugar from lemon juice will throw off the equilibrium.




Yeah thats why i was thinking it didnt compost properly. Ive seen mold on old lemons but ive never seen it spread to soil like that. Its also regularly 100-110 during the hot summer months and we dont get shit for rain. Plus im out on a farm with nothin around so it gets real windy and everything dries quick.

As far as too much sugar...what about molasses? Thats like a sugar overload.

Im just gonna throw some seeds in ffof with some lemon juice and try it for myself in a low RH environment. I completely understand that the lemon could start breaking down and bacterias would contribute to mold, but i want to know if those mold spores would even begin to colonize without a high enough RH.

This thread has been racking my brain all week long and the mushroom grower in me just cant let it go without thinking of all the types of subtrates available and how spores work...as far as i know molds need humidity and lack of air flow, whether its mold in my grass, my shrooms, my fridge, the walls...etc.

But who knows...maybe ill just grow a shit container...but if i do at least ill know for sure.


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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: SmokeSomeHash]
    #670253 - 05/12/13 12:42 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

And maybe im wrong and gonna sound like a jackass but 10-54-10 does not sound organic to me..at least not in the sense that i think youre talkin about.


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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: nnn-yan]
    #670275 - 05/12/13 02:19 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Quote:

nnn-yan said:
Why do you say that?





Because it doesn't seem like you have a good grasp on what is or isn't "organic".  But that's mainly the media and societies fault for confusing people and using the terms where they don't apply.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inorganic_compound


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Dude she isn't as young as she use to be.

-niteowl


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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: Hawksresurrection]
    #670540 - 05/13/13 03:36 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

Maybe organic compounds was the wrong word, I should have said I don't want to use anything toxic or harmful. And when I was looking at fungicides I say all the label warnings about being dangerous or poisonous and one label even said that the fungicide chemical was directly linked to cancer in the state of California! And there is no way I would give my plant anything like that! And shit, I deffianity don't wanna be smoking anything toxic or cancerous OR even worse sharing toxic flowers with others!:thumbdown:
But thank you for the corrections fellas, I am here to learn and expand.  :buddha2:


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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: nnn-yan]
    #670560 - 05/13/13 04:58 PM (5 years, 3 months ago)

I think you just need better air flow to your plants it looks like spider web mold, usually from to much moisture. I could be wrong though.


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OfflineJd9086
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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: nnn-yan] * 1
    #833089 - 05/16/18 04:26 AM (3 months, 4 days ago)

Quote:

nnn-yan said:
Quote:

SmokeSomeHash said:
You need to fill the container with water until it starts to drain out of the bottom. If your soil is dry sometimes it pulls away from the side so the water just runs down the side so whag i like to do is water once, wait about 5 minutes, then water again, sometimes up to 3 times just to make sure its THOROUGHLY wet with NO dry spots...sometimes i tray water but thats diff.
.



That's how I water.
But if lemon juic is a problem, could I use vinager to lower it? I'm trying to stay away from as many chemicals as possible.




You do realize lemon juice has 'chemicals'... right? Organic is a marketing ploy. Use shit that works and is safe and forget this 'anti-chemical' nonsense


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Fuck Organic- chemical fertilizers and fungicides save lives


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OfflineJd9086
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Re: fungicide for organic soil [Re: Jd9086]
    #833090 - 05/16/18 04:40 AM (3 months, 3 days ago)

In terms of the mold though... keep your rh down! If you have mold on soil, youll prbly be dealing with PM and bud rot in your grows as well.

Temperature not too hot! Rh not too humid! Dont overwater! Have good air circulation and drainage in your soils. Environmental control will do more for you in terms of fungal control than anything else.


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Fuck Organic- chemical fertilizers and fungicides save lives


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