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InvisibleFurrowedBrowM
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Knowing your rights: Surviving police encounters
    #1695 - 04/20/08 05:08 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Hey guys, feel free to post your personal tips on dealing with police encounters or issues regarding personal rights. Please PLEASE do not pass along incorrect information. If you're not certain that what you are saying is true, please research it first.




http://www.demonoid.com/files/details/1035790/1593361/


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InvisibleFurrowedBrowM
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Re: Knowing your rights: Surviving police encounters [Re: FurrowedBrow]
    #1696 - 04/20/08 05:08 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Searches

During traffic stops and calls for service, police officers will often ask for permission to search you, your car, or your home. The reason they ask is that without probable cause to search, they cannot unless they get verbal or written permission. More information is provided below:

*Searches of a person - An officer may "pat down" a person being detained in order to check for weapons. This is known as a [wikipedia]Terry frisk. However, unless the officer has permission from the person being detained, has probable cause that person being searched is in possession of illegal items, or is arresting the person, the officer may not search.
*Searches of a vehicle - An officer may conduct a plain-view search of a vehicle while conducting a traffic stop. However, unless the car must be towed, or unless the officer has probable cause to believe that illegal items are in the car, or has permission from the driver, the vehicle may not be searched.
*Searches of a home - An officer may not enter a person's home or search it unless the officer has probable cause that a crime is in progress or if he or she has permission to enter. Otherwise, an officer may not enter a person's home without a search warrant.

In each of these situations, one need not give consent to a search by saying "I do not consent to any searches." Failure to provide consent does not provide cause for a search or arrest. In addition, consent may be revoked at any time after it is granted. It may be of interest to you that CHP policy dictates that officers should never ask for consent to search a vehicle. Either they have probable cause or they don't search, period.


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InvisibleSativus
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Re: Knowing your rights: Surviving police encounters [Re: FurrowedBrow]
    #1847 - 04/20/08 05:56 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

FurrowedBrow said:
*Searches of a person - An officer may "pat down" a person being detained in order to check for weapons. This is known as a [wikipedia]Terry frisk. However, unless the officer has permission from the person being detained, has probable cause that person being searched is in possession of illegal items, or is arresting the person, the officer may not search.




My question is, what constitutes probably cause here? I've run into this situation, where a cop asked to search me, and I told him no. He said he had to pat me down to check for weapons.

I didn't have any weapons on me, but he felt an Altoid tin (which happened to have a joint in it), and asked if he could see the contents. I told him no, I'm just on my way home, I don't think you've stopped me for any reason besides the fact that it's 2 in the morning, and I'd like to be on my way.

He let me go (after trying to badger me into letting him see the Altoid tin for a few more minutes), thankfully. But I've always wondered, would it have been within his rights to demand to see the contents?


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OfflinegeokillsA
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Re: Knowing your rights: Surviving police encounters [Re: Sativus]
    #2802 - 04/20/08 08:25 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

> would it have been within his rights to demand to see the contents?

Doubtful, otherwise he wouldn't have let you go, right?  Anyone with an agenda will press their angle, so stay confident and hold your ground.  If they get you, they get you, but just keep your cool and exercise your rights.  If and when it comes down to it, it'll be much easier for your lawyer to make your case if you consistently chose not to consent to an officer's requests and respectfully asked to be on your way.

Great topic FurrowedBrow! :thumbup:


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InvisibleSativus
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Re: Knowing your rights: Surviving police encounters [Re: geokills]
    #2940 - 04/20/08 08:53 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

geokills said:
Stay confident and hold your ground.  If they get you, they get you, but just keep your cool and exercise your rights.  If and when it comes down to it, it'll be much easier for your lawyer to make your case if you consistently chose not to consent to an officer's requests and respectfully asked to be on your way.




This approach has kept me out of trouble on more than one occasion.  If you have any drugs on your person, it's never a good idea to be disrepectful to an officer.

On one occasion, I had a hand-carved wooden one-hitter in my pocket that I forgot I had on me (or else I'd have chucked it along with my weed... which I receovered the next day :smirk:).  They found it, and were getting ready to charge me with possession of paraphenalia, but I somehow convinced them that I only smoked non-weed herbs out of the thing.  It helped my story that I had a bag of blue lotus in my pocket... I'm not sure whether it helped my story or not that my buddy said "Yeah officer, he makes a point never to smoke any weed out of that pipe."  They ended up giving the pipe back to me (:cool:) then I ended up losing it a couple years later (:sad:).


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Invisiblestill beLIEve
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Re: Knowing your rights: Surviving police encounters [Re: Sativus]
    #3306 - 04/20/08 10:35 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

honesty works sometimes

on tuesday i got pulled over like 10 minutes after i dropped acid and i had a warrant out for my arrest. first thing i told the cop was, 'im not even gonna lie man, i got a warrant out'. he asked what it was for, and i told him (not paying a speeding ticket). and i told him i was going to pay it first thing in the morning, but i had to wait until my money hit the account (which was honestly my plan, even before then). and after a little conversation, he just asked me to do him a favor and slow down.

needless to say, i was pretty relieved.


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niteowl said:
See, that term pedo gets thrown around a lot.
Is a 16 year old guy having sex w/a 16 year old girl a pedophile?
If not, then how is a 30 year old considered a pedophile for doing the same thing?
I think y'all need to look up the definition for pedophile.


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InvisibleLucky7s
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*DELETED* [Re: FurrowedBrow]
    #3625 - 04/20/08 11:57 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

*DELETED*


Edited by Lucky7s (08/18/09 08:52 AM)


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Offlinehighasfuck
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Re: Knowing your rights: Surviving police encounters [Re: Lucky7s]
    #3934 - 04/21/08 12:32 AM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Talk like a well educated person, watch your grammer, dont studder, eye contact!


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Offlinehighasfuck
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Re: Knowing your rights: Surviving police encounters [Re: highasfuck]
    #3939 - 04/21/08 12:34 AM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Also crack a joke every now and then. A sutle joke, so the officer can see your human and may lighten up. Not some stupid ass joke though, or something that may make him unconfortable.


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Offlinedill705
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Re: Knowing your rights: Surviving police encounters [Re: highasfuck]
    #4116 - 04/21/08 01:13 AM (8 years, 7 months ago)

In alot of situations the subtle humor works really well.

Eye contact is good unless you are nervous, in which case remember that they can't just cut your balls off in the street, this is America, you have rights so chill the fuck out.

That's the best lesson I can add. If shit gets tense or you start sweatin' it, chill the fuck out bro, make 'em work for their bust, you have rights.


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It's funny how when you're talking about testing the first nuclear weapon, which some scientists thought could possibly set off a chain reaction that would burn off our entire atmosphere and leave a lifeless barren rock floating in space, the risk is justified. But if a few extra people might get stoned it's just too dangerous to try.
-FF

I got $50 on Barack!!!


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Re: Knowing your rights: Surviving police encounters [Re: Sativus]
    #4521 - 04/21/08 06:06 AM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

Sativus said:
Quote:

FurrowedBrow said:
*Searches of a person - An officer may "pat down" a person being detained in order to check for weapons. This is known as a [wikipedia]Terry frisk. However, unless the officer has permission from the person being detained, has probable cause that person being searched is in possession of illegal items, or is arresting the person, the officer may not search.




My question is, what constitutes probably cause here? I've run into this situation, where a cop asked to search me, and I told him no. He said he had to pat me down to check for weapons.

I didn't have any weapons on me, but he felt an Altoid tin (which happened to have a joint in it), and asked if he could see the contents. I told him no, I'm just on my way home, I don't think you've stopped me for any reason besides the fact that it's 2 in the morning, and I'd like to be on my way.

He let me go (after trying to badger me into letting him see the Altoid tin for a few more minutes), thankfully. But I've always wondered, would it have been within his rights to demand to see the contents?




for a frisk they only need a reasonable suspicion you may be dangerous. To detain you for the frisk the same standard applies. As to the search of the tin, probably couldn't be justified, but you may have lost that anyways, as it seems courts don't give a fuck, around here anyways.

The search is supposed to be circumscribed to the needs of the officer for safety. Its hard to see how the tin could have impacted this.


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Offlinedill705
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Re: Knowing your rights: Surviving police encounters [Re: johnm214]
    #4862 - 04/21/08 12:51 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Quote:

as it seems courts don't give a fuck




Another nugget of wisdom worth repeating.


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It's funny how when you're talking about testing the first nuclear weapon, which some scientists thought could possibly set off a chain reaction that would burn off our entire atmosphere and leave a lifeless barren rock floating in space, the risk is justified. But if a few extra people might get stoned it's just too dangerous to try.
-FF

I got $50 on Barack!!!


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OfflineWysefool
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Re: Knowing your rights: Surviving police encounters [Re: FurrowedBrow]
    #7600 - 04/22/08 02:36 AM (8 years, 7 months ago)

The worst is that they can just say they smell weed and use that as probable cause.

The way something smells can vary from person to person (subjective sense) so I think we should be fighting so it can't be used as probable cause. :crankey:


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You dumb bastard. It's not a schooner... it's a Sailboat.


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Offlinedill705
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Re: Knowing your rights: Surviving police encounters [Re: Wysefool]
    #8336 - 04/22/08 01:12 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Then they need to find weed to justify the search. If you're holdin' something else and they find that, but no weed, you might be able to have that search thrown out in court.

Of course you'd never get your stuff back, but I've definitely heard of this before.


--------------------
It's funny how when you're talking about testing the first nuclear weapon, which some scientists thought could possibly set off a chain reaction that would burn off our entire atmosphere and leave a lifeless barren rock floating in space, the risk is justified. But if a few extra people might get stoned it's just too dangerous to try.
-FF

I got $50 on Barack!!!


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Re: Knowing your rights: Surviving police encounters [Re: dill705]
    #8644 - 04/22/08 05:24 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

Pedal to the metal!  :stoned:


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Re: Knowing your rights: Surviving police encounters [Re: FurrowedBrow]
    #10265 - 04/23/08 11:33 AM (8 years, 7 months ago)

I do want everybody to know this fact though... I am taking this right off the page so i don't misrepresent any of the knowledge of this... How a drug sniffing dog can be used to by-pass you saying NO..

Narco dogs are used as ruses against humans, to violate constitutional rights against searches and seizures. Here's how -

* Some cops ask to search cars for no reason at all during routine traffic stops. They ask to search because they know that most victims do not know that drivers can "just say no" (most drivers are know-nothings about constitutional rights). Drivers who do know are often too meek to "just say no." It is unknown how often cops ask for consent to search and how often consent is given under duress or ignorance. Drivers who do not complain roadside will not complain, learn or litigate later.

* If drivers say "no," then some cops tell drivers that an ordeal is inevitable because the cop radioed for a canine and it is coming to the scene. That warning is often a lie to induce consent. There is no police dog on the way.

* If a dog is or is not "on the way," some cops add additional lies to make drivers think that there will be a long wait and that the driver must stay until a dog arrives. Cops rely on driver ignorance of the fact that evidence will be suppressed if drivers are detained longer than it takes to complete the traffic stop (e.g. write the ticket). Drivers are induced to consent to search to avoid a long wait based on lies.

* If a dog is en route, some cops let drivers think that they are obliged to stay even when the cop has no reason to detain drivers any longer. Cop's rationalize that drivers inexplicably loiter roadside with cops, or that drivers enjoy waiting for dog sniffs. Cops take advantage of drivers who are too stupid (or too meek) to ask if they are free to go, so that drivers "consent" to unwarranted detention by not leaving.

* Cops lie about how long it takes to write tickets or to obtain a radio response on tag inquiry. If a dog is actually en route, then some cops write tickets very slowly, until the dog arrives.

* When cops need consent, and drivers say "no," then there is no basis to search. Without consent, cops need "probable cause" to search. Cops can create cause by claiming that canines alerted, even if there are no alerts, or canines can be cued. A search is forced against the driver's will. In January 2005, the U.S. Supreme Court ruled in Illinois vs. Caballes that a dog sniff during a traffic stop was not a "search." Caballes and similar cases turn canines into props for lies. When dogs are used as props for lies, it doesn't matter whether dogs are well-trained.

* If a dog alerts and nothing is found, then cops will never record that as an error. If cross-examined later, they will testify that the dog detected lingering odors of contraband that were recently present. Cops will testify that dogs never make mistakes, never have and never will, and that apparent errors are skillful detections of lingering (residual) odors of contraband. No one can question a dog about whether the cop is lying or mistaken, and it is usually a waste of time to ask a cop the same types of questions.

* Many errors by drug dogs cause lawyers to wonder if police carry drugs to plant scents so that drug dogs will alert. Some news items support such speculation in cases where drugs have been planted by police. http://rexcurry.net/drugdogsframe.html Drug laws are wrong in the first place, and in the second place drug laws cause more wrongdoing by government during enforcement.

Government's attitude toward your liberty is like a dog at a fire hydrant.

Police-state tactics were witnessed worldwide via videotape from Goose Creek High School in South Carolina, where children were forced to the floor in handcuffs and terrorized by dogs and cops with guns drawn.


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Invisiblestill beLIEve
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Re: Knowing your rights: Surviving police encounters [Re: Mrsinister]
    #17366 - 05/02/08 05:30 PM (8 years, 7 months ago)

^ good info


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niteowl said:
See, that term pedo gets thrown around a lot.
Is a 16 year old guy having sex w/a 16 year old girl a pedophile?
If not, then how is a 30 year old considered a pedophile for doing the same thing?
I think y'all need to look up the definition for pedophile.


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Offlinegodspeedyou
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Re: Knowing your rights: Surviving police encounters [Re: FurrowedBrow]
    #58300 - 06/16/08 02:10 AM (8 years, 5 months ago)

great thread.  :rastamon:


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InvisibleDizz
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Re: Knowing your rights: Surviving police encounters [Re: godspeedyou]
    #58359 - 06/16/08 08:14 AM (8 years, 5 months ago)

yea bloody law inforcement...
I was sprung by a sniffer dog with only a few grams of weed earlier this year when attending a music festival, lucky though because my good friend had a fair few pills on him at the time and my weed covered up the scent;)
When i was sprung, bout 10 cops all came up to see what id pull out of my pocket, when i pulled out buds and a few joints, they replied "oh its only weed, pffft" Lol.
Didnt get charged or anything cause the cops and i were laughing about it.
The dogs were unexpected aswell.
Ended up all good though would have been good to smoke up that day...


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Re: Knowing your rights: Surviving police encounters [Re: FurrowedBrow]
    #184139 - 01/18/09 10:54 AM (7 years, 10 months ago)

Honestly somebody had to revive this topic, it could be quite helpful. Basically, everytime I have been pulled over with dope I tell them some straight bullshit and they occasionally try to see if I am lieing but just keep feeding them the same shit and don't ever agree to a search.


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