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OfflineSirius
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Cheap CO2
    #1093 - 04/20/08 03:08 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

A friend was reading around and noticed a suggested way of producing some CO2 for plants, which was basically putting vinegar on baking soda. Of course, as it said, as soon as the room vents its gone, and it would require someone going in and doing it daily and whatnot. However, it seems like some sort of system for CO2 would be getting complex or spendy, and the friend is only looking at a small little project for personal use.

Is this an option; does it actually work? Are there better alternatives that wouldn't be expensive or suspicious? The friend definitely wants to make sure that the amount of available CO2 isn't a limiting factor on growth... how much baking soda and vinegar are we talking here if it does work, for a smaller room (no measurements as of yet, but let's say maybe four foot by four foot)?

Thanks for the help. :smile:


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Offlinedjsethall
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Re: Cheap CO2 [Re: Sirius]
    #1158 - 04/20/08 03:27 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

Why not just BYOB? Brew your own beer. The process of turning sugars into alcohol produces a lot of Co2. It is very easy to rig up your airlock to vent into your chamber.


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Any posts made by me are purely fictional in nature and by no means is anything I say to be taken seriously. I do not grow or condone the growing of anything not legal. Any and all pictures I post are pictures wideley available on the internet and any discussions I am involved in are purely hypothetical or are commentary in nature and should not constitute advice or be considered advice to assist in activities that are deemed illegal.


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Offlinetaharka
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Re: Cheap CO2 [Re: Sirius]
    #1355 - 04/20/08 04:14 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

Fermenting sugar with yeast in your grow-room is a better and cheaper long-term option than baking soda/vinegar. Even a small bottle puts out a huge volume of CO2. Just do it in tubs or several gallon bottles. The yeasty smell might even do something to mask the smell of your plants.


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OfflineSirius
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Re: Cheap CO2 [Re: taharka]
    #1372 - 04/20/08 04:18 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

Most intriguing. Where can I find more info? :smile:


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Offlinetaharka
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Re: Cheap CO2 [Re: Sirius]
    #1547 - 04/20/08 04:41 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

Maybe Here Or any home-fermenting site.

I just filled a jug with warm sugar-water and added a pinch of yeast, shaking well. CO2 was bubbling out visibly the next day. I used aquarium tubing to bubble the CO2 through a smaller bottle of water to trap any organic matter coming through with it. This cut down on the smell a bit, too. I would get a bubble every few seconds from such a standard-diameter aquarium hose when the culture was most active. The yeast will die when it runs out of sugar - you can add more - or when the alcohol concentration reaches ~14%. You could then distill this mixture in a wok still to get alcohol. Two for one.


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InvisibleScript
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Re: Cheap CO2 [Re: Sirius]
    #1550 - 04/20/08 04:41 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

what's wrong with bubbly water in a spray bottle?


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OfflineSirius
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Re: Cheap CO2 [Re: taharka]
    #1608 - 04/20/08 04:50 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

taharka said:
I just filled a jug with warm sugar-water and added a pinch of yeast, shaking well. CO2 was bubbling out visibly the next day.




This is definitely the way to go then, it would seem. My friend can't wait to try it out. :wink:


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Invisibleniteowl
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Re: Cheap CO2 [Re: Sirius]
    #1994 - 04/20/08 06:22 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

I have heard of the yeast trick too.


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The Ego is a pathological condition
like a calcareous tumor or cyst
that begins growing in the personality
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-Terence McKenna-


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Offlinedjsethall
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Re: Cheap CO2 [Re: niteowl]
    #3057 - 04/20/08 09:21 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

Even better Idea which may be free. Go to your local supermarket and find out what day they get there frozen shipment on and ask them for the dry ice that they use to keep it frozen during shipment. I work at a supermarket and we just throw it away.


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Any posts made by me are purely fictional in nature and by no means is anything I say to be taken seriously. I do not grow or condone the growing of anything not legal. Any and all pictures I post are pictures wideley available on the internet and any discussions I am involved in are purely hypothetical or are commentary in nature and should not constitute advice or be considered advice to assist in activities that are deemed illegal.


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OfflineYrat
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Re: Cheap CO2 [Re: djsethall]
    #4596 - 04/21/08 08:58 AM (13 years, 5 months ago)

free dry ice every couple days would sublimate into a crap ton of CO2. Combine this with some jugs of yeast (homemade wine or cider) for slow, long-term production with room-filling blasts of pure carbon dioxide. I think this would definitely increase growth, and hey, you've got nothing to lose anyway.


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OfflineSirius
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Re: Cheap CO2 [Re: Yrat]
    #4648 - 04/21/08 09:24 AM (13 years, 5 months ago)

Well, I don't think my friend would be able to go about the free dry ice thing, but the sugar-water/yeast idea definitely seems to be the best way to go. My friend hasn't done any measurements yet, but its looking like either 3 square feet or possibly 6 square feet of floor space (depending on an adjustment being made... doors opening into a room SUCK :lol:). The room is pretty tall, maybe ten feet?

How much CO2 producing jugs would it take for that kind of space? My friend wants to give them as much CO2 as they need, and then some. :wink:


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OfflineSmallTime
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Re: Cheap CO2 [Re: Sirius]
    #4786 - 04/21/08 11:37 AM (13 years, 5 months ago)

If you are serious about CO2 enrichment than you should start saving for a propane generator and a controller. There isn't really a way to keep a constant level with yeast or sugar.

Proper ventilation will give you better yields with less of a hassle.


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OfflineSirius
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Re: Cheap CO2 [Re: SmallTime]
    #5172 - 04/21/08 03:52 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

Well, proper ventilation won't be that possible for my friend due to the logistics of the room, unfortunately, and a propane generator might be a little too advanced for what he's looking to do. There's not too much room or anything, but maybe after he grows for awhile its something to look into.

Of course, he's more than willing to line the room with bottle after bottle of the yeast stuff. Would a jug of sugar-water/yeast start producing CO2 right away, or does it take a few days before that begins? Also, would it produce the same amount continuously until it has reached its limit, or is there some sort of curve? I would think that starting different jugs at different times would help to bring some consistency in the release - just need some more info on that in order to figure it out. :smile:


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OfflineYrat
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Re: Cheap CO2 [Re: Sirius]
    #5193 - 04/21/08 04:09 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

CO2 will be produced as long as there is sugar for the yeast to consume. you will see this as bubbles escaping the liquid. when the bubbles stop, you can add more sugar. this can continue until the alcohol content gets too high and begins to kill them off itself.

if you can start new jugs at the same rate that you remove (drink?) them then you will always be producing the same amount of CO2. then the question is how many jugs can you buy/find and fit into the room.


--------------------
"Prohibition will work great injury to the cause of temperance. It is a species of intemperance within itself, for it goes beyond the bounds of reason in that it attempts to control a man's appetite by legislation, and makes a crime out of things that are not crimes. A Prohibition law strikes a blow at the very principles upon which our government was founded." - Abraham Lincoln


"There are a thousand hacking at the branches of evil
to one who is striking at the root"
~ Henry D. Thoreau
Strike The Root
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Invisibleniteowl
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Re: Cheap CO2 [Re: Sirius]
    #5202 - 04/21/08 04:14 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

What I did last time I tried to grow, was just put a big glass of warm sugar water, near my plants, and added a half of a package of yeast and stirred.

Just add more sugar water as needed.

As long as the yeast is bubbling, it is making CO2


--------------------
The Ego is a pathological condition
like a calcareous tumor or cyst
that begins growing in the personality
in the absence of hallucinogenic substances
-Terence McKenna-


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OfflineSirius
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Re: Cheap CO2 [Re: Yrat]
    #5203 - 04/21/08 04:15 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

It'd be fun to look into homemade alcohol later, definitely. :smile:

One question then about how many jugs can be stuffed in the room, how many do you think would be necessary? I wouldn't think the space would be more than 6' by 6' floor space, with probably a 10' ceiling...

Is there any good cheap way of measuring CO2 levels?


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OfflineSirius
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Re: Cheap CO2 [Re: niteowl]
    #5205 - 04/21/08 04:15 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

niteowl said:
What I did last time I tried to grow, was just put a big glass of warm sugar water, near my plants, and added a half of a package of yeast and stirred.




How many plants did you have? :smile:


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Offlinearaucaria
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Re: Cheap CO2 [Re: Sirius]
    #5210 - 04/21/08 04:19 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

make sure you stop the CO2 production in the dark cycle


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Offlineerb
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Re: Cheap CO2 [Re: araucaria]
    #5314 - 04/21/08 04:55 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

This is a nice product if your looking for some CO2 enrichment.

www.co2boost.com


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OfflineSirius
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Re: Cheap CO2 [Re: araucaria]
    #5396 - 04/21/08 05:53 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

araucaria said:
make sure you stop the CO2 production in the dark cycle




During the flowering phase, you mean? Why should this be done? :smile:


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Offlinearaucaria
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Re: Cheap CO2 [Re: Sirius]
    #5415 - 04/21/08 06:06 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

because teh plants need O2 during the dark cycle


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Invisibleniteowl
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Re: Cheap CO2 [Re: Sirius]
    #5426 - 04/21/08 06:17 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Sirius said:
Quote:

niteowl said:
What I did last time I tried to grow, was just put a big glass of warm sugar water, near my plants, and added a half of a package of yeast and stirred.




How many plants did you have? :smile:




4


--------------------
The Ego is a pathological condition
like a calcareous tumor or cyst
that begins growing in the personality
in the absence of hallucinogenic substances
-Terence McKenna-


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Invisibleniteowl
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Re: Cheap CO2 [Re: araucaria]
    #5439 - 04/21/08 06:26 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

araucaria said:
make sure you stop the CO2 production in the dark cycle





What if you're giving them light 24/7?


--------------------
The Ego is a pathological condition
like a calcareous tumor or cyst
that begins growing in the personality
in the absence of hallucinogenic substances
-Terence McKenna-


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Offlinearaucaria
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Re: Cheap CO2 [Re: Sirius]
    #5465 - 04/21/08 06:37 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

i would think it's OK. IMO it's best to give them a dark cycle though (rest, root development etc) i don't think that plants can use up all the CO2 24/7


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OfflineSirius
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Re: Cheap CO2 [Re: araucaria]
    #5504 - 04/21/08 06:50 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

Erb posted something that seems to debunk the dark cycle during vegetative growth for rest and whatnot. Here's the thread:

http://www.growery.org/forums/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/4843/an/0/page/0


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Offlinearaucaria
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Re: Cheap CO2 [Re: Sirius]
    #5542 - 04/21/08 07:04 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

C3 plants(cannabis/veggies) gather CO2 only during the light period when they are photosynthesizing. During the dark period these plants only use oxygen for their metabolic life processes. They don't uptake CO2 , nor do they use it. As soon and as long as the light is on, C3 plants gather and use CO2 for photosynthesis.

C3 plants also have the ability to use higher concentrations of CO2 than what is found in the air. If the light is bright enough and the plants have sufficient nutes, their growth rate will accelerate from it(2000ppm vs. 400ppm of CO2), which increases yield. They can do this continuously, without a dark period throughout the vegetative stage.



from the thread mentioned above


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Re: Cheap CO2 [Re: erb]
    #5845 - 04/21/08 08:54 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

erb said:
This is a nice product if your looking for some CO2 enrichment.

www.co2boost.com




Wow, those look like grow bags (mushroom kind) in the video. I wonder what it is?


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OfflineYrat
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Re: Cheap CO2 [Re: fondacox]
    #8117 - 04/22/08 08:38 AM (13 years, 5 months ago)

The "dark cycle" is kind of a misleading name. It doesn't take place solely in the dark, but rather it doesn't need light to occur. Photosynthesis on the other hand, obviously needs light. The construction of carbohydrates (the dark cycle) happens continuously, even in the light during photosynthesis.


--------------------
"Prohibition will work great injury to the cause of temperance. It is a species of intemperance within itself, for it goes beyond the bounds of reason in that it attempts to control a man's appetite by legislation, and makes a crime out of things that are not crimes. A Prohibition law strikes a blow at the very principles upon which our government was founded." - Abraham Lincoln


"There are a thousand hacking at the branches of evil
to one who is striking at the root"
~ Henry D. Thoreau
Strike The Root
                                                                                      :gethigh:


Edited by Yrat (04/22/08 12:53 PM)


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OfflineHanky
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Re: Cheap CO2 [Re: Sirius]
    #8172 - 04/22/08 09:37 AM (13 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Sirius said:
Erb posted something that seems to debunk the dark cycle during vegetative growth for rest and whatnot. Here's the thread:

http://www.growery.org/forums/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/4843/an/0/page/0




My plants never see darkness until they are flowered, darkness during veg is a waste of time.


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OfflineSirius
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Re: Cheap CO2 [Re: Hanky]
    #8176 - 04/22/08 09:41 AM (13 years, 5 months ago)

Would you suggest stopping CO2 production like someone did above? My friend is definitely keeping the light on 24/7 during veg. :thumbup:


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Offlineroyer9864

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Re: Cheap CO2 [Re: Hanky]
    #8184 - 04/22/08 09:50 AM (13 years, 5 months ago)

i have grown both ways and dont really see a huge difference, the last time i grew i kept the light on 24 hrs a day for veg because i have found that the bulb dies/blows quicker when it is turning off and on more.


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OfflineHanky
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Re: Cheap CO2 [Re: royer9864]
    #8187 - 04/22/08 09:55 AM (13 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

royer9864 said:
i have found that the bulb dies/blows quicker when it is turning off and on more.




Timers also are a factor as they burn out over time. plants in veg don't need a dark period from what I've observed so why bother with it...


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Offlineroyer9864

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Re: Cheap CO2 [Re: Hanky]
    #8188 - 04/22/08 09:57 AM (13 years, 5 months ago)

yep those are my thoughts also


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OfflineHanky
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Re: Cheap CO2 [Re: royer9864]
    #8189 - 04/22/08 10:04 AM (13 years, 5 months ago)

One thing I have noticed through a timer setting error is that plants veged on 24/0 will happily flower when reduced to 13.5/10.5 I think they'd flower on 14/10 and possibly even higher light periods. I changed my timer to 12/12 after discovering the error three weeks in but I'm tempted to run a whole flower cycle on 14/10 to see what happens. The possibility for increased yield is there to be explored.


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OfflineSirius
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Re: Cheap CO2 [Re: Hanky]
    #8321 - 04/22/08 12:56 PM (13 years, 5 months ago)

Quote:

Hanky said:
The possibility for increased yield is there to be explored.




Keep us posted. :smile: Is there the possibility that it will take longer to finish?


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