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 OoBYCoO
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 The World According To Monsanto 
#589584 - 09/30/11 06:06 PM (12 years, 6 months ago) |
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The World According To Monsanto
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OoBYCoO
Stranger
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 Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: OoBYCoO]
#589587 - 09/30/11 06:31 PM (12 years, 6 months ago) |
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September 30:
Brooklyn, NY 4:00pm-9:00pm – Welcome center & marcher check-in at LaunchPad, 721 Franklin Avenue, Brooklyn, NY
October 1:
Brooklyn, NY, United Nations 10:00am – Meet at Flatbush Coop, 1415 Cortelyou Road, Brooklyn NY, for a sendoff! – RSVP on Facebook
11:00am-1:00pm – RALLY: Grand Army Plaza, Prospect Park, Brooklyn, NY – RSVP on Facebook
3:30pm – March to United Nations for brief press conference
Overnight: – Hyatt Regency in Jersey City, NJ or camp at Liberty Harbor Marina, 11 Luis Munoz Marin Boulevard, Jersey City, NJ
October 2:
Jersey City, Newark, Millburn-Union, Springfield, NJ 8:30am – Liberty Harbor Marina
11:30am – Subia’s Organic Market, 506 Jersey Avenue, Jersey City, NJ – RSVP on Facebook
2:00pm – Health Food Market, 840 Broad Street, Newark, NJ – RSVP on Facebook
Overnight: – Hotel 304 West, 304 Route 22, West Springfield, NJ or camp at Watchung Reservation, 452 New Providence Road, Mountainside, NJ
October 3:
Scotch Plains, New Brunswick, NJ 8:30am – Hotel 304 West
10:45am – RALLY: Autumn Harvest Health Food 1625 East 2nd St, Scotch Plains, NJ – RSVP on Facebook
4:00pm-5:00pm – MEET-UP: George Street Co-op Natural Foods Market & Cafe, 89 Morris St, New Brunswick, NJ – RSVP on Facebook
Overnight: Rutgers University, Continuing Studies Conference Center, 178 Ryders Lane, New Brunswick, NJ or camp at New Brunswick Bike Library, 154 Commercial Avenue, New Brunswick, NJ
October 4:
Princeton, NJ 8:30am – New Brunswick Bike Library
2:00pm – Whole Earth Center, 360 Nassau Street, Princeton, NJ – RSVP on Facebook
Overnight: – Extended Stay America Hotel, 3450 Brunswick Pike, Princeton, NJ or camp on site
October 5:
Morrisville, Trevose, PA 8:30am – Extended Stay America Hotel
12:45pm-1:45pm – MEET-UP: Big Bear Natural Foods, 322 West Trenton Avenue #1, Morrisville, PA – RSVP on Facebook
Overnight: Comfort Inn, 2779 Lincoln Highway, Trevose, PA or camp at Churchville Nature Center Auditorium, 501 Churchville Lane, Chruchville, PA
October 6:
Jenkintown, Philadelphia, PA 8:30am – Churchville Nature Center Auditorium
3:30pm-5:00pm – NON-GMO FOAM RALLY: – Weavers Way Co-Op, 559 Carpenter Lane, Philadelphia, PA – RSVP on Facebook
7:00pm-8:00pm – MEET-UP: – Mariposa Food Coop, 4726 Baltimore Avenue, Philadelphia, PA – RSVP on Facebook
Overnight: The Gables Bed & Breakfast, 4520 Chester Avenue, Philadelphia, PA or camp inside Beaumont Warehouse, 5027 Beaumont Ave, Philadelphia, PA
October 7:
Philadelphia, PA Heal Your Feet day! (March Break)
Sustainability Skill Share: Noon – 11:30pm – The Ellen Powell Tiberino Memorial Museum, 3819 Hamilton Street, Philadelphia, PA – RSVP on Facebook
October 8:
Springfield, PA; Wilmington, DE 8:30am – The Gables Bed & Breakfast, 4520 Chester Avenue, Philadelphia, PA
10:45am – Martindale’s Natural Market, 1172 Baltimore Pike, Springfield, PA – RSVP on Facebook
Overnight: – Best Western, 1807 Concord Pike, Wilmington, DE
October 9:
Hockessin, Newark, DE 8:30am – Best Western
3:00pm – Newark Natural Foods, 280 East Main Street, Newark, DE
Overnight: Courtyard by Marriott, 400 David Hollowell Drive, Newark, DE or backyard camping
October 10:
Amish Country, Darlington, MD 8:00am Courtyard by Marriott
No store visits, scenic march through organic and GMO farms
Overnight: Camp Ramblewood, 2564 Silver Road, Darlington, MD
October 11:
Monkton, MD 8:00am – Camp Ramblewood
No store visits, scenic march through organic and GMO farms
Overnight: Camp Running Bear, 17433 Big Falls Road, Monkton, MD
October 12:
Timonium, Baltimore MD 8:00am – Camp Running Bear
2:00pm – MOM’s Organic Market, 20 W. Ridgely Road, Timonium, MD – RSVP on Facebook
Overnight: Radisson Hotel Cross Keyes, 5100 Falls Road, Baltimore MD or Mount Washington Conference Center, 5801 Smith Avenue, Baltimore, MD
October 13:
Baltimore, Ellicott City, MD 8:00am – Mount Washington Conference Center
10:00am – OK Natural Foods, 11 West Preston Street, Baltimore, MD – RSVP on Facebook
11:00am–6:00pm – RALLY: Maryland Institute College of Art, 1300 W. Mount Royal Avenue, Baltimore, MD – RSVP on Facebook
Overnight: Patapsco Valley State Park, 8020 Baltimore National Pike, Ellicott City, MD
October 14:
Jessup, Laurel, MD 8:00am – Patapsco Valley State Park
11:00pm – MOM’s Organic Market, 7351 Assateague Drive, Jessup, MD – RSVP on Facebook
Overnight: Comfort Suites, 14402 Laurel Place, Laurel, MD
October 15:
College Park, Takoma Park, MD 8:00am – Comfort Suites
12:15pm – University of Maryland College Park (TBD)
3:00pm – Silver Spring Food Co-op, 201 Ethan Allen Avenue, Takoma Park, MD
Overnight: Hilltop Hostel, 300 Carroll Street NW, Washington, DC or backyard camping
October 16:
Washington, DC 11:00am – Hilltop Hostel
1:00pm-5pm – WORLD FOOD DAY RALLY: White House in Lafayette Park, 1600 H Street, NW Washington, DC. Marchers estimated to arrive at 1pm. Event to feature Mom’s Panel, and greeting of Right2Know marchers! – RSVP on Facebook
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Picklez
Registered: 04/20/08
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: OoBYCoO] 1
#589602 - 09/30/11 08:49 PM (12 years, 6 months ago) |
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Monsanto has actually done a lot of good in 3rd world/ developing countries with the genetic engineering of drought-resistant food crops and higher nutritional values of said crops. I know they have caused a lot of conflict but they arent all bad news
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OoBYCoO
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: Picklez] 1
#589607 - 09/30/11 09:26 PM (12 years, 6 months ago) |
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That might be so, but I'm more concerned about their actions here in the US. Most foreign governments have BANNED the use of GMO's! India is suffering horrendously b/c of them! They do WAY more harm then good IMO.
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Picklez
Registered: 04/20/08
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Last seen: 9 years, 10 months
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: OoBYCoO]
#589609 - 09/30/11 09:33 PM (12 years, 6 months ago) |
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How is India suffering from GM Crops?
What action here in the US? the fact that they are suing farmers who try to use their patented seed and claim that they dont know how it got into their field?
How do GM Crops do "way," more harm than good?
I am just looking for a debate here, not trying to make ya mad. It's a field of study that I am heavily involved in
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OoBYCoO
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: Picklez]
#589618 - 09/30/11 10:52 PM (12 years, 6 months ago) |
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lol I'm not mad, well not at you anyway. 
There is PLENTY of documentation on what's going on in India regarding Monsanto. Monsanto recently bought out their major seed co's to get rid of the competition and gain market share. The farmers are committing suicide in India b/c they take loans out on their farms to buy Monsanto's expensive seeds for them only to fail. There have been MASSIVE uprisings and protest in India b/c of it. Do some of your own research. I'll try to find some of the stuff I'm referring too for you. Some of it is also in the video I posted. 
I guess we can't continue the debate unless you do some research b/c the majority of research shows that they do in fact do "way" more harm then good. Nat Geo has done docu's on it... look at "Sex, Drugs, and Plants."
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OoBYCoO
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: OoBYCoO]
#589620 - 09/30/11 11:08 PM (12 years, 6 months ago) |
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National Geographic Wild: Sex Drugs and Plants: Sex, Drugs and Plants' gives an insight into the fascinating world of plants. By feeling, "hearing," smelling and tasting, these plants continue their journey through the undergrowth, in a bid for survival. Scientists and experts reveal the skills and tricks that plants use to survive, with predatory plants using every trick in the book to entice a meal, including sniffing out their prey. Exploring the defences plants employ to save themselves from harm, featuring the amazing acacia, which commands an ant army to fend off unwanted visitors. Experts also investigate how human intervention affects the plants, including a fascinating look at how technological advances could change the future of farming. From commanding ant armies to defend them or ‘sniffing’ out their prey, plants use all the skills and tricks at their disposal to survive
http://www.putlocker.com/file/1781GD34TL7S3#
skip to 34:00 and that's just ONE example!
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NobodyImportant
Science Is Subculture
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: OoBYCoO] 2
#589623 - 09/30/11 11:11 PM (12 years, 6 months ago) |
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My problem with GMOs besides the fact that I dont agree with modifying nature on a global scale is this, what happens when the pollen from the GM crops blows out into true nature, we could get some weird mutant plants, or we could create plants that cant survive their normal environment or who knows, anything could happen really
--------------------
 
Glass By: US Tubes, ZOB, Roor.de, Sheldon Black, Jerome Baker, Medicali, Kennaroo, Sand, Alex K, Local and Unknown Artists
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DungenessDank
Lord of the Flies
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: OoBYCoO]
#589624 - 09/30/11 11:12 PM (12 years, 6 months ago) |
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Yeah, usually I can play the devils advocate for corporations, but Monsanto is just sleazy, and if we had a decent judicial system they wouldn't exist anymore. Being said, I don't think a good answer is to push for "GMO" labeling. Anything that is going to raise the cost of food products is going to cause people to starve.
Quote:
NobodyImportant said:
My problem with GMOs besides the fact that I dont agree with modifying nature on a global scale is this, what happens when the pollen from the GM crops blows out into true nature, we could get some weird mutant plants, or we could create plants that cant survive their normal environment or who knows, anything could happen really
Or worse yet, the pollen could blow miles onto someone elses crops, and then when they harvest their seed for next year, Monsanto sues them because they "stole" their intellectual property (their corn genetics).
This shit actually happens.
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Picklez
Registered: 04/20/08
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: OoBYCoO]
#589625 - 09/30/11 11:15 PM (12 years, 6 months ago) |
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I have done YEARS worth of research on GM crops and Monsanto. I just havent heard anything about farmers in India committing suicide because they cant afford their seeds. Plus you have to look at the positives of what they are doing also. They are creating food with more nutritional value than regular crops. Their crops are more drought-resistant and severe weather tolerant. They have GM crops that are able to grow in places where normal crops would not be able to grow (places like Africa)
As someone who has done tons of research on the subject, I am still torn as to whether or not GM ares a good thing or a bad thing. There is always 2 sides of the story.
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OoBYCoO
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: Picklez]
#589628 - 09/30/11 11:29 PM (12 years, 6 months ago) |
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Well here's some news articles to help you out w/ that...
http://motherjones.com/tom-philpott/2011/09/monsanto-denies-superinsect-science
http://www.scidev.net/en/news/mexican-trial-of-gm-maize-stirs-debate.html
http://www.abc.net.au/science/articles/2011/04/05/3182831.htm?WT.mc_id=science_twitterfeed_enviro&utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=twitter&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+abcscience_enviro+%28Environment+news+and+features%2C+from+ABC+Science%29
http://www.naturalnews.com/033216_GMO_contamination_lawsuits.html#ixzz1Tx53JlvN
Similar Movies regarding Monsanto:
Food Inc.
Future of Food
The World According to Monsanto
Food Matters
Image: IRRI Images via flickr
Mississippi and Iowa, two big farm states, were recently tested for glyphosate levels in the air and water. Researchers found the key ingredient of Monsanto's Roundup herbicide in every stream sample tested, Scientific American reports.
The magazine quotes Paul Capel, environmental chemist and head of the agricultural chemicals team at the U.S. Geological Survey Office, saying: "It is out there in significant levels. It is out there consistently."
But Capel said more tests were needed to determine how harmful the chemical, glyphosate, might be to people and animals.
Real-Life Examples Speak For Themselves
However, while a politically-guided agency needs more tests—and probably more tests after that—to make a public statement regarding the health effects of the chemical, some people don't need tests to be sure what those effects are.
People like Viviana Peralta in San Jorge, Argentina. Peralta's baby daughter suffers acute asthma attacks every time a crop duster sprays herbicides and pesticides near her house, which sits in an agriculture-rich province 600 kilometers from Buenos Aires.
A Le Monde story tells of Peralta's experiences, saying that she eventually made the connection between her daughter's asthma attacks and the chemical sprayings—a suspicion that a pediatrician would later confirm. Glyphosate was found present in Ailen's blood.
Le Monde reports more about the town of San Jorge:
Quote:
In San Jorge, cancer rates have spiked 30% in the past 10 years. Residents say that following a crop dusting, their lips turn blue and their tongues swell. Chickens die. Dogs and cats shed their hair. Bees disappear and birds become scarce.
And, the story continues, San Jorge is not alone:
Quote:
In the province of Chaco, which borders Paraguay, a study carried out over the past 10 years in a town called La Leonesa suggests that cancer rates have tripled while the incidence of malformations has quadrupled. The situation has created tensions between residents and rice farmers, who use glyphosate and spray from airplanes...
Andres Carrasco, an embryologist from the University of Buenos Aires, published a study in late 2010 demonstrating the toxic effects glyphosate can have on amphibian embryos. His work has earned him no shortage of enemies. He was physically attacked on a visit to La Leonesa and the conference he was scheduled to give there was canceled.
Carrasco is quoted saying he hasn't even made any new discoveries. "I just confirmed what other scientists had already discovered. The scientific evidence is there. Above all, there are the hundreds of [ill and malformed] people who are the living proof of this health emergency."
Apparently, though, that scientific evidence is not enough for the U.S. Geological Survey Office, or any other federal government agency, to show much concern about the effects of glyphosate on public health, despite finding it in every water sample tested.
(To be clear, the EPA is reviewing the chemical, but more than 30 years into its use and with a deadline for a decision still years away, it's not exactly treating it with any urgency.)
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Picklez
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: OoBYCoO]
#589629 - 09/30/11 11:33 PM (12 years, 6 months ago) |
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So, do you not see any benefit in GM crops at all?
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OoBYCoO
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: Picklez]
#589630 - 09/30/11 11:38 PM (12 years, 6 months ago) |
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Not when our land is fertile and in no need of them in the first place, just for the sake of "so-called" improved yields and resistance to pests when we've been doing fine for centuries and the fact that these "so-called" benefits don't even end up being the case.
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Picklez
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: OoBYCoO]
#589631 - 09/30/11 11:39 PM (12 years, 6 months ago) |
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what about lands that are not able to grow traditional crops but are suitable for GM crops? places like 3rd world countries
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DungenessDank
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: Picklez] 1
#589635 - 10/01/11 12:07 AM (12 years, 6 months ago) |
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GM Crops save lives, no doubt. One also has to consider that these crops begin to be grown in other 3rd world countries, sometimes with government subsidies. This makes them very cheap, and while it may feed more people for less money, it will also cause poor farmers to lose everything as they can not compete in the market with GM crops.
Without governments backing Monsanto it probably wouldn't exist, at least in the capacity it does today.
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OoBYCoO
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: OoBYCoO]
#589636 - 10/01/11 12:10 AM (12 years, 6 months ago) |
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Quote:
OoBYCoO said:
That might be so, but I'm more concerned about their actions here in the US. Most foreign governments have BANNED the use of GMO's! India is suffering horrendously b/c of them! They do WAY more harm then good IMO.
THE US DOES NOT NEED THEM!
Edited by OoBYCoO (10/01/11 12:11 AM)
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Picklez
Registered: 04/20/08
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: OoBYCoO]
#589637 - 10/01/11 12:15 AM (12 years, 6 months ago) |
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I will agree that the United States doesnt need them. But they are certainly beneficial in parts of the world where people die from starvation everyday and food supplies are scarce.
Plus it is a fact that food sustainability is a pressing issue as the world's population continues to grow and populations continue to move from urban areas to rural land that was once viable farming land. That applies to the United States as well. It's only a matter of time. Unless the Rapture happens first 
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OoBYCoO
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: Picklez]
#589643 - 10/01/11 01:01 AM (12 years, 6 months ago) |
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I agree w/ you on sustainability, but that's not necessarily a matter that GMO's will solve. That's more a problem of society.
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OoBYCoO
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: OoBYCoO]
#592577 - 10/17/11 05:45 PM (12 years, 6 months ago) |
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OoBYCoO
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: OoBYCoO]
#592686 - 10/18/11 02:14 PM (12 years, 6 months ago) |
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A Silent Forest: On the growing threat of genetically engineered trees - STP EDITION
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King Koopa
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: OoBYCoO]
#592691 - 10/18/11 02:46 PM (12 years, 6 months ago) |
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+profit
--------------------
Alcoholics Anonymous is a fellowship of men and women who share their experience, strength and hope with each other that they may solve their common problem and help others to recover from alcoholism.
The only requirement for membership is a desire to stop drinking. There are no dues or fees for A.A. membership; we are self-supporting through our own contributions. A.A. is not allied with any sect, denomination, politics, organization or institution; does not wish to engage in any controversy; neither endorses nor opposes any causes. Our primary purpose is to stay sober and help other alcoholics to achieve sobriety.
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King Koopa
Natty
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: King Koopa]
#592694 - 10/18/11 03:08 PM (12 years, 6 months ago) |
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--------------------
Alcoholics Anonymous is a fellowship of men and women who share their experience, strength and hope with each other that they may solve their common problem and help others to recover from alcoholism.
The only requirement for membership is a desire to stop drinking. There are no dues or fees for A.A. membership; we are self-supporting through our own contributions. A.A. is not allied with any sect, denomination, politics, organization or institution; does not wish to engage in any controversy; neither endorses nor opposes any causes. Our primary purpose is to stay sober and help other alcoholics to achieve sobriety.
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OoBYCoO
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: King Koopa]
#594937 - 11/01/11 01:42 AM (12 years, 5 months ago) |
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Quote:
King Koopa said:
http://fora.tv/2008/11/17/Drew_Endy_and_Jim_Thomas_Debate_Synthetic_Biology
 "intentions" and "reality" are 2 VERY different things my friend.
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OoBYCoO
Stranger
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: King Koopa]
#594944 - 11/01/11 03:42 AM (12 years, 5 months ago) |
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Edited by OoBYCoO (11/01/11 03:51 AM)
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RedAshes
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Re: The World According To Monsanto *DELETED* [Re: OoBYCoO]
#595036 - 11/01/11 02:49 PM (12 years, 5 months ago) |
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Post deleted by RedAshesReason for deletion: delete
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Darwin23
Darwin
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: RedAshes]
#595130 - 11/01/11 11:09 PM (12 years, 5 months ago) |
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No Monsanto, Yes GMO's.
I don't think GMO's to make money is the best idea. This leads to fucked up stuff like the patenting of life, lawsuits against farmers for collecting their own seeds and a focus on increasing profit instead of solving problems. The entire industry should be one of the government IMO.
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OoBYCoO
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: Darwin23]
#602905 - 12/26/11 01:19 PM (12 years, 3 months ago) |
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OoBYCoO
Stranger
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: OoBYCoO]
#606304 - 01/23/12 03:07 PM (12 years, 3 months ago) |
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The Corporation: Since the late 18th century American legal decision that the business corporation organizational model is legally a person, it has become a dominant economic, political and social force around the globe. This film takes an in-depth psychological examination of the organization model through various case studies. What the study illustrates is that in the its behaviour, this type of "person" typically acts like a dangerously destructive psychopath without conscience. Furthermore, we see the profound threat this psychopath has for our world and our future, but also how the people with courage, intelligence and determination can do to stop it.
http://www.hulu.com/watch/118169/the-corporation
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King Koopa
Natty
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: OoBYCoO]
#606305 - 01/23/12 03:12 PM (12 years, 3 months ago) |
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reminds me of that one pink floyd song.
--------------------
Alcoholics Anonymous is a fellowship of men and women who share their experience, strength and hope with each other that they may solve their common problem and help others to recover from alcoholism.
The only requirement for membership is a desire to stop drinking. There are no dues or fees for A.A. membership; we are self-supporting through our own contributions. A.A. is not allied with any sect, denomination, politics, organization or institution; does not wish to engage in any controversy; neither endorses nor opposes any causes. Our primary purpose is to stay sober and help other alcoholics to achieve sobriety.
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OoBYCoO
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: King Koopa]
#607854 - 02/01/12 06:38 PM (12 years, 2 months ago) |
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kyuzo
Stranger Than Fiction
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Posts: 981
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: OoBYCoO]
#607856 - 02/01/12 06:53 PM (12 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
OoBYCoO said:
lol I'm not mad, well not at you anyway.
There is PLENTY of documentation on what's going on in India regarding Monsanto. Monsanto recently bought out their major seed co's to get rid of the competition and gain market share. The farmers are committing suicide in India b/c they take loans out on their farms to buy Monsanto's expensive seeds for them only to fail. There have been MASSIVE uprisings and protest in India b/c of it. Do some of your own research. I'll try to find some of the stuff I'm referring too for you. Some of it is also in the video I posted.
I guess we can't continue the debate unless you do some research b/c the majority of research shows that they do in fact do "way" more harm then good. Nat Geo has done docu's on it... look at "Sex, Drugs, and Plants."
the issues surrounding the farmer suicides are way more complex than that, encompassing everything from weak govt protection and enforcement, drought (the region has been a dust bowl for over a decade, and the fact that the people making the loans are little more than gangsters (the interest itself makes "paying" them nearly impossible)
Edited by kyuzo (02/01/12 06:53 PM)
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OoBYCoO
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: kyuzo]
#607857 - 02/01/12 07:03 PM (12 years, 2 months ago) |
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ok but can we agree that if their seeds are/were drought and pest resistant, like they proclaim it to be to those farmers as a saving grace, they would have harvestable crops. Only thing is... THEY DON'T! Their seed grown crops aren't doing well at all and are being inundated w/ pests and blight!
So b/c there products don't live up to their claims the farmers are that much more worse off. If it delivered as marketed/promised (at ridiculous prices and stipulations) then the farmers would atleast be able to survive... but as it is they have no chance b/c Monsanto put that final nail in their coffin.
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kyuzo
Stranger Than Fiction
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: OoBYCoO]
#607859 - 02/01/12 07:23 PM (12 years, 2 months ago) |
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the monsoons have been failing for over a decade, so the type of seed isn't really going to change much
http://www.economist.com/node/14259028
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OoBYCoO
Stranger
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: kyuzo]
#607873 - 02/01/12 08:20 PM (12 years, 2 months ago) |
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Did you see the date on that article?
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kyuzo
Stranger Than Fiction
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: OoBYCoO]
#607893 - 02/01/12 09:00 PM (12 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
OoBYCoO said:
Did you see the date on that article?
Like what? As far as i am aware nothing in it would be considered controversial
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OoBYCoO
Stranger
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: kyuzo]
#609024 - 02/11/12 08:17 AM (12 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
kyuzo said:
Quote:
OoBYCoO said:
Did you see the date on that article?
Like what? As far as i am aware nothing in it would be considered controversial
https://foodfreedom.wordpress.com/2011/10/02/india-sues-monsanto-for-biopiracy/
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kyuzo
Stranger Than Fiction
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: OoBYCoO]
#609035 - 02/11/12 10:49 AM (12 years, 2 months ago) |
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ok, and?
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 Nanook
I CANT SEE
Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 244
Loc: The Frozen Tundra
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: kyuzo]
#609078 - 02/11/12 04:25 PM (12 years, 2 months ago) |
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Did anyone mention the actual physiological dangers of GM crops? Animal studies have shown problems with sterility, still-birth, stunted growth, babies dying after a short time, etc...
Quote:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/jeffrey-smith/genetically-modified-soy_b_544575.html
http://www.responsibletechnology.org/
http://www.i-sis.org.uk/GM_Soya_Fed_Rats.php
Pharmaceuticals are supposed to be tested for many years before they are determined to be safe for human consumption. When that process gets pushed aside in the name of profits, we end up with people dying. Because the for-profit corporations producing their medicine can make more money by rushing a deadly product to market (and killing people with inadequately tested drugs, then pulling them from shelves, paying out on a few lawsuits and starting again with a freshly untested drug) than they can by paying and waiting for a safe drug to be approved.
Does anyone else see the parallels between that and what Monsanto is doing?
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the spirit of Nanook
1400W 1st log
3000W 2nd log (current)
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Harry_Ba11sach
cannoisseur
Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 11,753
Loc: Nepal
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: NobodyImportant]
#609082 - 02/11/12 05:09 PM (12 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
NobodyImportant said:
My problem with GMOs besides the fact that I dont agree with modifying nature on a global scale is this, what happens when the pollen from the GM crops blows out into true nature, we could get some weird mutant plants, or we could create plants that cant survive their normal environment or who knows, anything could happen really
ITT; people who don't understand how genetic engineering works, OR how procreation happens.
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kyuzo
Stranger Than Fiction
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: Harry_Ba11sach]
#609086 - 02/11/12 05:58 PM (12 years, 2 months ago) |
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science is gay
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Manitou
Indépendantiste
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: kyuzo]
#609090 - 02/11/12 06:38 PM (12 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
kyuzo said:
science is gay
I think we'll get along quite well man
--------------------
Pour un instant, j'ai respiré très fort
Ça m'a permis de visiter mon corps
Des inconnus vivent en roi chez moi
Moi qui avait accepté leurs lois
J'ai perdu mon temps à gagner du temps
J'ai besoin de me trouver une histoire à me conter
Pour instant j'ai oublié mon nom
Harmonium - Pour un instant
--------------------------------------------
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kyuzo
Stranger Than Fiction
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: Manitou]
#609266 - 02/13/12 09:03 AM (12 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Gaskelort said:
Quote:
kyuzo said:
science is gay
I think we'll get along quite well man
honestly, that was rude of me and I should have said it was "conductive to homosexual behavior"
Edited by kyuzo (02/13/12 09:05 AM)
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Harry_Ba11sach
cannoisseur
Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 11,753
Loc: Nepal
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: Manitou]
#609272 - 02/13/12 09:48 AM (12 years, 2 months ago) |
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Quote:
Gaskelort said:
I think we'll get along quite well man
And I can't wait to ban you.
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OoBYCoO
Stranger
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: Harry_Ba11sach]
#609572 - 02/16/12 12:29 PM (12 years, 2 months ago) |
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You guys should check out http://www.organicconsumers.org/ , it's where I get most of my Monsanto updates!
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Harry_Ba11sach
cannoisseur
Registered: 04/20/08
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: OoBYCoO]
#609578 - 02/16/12 12:56 PM (12 years, 2 months ago) |
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Ya know what's funny? GMO's are still organic.
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Nanook
I CANT SEE
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Loc: The Frozen Tundra
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: Harry_Ba11sach]
#609660 - 02/17/12 10:30 PM (12 years, 2 months ago) |
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...unless they're grown with non-organic nutrients and such.
I guess they can be organic.
But lots of things can be organic, like: oleander (leaves and branches extremely poisonous), nightshade (datura, belladonna, etc, tropane poisoning), rhubarb (stems are tasty, but the leaf blades can cause convulsions, coma and death), cherry (twigs and leaves are fatal, they contain a compound that releases cyanide when eaten, gasping, excitement and prostration are common symptoms), mistletoe (the berries have killed), hemlock (another fatal one) and MANY OTHER NATURAL ORGANIC THINGS CAN KILL YOU.
Unless you could genetically modify all the poisonous things to not be poisonous, then Monsanto could be even way more super extra rich!
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the spirit of Nanook
1400W 1st log
3000W 2nd log (current)
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Harry_Ba11sach
cannoisseur
Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 11,753
Loc: Nepal
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: Nanook]
#609676 - 02/18/12 02:36 AM (12 years, 2 months ago) |
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Umm actually, anything with a carbon atom is organic. So yeah, that's why I think this whole "organic" debate is fucking retarded.
Ya know what else is "organic"? Propane. People are so stupid when it comes to what goes in their body. The label "organic" or "GMO free" has abso-fucking-lutely nothing to do with the nutrition content for that food.
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Nanook
I CANT SEE
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Loc: The Frozen Tundra
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: Harry_Ba11sach]
#609803 - 02/19/12 02:10 AM (12 years, 2 months ago) |
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Umm, the organic debate doesn't really have much to do with the GMO debate...
It's also not about the nutrition, but the side effects of consuming GM foods. Akin to many dangerous pharmaceuticals, GMOs haven't been adequately tested and shown to be safe for human consumption.
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the spirit of Nanook
1400W 1st log
3000W 2nd log (current)
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Mr.Hybrid
Constitutionalist
Registered: 01/08/12
Posts: 977
Loc: Astana, Kazakhstan
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: Nanook]
#609921 - 02/19/12 08:11 PM (12 years, 2 months ago) |
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Monsanto is an arm of the NWO. Their goal (and they're close to obtaining it) is to control all of the world's food supply via controlling the seed. Their bought-and-paid-for Judges (former and post Monsanto employees) have legislated from the bench that Monsanto can patent (own) genetics (life). He who controls the food is above all the supreme power. No army can survive without food, no populace can sustain without food.
Most likely
The Elite have their crops grown in organic green houses. Watered with distilled water and filtered air. Foods not available to the public.
Edited by Mr.Hybrid (02/19/12 08:13 PM)
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Nanook
I CANT SEE
Registered: 04/20/08
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Loc: The Frozen Tundra
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: Mr.Hybrid]
#609950 - 02/20/12 12:39 AM (12 years, 2 months ago) |
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lol, the white house in the US and the royal palace in England both have their own organic gardens.
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the spirit of Nanook
1400W 1st log
3000W 2nd log (current)
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OoBYCoO
Stranger
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: Nanook]
#617174 - 04/09/12 05:21 PM (12 years, 17 days ago) |
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You know it really is no surprise that companies like Monsanto were able to thrive and become what they are today when the whole food industry is fucked...
Hungry for Change: HUNGRY FOR CHANGE exposes shocking secrets the diet, weightloss and food industry don't want you to know about. Deceptive strategies designed to keep you craving more and more. Could the foods we are eating actually be keeping us stuck in the diet trap?
http://www.vidbux.com/zd8wck60sx7r/Hungry_For_Change_xvid.flv.html
Further illustration of why good unadulterated food is crucial... and why it's not a reality...
Food Matters: Let's take small steps towards a healthier life and a healthier you! Food can be your best friend! Discover how you can Detox, Lose Weight, Reverse Diabetes, Conquer Cancer, Beat Heart Disease, Ditch Depression and more using a nutritional approach. It’s not as hard as you think!
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Hawksresurrection
Registered: 12/04/08
Posts: 13,464
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: OoBYCoO]
#617217 - 04/09/12 08:25 PM (12 years, 17 days ago) |
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--------------------
Dude she isn't as young as she use to be.
-niteowl
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OoBYCoO
Stranger
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DeadHearts
Registered: 03/12/10
Posts: 710
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: Nanook]
#617334 - 04/10/12 10:30 AM (12 years, 16 days ago) |
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Quote:
Nanook said:
Umm, the organic debate doesn't really have much to do with the GMO debate...
It's also not about the nutrition, but the side effects of consuming GM foods. Akin to many dangerous pharmaceuticals, GMOs haven't been adequately tested and shown to be safe for human consumption.
I was under the impression that GM crops ruin the soil as well making it very
hard to grow crops the natural way...
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OoBYCoO
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: DeadHearts]
#617346 - 04/10/12 11:28 AM (12 years, 16 days ago) |
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kyuzo
Stranger Than Fiction
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: OoBYCoO]
#617347 - 04/10/12 11:31 AM (12 years, 16 days ago) |
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how would gm crops, as a general rule, ruin soil?
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OoBYCoO
Stranger
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: kyuzo]
#617348 - 04/10/12 11:42 AM (12 years, 16 days ago) |
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That question has been answered many times in the articles and documentaries already posted in this thread.
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DeadHearts
Registered: 03/12/10
Posts: 710
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: OoBYCoO]
#617349 - 04/10/12 11:49 AM (12 years, 16 days ago) |
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If you had the time to write that out you clearly had the time to answer the question.
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OoBYCoO
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: DeadHearts] 1
#617350 - 04/10/12 12:06 PM (12 years, 16 days ago) |
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b/c it's a long complex answer... It's not always a direct cause and effect w/ GM crops and soil...
Basic example... corn normally releases hormones in the soil to attract nematodes (which attack the parasites) when their roots are being attacked by parasites that bore into the roots, lay larvae that eat them and kill the plant. Studies show that the GM corn has lost that ability leading to more use of pesticides/herbicides to be used which in turn ruins the soil b/c of the chemicals involved.
IIRC they go over this here... http://www.growery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/589620#589620
Not to mention what monocultures, which is what these GM crops are, in general do to soil. http://www.helium.com/items/1851230-the-effects-of-corn-monocultures-on-the-soil
Edited by OoBYCoO (04/10/12 12:09 PM)
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DeadHearts
Registered: 03/12/10
Posts: 710
Loc: ▐▐▐▐▐
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: OoBYCoO]
#617352 - 04/10/12 12:13 PM (12 years, 16 days ago) |
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Quote:
OoBYCoO said:
b/c it's a long complex answer... It's not always a direct cause and effect w/ GM crops and soil...
Basic example... corn normally releases hormones in the soil to attract nematodes (which attack the parasites) when their roots are being attacked by parasites that bore into the roots, lay larvae that eat them and kill the plant. Studies show that the GM corn has lost that ability leading to more use of pesticides/herbicides to be used which in turn ruins the soil b/c of the chemicals involved.
IIRC they go over this here... http://www.growery.org/forums/showflat.php/Number/589620#589620
Not to mention what monocultures, which is what these GM crops are, in general do to soil. http://www.helium.com/items/1851230-the-effects-of-corn-monocultures-on-the-soil
Right on man. Its just a pet peeve of mine I guess. But yes the harm vastly
outweighs the good with this bullshit. Funny how some say "oh it helps 3rd
world countries"
What else should one consider in that respect as far as why they are there
in the first place?
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kyuzo
Stranger Than Fiction
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: OoBYCoO]
#617354 - 04/10/12 12:21 PM (12 years, 16 days ago) |
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Quote:
OoBYCoO said:
That question has been answered many times in the articles and documentaries already posted in this thread.
well, I clearly have missed it. So why not offer a short and concise explanation here?
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DeadHearts
Registered: 03/12/10
Posts: 710
Loc: ▐▐▐▐▐
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: kyuzo]
#617357 - 04/10/12 12:30 PM (12 years, 16 days ago) |
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Quote:
kyuzo said:
Quote:
OoBYCoO said:
That question has been answered many times in the articles and documentaries already posted in this thread.
well, I clearly have missed it. So why not offer a short and concise explanation here?
He gave you an example above. Why dont do some of your own research. That is
of course if you care at all about the harms of such crops.
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DeadHearts
Registered: 03/12/10
Posts: 710
Loc: ▐▐▐▐▐
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: DeadHearts]
#617359 - 04/10/12 12:48 PM (12 years, 16 days ago) |
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The fact that they have put patents on seeds is outrageous and not only that
but ferociously defending their patents and suing local organic farmers. They
are being allowed to completely dominate the market while providing a product
that is dangerous in many ways.
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kyuzo
Stranger Than Fiction
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Posts: 981
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: OoBYCoO]
#617360 - 04/10/12 12:49 PM (12 years, 16 days ago) |
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Quote:
OoBYCoO said:
Not to mention what monocultures, which is what these GM crops are, in general do to soil. http://www.helium.com/items/1851230-the-effects-of-corn-monocultures-on-the-soil
an issue with monoculture would be an issue with monculture, Not GM crops
Quote:
OoBYCoO said:Basic example... corn normally releases hormones in the soil to attract nematodes (which attack the parasites) when their roots are being attacked by parasites that bore into the roots, lay larvae that eat them and kill the plant. Studies show that the GM corn has lost that ability leading to more use of pesticides/herbicides to be used which in turn ruins the soil b/c of the chemicals involved.
IIRC they go over this here
actually briefly researching the topic, it seems the issue is added genetic material meant to resist boring pests (bt), and that some suspected these effects would extend to related taxa that were beneficial to development ( there was mention of lab research that supported this, but I could not track down the studies)
though a brief search on google scholer seem to undermine this ( at least from my reading)
http://www.springerlink.com/content/f2190368xnvn04k4/
http://www.annualreviews.org/doi/abs/10.1146/annurev.ento.50.071803.130352
http://www.bioone.org/doi/abs/10.1603/0046-225X-32.4.859
But this is all moot, because regardless if the bt corn did have a negative effect, or not, the issue rises from a specifically spliced gene, intended to specifically control soil born pests (possibly extending it's negative effects onto related animals that are, in fact, beneficial), not a general issue with the gm process itself, as was originally asserted
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kyuzo
Stranger Than Fiction
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: DeadHearts]
#617361 - 04/10/12 12:52 PM (12 years, 16 days ago) |
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Quote:
DeadHearts said:
Quote:
kyuzo said:
Quote:
OoBYCoO said:
That question has been answered many times in the articles and documentaries already posted in this thread.
well, I clearly have missed it. So why not offer a short and concise explanation here?
He gave you an example above. Why dont do some of your own research. That is
of course if you care at all about the harms of such crops.
Yes, after his original remarks, which you even took issue with
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DeadHearts
Registered: 03/12/10
Posts: 710
Loc: ▐▐▐▐▐
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: kyuzo]
#617370 - 04/10/12 01:24 PM (12 years, 16 days ago) |
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Its troublesome that it seems there is so called evidence on both sides either
for or against GM foods in a wide verity of aspects. But none the less here
is some information that suggests GM foods in relation to soil is not so good.
"Research has demonstrated the great importance of soil organisms for the fertility of the soil. In one gram of productive soil there is a complex web that can exceed over 100 million microorganisms that may represent over 1000 species. The main components are bacteria, fungi, algae, protozoa, nematodes, earthworms, and insects. Out of these, bacteria and fungi constitute about 80%, the proportions of these two depending on soil type. There is a complex ecological interdependence between all soil organisms. Together they are responsible for the cycle of decomposing and restructuring organic material so that it will be accessible to growing plants. It is also responsible for the nitrogen and water-retaining properties as well as for other factors of great importance for soil fertility."
Potential effects of Genetically Engineered (GE) crops on soil microbes
In genetic engineering, a package of novel genes are inserted into the recipient organism. In addition to the desired property gene, a number of other genes have to be added to ensure successful insertion.
Among the potentially problematic genes inserted into plants, those that help overcome the barriers against the introduction of foreign genes are of particular interest in the context of soil ecology. They function as vectors for successful insertion and prevent rejection of inserted foreign genes. These vector packages are chimaeric combinations of genetic elements commonly from pathogenic bacteria and viruses and from transposons.
Ho, M.W. & Tappeser, B. (1997) have proposed that the vector DNA in GE crops may promote horizontal transfer of genetic material between unrelated bacterial species. They warned that the result may be new human pathogenic bacteria.
This idea was further developed by Ho, M.W. et al. (1998). They refer to experimental observations indicating the possibility of gene transfer not only between related bacteria but also between bacteria of different species, as well as between bacteria and fungi and between bacteria and higher organisms, including mammals. They warn that the vector DNA may be transferred from GE plants to soil bacteria and soil fungi and contribute to increased horizontal transfer. They suggest that this may have contributed to the emergence of new human pathogenic bacteria during the last 10-15 years, some of which have been very harmful.
Hypothesis
Horizontal transfer of genes between soil micro-organisms may be facilitated by vector DNA from genetically engineered plants, resulting in such changes or disturbances in the functioning of the micro-organisms that soil ecology and fertility may be affected.
http://www.psrast.org/soilecolart.htm
Robert Kremer, a microbiologist with the U.S. Department of Agriculture's Agricultural Research Service, co-authored one of the five papers and offered insight into their premise during an interview with The Organic & Non-GMO Report, a monthly newsletter that offers recourse in addressing the challenges of fighting GM foods.
Despite claims to the contrary, Roundup can deeply penetrate soil and threaten groundwater supplies with contamination. Depending on a particular soil's composition, glyphosate can leech rather quickly into soil and potentially run off into nearby streams and rivers.
The Roundup system has also caused a significant increase in aggressive "super" weeds that are resistant to glyphosate. These weeds have been popping up in fields all over the country where GM Roundup Ready crops are grown, growing increasingly more virulent every year. Genetic engineers continue to develop stronger herbicides to combat them but the weeds keep getting stronger and more resistant.
Genetic modification of food crops is not only unsustainable but it threatens to unhinge the entire agricultural system. Roundup and other herbicides are altering and destroying soil nutrients, beneficial microbes, and other delicate components necessary to grow food.
While many farmers are interested in moving away from using GM crops in favor of more organic methods, it is often difficult for many of them to make the conversion.
Learn more: http://www.naturalnews.com/028347_GM_crops_Roundup.html#ixzz1rfQJ5OGN
Edited by DeadHearts (04/10/12 01:38 PM)
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kyuzo
Stranger Than Fiction
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: DeadHearts]
#617380 - 04/10/12 02:45 PM (12 years, 16 days ago) |
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you really should try to rely on peer-reviewed articles when discussing this topic, since there is such an ideological undercurrent to how people view it
take for example the the conclusion of the article that "Genetic modification of food crops is not only unsustainable but it threatens to unhinge the entire agricultural system. Roundup and other herbicides are altering and destroying soil nutrients, beneficial microbes, and other delicate components necessary to grow food."
when the research actually indicates that "We previously reported that fungal colonization of GR soybean roots increased significantly after application of glyphosate but not after conventional postemergence herbicides. Because glyphosate may be released into soil from GR roots, we characterized the response of rhizosphere fungi and bacteria to root exudates from GR and non-GR (Williams 82; W82) cultivars treated with and without glyphosate at field application rates. Using an immunoassay technique, glyphosate at concentrations >1000 ng plant-1 were detected in exudates of hydroponically grown GR soybean at 16 days post-glyphosate application. Glyphosate also increased carbohydrate and amino acid contents in root exudates in both soybean cultivars. However, GR soybean released higher carbohydrate and amino acid contents in root exudates than W82 soybean without glyphosate treatment. In vitro bioassays showed that glyphosate in the exudates stimulated growth of selected rhizosphere fungi, possibly by providing a selective C and N source combined with the high levels of soluble carbohydrates and amino acids associated with glyphosate treatment of the soybean plants. Increased fungal populations that develop under glyphosate treatment of GR soybean may adversely affect plant growth and biological processes in the soil and rhizosphere."
http://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/03067310500273146
An issue that specifically deals with the use of round-up, and how round-up resistant plants deal with the compound
Again, this speaks to a specific issue, with a specific modification, not the technique in general. Also, I'm not sure you would find many, if any, scientists who would claim gm is safe in all instances. Which is the point you seem to keep trying to argue (basically you are making a straw man).
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DeadHearts
Registered: 03/12/10
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: kyuzo]
#617395 - 04/10/12 03:43 PM (12 years, 16 days ago) |
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Im arguing that GM food crops are in general not good for the soils. You are
focusing on but one persons findings and one aspect of the effects of GM out of
hundreds.
From what I have researched over time it is no coincidence that most people
have many problems with Monsanto and GM foods and crops and rightfully so.
What exactly is your point? What are you trying to argue?
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DeadHearts
Registered: 03/12/10
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: DeadHearts]
#617396 - 04/10/12 03:51 PM (12 years, 16 days ago) |
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From the same "Pier reviewed" site you got the information from above that seems
to contradict the findings of Robert Kremera, Nathan Meansb & Sujung Kimc from said
article.
"Species, varieties and area of Bt (Bacillus thuringiensis) transgenic crops have increased rapidly worldwide in the past 11 years (1996–2006) for economic, environmental and health benefits. However, the ecological risks of Bt transgenic crops were critically highlighted for potential adverse effects on agroecosystems, in particular, non-target effects on soil microorganisms. Arbuscular mycorrhizal fungi (AMF) are important soil microorganisms providing a range of benefits to the majority of crop plants in the agroecosystem, worthy of monitoring for non-target effects of Bt transgenic crops. Bt transgenic crops may affect AMF in many ways during their life with regard to the temporal-spatial relevance between the occurrence of Bt proteins and fungal symbiotic development of AMF. This may lead to an unwelcome surprise with regard to specific abundance and diversity of AMF when Bt transgenic crops are planted continuously. It is concluded that interactions between AMF and Bt transgenic crops at individual and community level are a new urgent soil ecological issue. Some evidence about Bt transgenic crop effects on AMF revealed by recent articles are summarized, and research prospects are highlighted in the paper."
http://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/09064710701478339
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DeadHearts
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: DeadHearts]
#617397 - 04/10/12 03:56 PM (12 years, 16 days ago) |
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This can go on and on and on.
My stance on the matter is that corporations like Monsanto are not needed and cause
way more harm than good in many ways. I wonder why Europe has almost completely rid
itself of said GM crops...
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kyuzo
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: DeadHearts]
#617398 - 04/10/12 03:58 PM (12 years, 16 days ago) |
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Quote:
DeadHearts said:
Im arguing that GM food crops are in general not good for the soils. You are
focusing on but one persons findings and one aspect of the effects of GM out of
hundreds.
No, I'm pointing out the evidence you guys keep citing speaks to specific incidents, and not gms in general (both examples were brought up by people trying to characterize GMs as generally dangerous, not me). And then pointing out this is no way supports the previous claim
Quote:
DeadHearts said:From what I have researched over time it is no coincidence that most people
have many problems with Monsanto and GM foods and crops and rightfully so.
I'm not a particular fan of Monsanto's businesses practices myself, but recognize that how they run their business has no bearing on the techniques, and ideas, behind gm crops.
PS coincidentally, a bunch of people liking, or not liking, something doesn't really speak to the validity of that belief (slavery wasn't morally right simply because a bunch of people agreed with it)
Quote:
DeadHearts said:What exactly is your point? What are you trying to argue?
that the attempts to cite specific issues, with specific gene splices, does not prove that the practice, in general, is harmful to the soil
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kyuzo
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: DeadHearts]
#617399 - 04/10/12 04:04 PM (12 years, 16 days ago) |
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Quote:
DeadHearts said:
From the same "Pier reviewed" site you got the information from above that seems
to contradict the findings of Robert Kremera, Nathan Meansb & Sujung Kimc from said
article.
"Species, varieties and area of Bt (Bacillus thuringiensis) transgenic crops have increased rapidly worldwide in the past 11 years (1996–2006) for economic, environmental and health benefits. However, the ecological risks of Bt transgenic crops were critically highlighted for potential adverse effects on agroecosystems, in particular, non-target effects on soil microorganisms. Arbuscular mycorrhizal fungi (AMF) are important soil microorganisms providing a range of benefits to the majority of crop plants in the agroecosystem, worthy of monitoring for non-target effects of Bt transgenic crops. Bt transgenic crops may affect AMF in many ways during their life with regard to the temporal-spatial relevance between the occurrence of Bt proteins and fungal symbiotic development of AMF. This may lead to an unwelcome surprise with regard to specific abundance and diversity of AMF when Bt transgenic crops are planted continuously. It is concluded that interactions between AMF and Bt transgenic crops at individual and community level are a new urgent soil ecological issue. Some evidence about Bt transgenic crop effects on AMF revealed by recent articles are summarized, and research prospects are highlighted in the paper."
http://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/09064710701478339
You do realize that scientific research often comes to contradictory conclusions? Hence why I wrote "( there was mention of lab research that supported this, but I could not track down the studies)" even indicating I came across mention of contradictory research. So really have no idea what issue you are trying to raise here
But thanks for using peer-reviewed sources
PS not to mention we would still be dealing with a specific splice, concerning a specific gene, as opposed to the practice itself
Edited by kyuzo (04/10/12 04:05 PM)
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kyuzo
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: DeadHearts]
#617400 - 04/10/12 04:07 PM (12 years, 16 days ago) |
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Quote:
DeadHearts said:
This can go on and on and on.
My stance on the matter is that corporations like Monsanto are not needed and cause
way more harm than good in many ways. I wonder why Europe has almost completely rid
itself of said GM crops...
Europe also has some rather Draconian laws that drastically undermine free speech. But merely citing something being done in Europe doesn't actually articulate it's merits, if it has any
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DeadHearts
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: kyuzo]
#617401 - 04/10/12 04:09 PM (12 years, 16 days ago) |
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Again from what I have read over the years it seems there is more findings that
suggest more harm than any good in regards to soil. You cant pick and choose one fact here and there and act like nothing is going on.
I also do not agree with you on your point in which "but recognize that how they run their business has no bearing on the techniques, and ideas, behind gm crops."
Now I cannot prove this but I believe they started to GM seeds as a way to enforce
their patents on local growers as another way to undercut their business. Thats said, its a whole new thread.
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OoBYCoO
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: kyuzo]
#617402 - 04/10/12 04:11 PM (12 years, 16 days ago) |
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And how many specific incidences/issues need to be cited before it proves that the practice, in general, is harmful to the soil?
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DeadHearts
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: DeadHearts]
#617403 - 04/10/12 04:12 PM (12 years, 16 days ago) |
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Again the overall message here is that Monsanto and GM food and crops are not
needed and cause much more harm than good IE individual health of eating said food
and the effects on the soil caused by GM crops and pesticides.
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kyuzo
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: OoBYCoO]
#617404 - 04/10/12 04:14 PM (12 years, 16 days ago) |
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Quote:
OoBYCoO said:
And how many specific incidences/issues need to be cited before it proves that the practice, in general, is harmful to the soil?
when the practice actually has something to do with the specific practice, as opposed to the splicing of specific genes, for specific effects
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kyuzo
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: DeadHearts]
#617405 - 04/10/12 04:16 PM (12 years, 16 days ago) |
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Quote:
DeadHearts said:
Again from what I have read over the years it seems there is more findings that
suggest more harm than any good in regards to soil. You cant pick and choose one fact here and there and act like nothing is going on.
I'm not. I'm pointing out your evidence doesn't support your conclusion
Quote:
DeadHearts said:I also do not agree with you on your point in which "but recognize that how they run their business has no bearing on the techniques, and ideas, behind gm crops."
ok, why?
Quote:
DeadHearts said:Now I cannot prove this but I believe they started to GM seeds as a way to enforce
their patents on local growers as another way to undercut their business. Thats said, its a whole new thread.
that would speak to a business practice, not the gm process
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OoBYCoO
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: kyuzo]
#617406 - 04/10/12 04:18 PM (12 years, 16 days ago) |
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Quote:
kyuzo said:
Quote:
OoBYCoO said:
And how many specific incidences/issues need to be cited before it proves that the practice, in general, is harmful to the soil?
when the practice actually has something to do with the specific practice, as opposed to the splicing of specific genes, for specific effects
lol And what is the difference?
That IS the practice!
Edited by OoBYCoO (04/10/12 04:19 PM)
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DeadHearts
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: kyuzo]
#617407 - 04/10/12 04:19 PM (12 years, 16 days ago) |
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Talk about straw man
As dude said above how many negative findings have to be cited until you get the point?
Do you want mainstream media to come out and say they have proof that GM food and
crops have negative effects on people and land? Because thats not going to happen.
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Mr.Hybrid
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: DeadHearts]
#617409 - 04/10/12 04:25 PM (12 years, 16 days ago) |
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Dead hearts and kyuzo
Seem to post in these NWO posts
AN EVERY TIME
They seem to TRY an make others feel ignorant for posting
Everything the elite do
Is very well thought out,
Even if it was proven that monsanto is harming us with their food
Do you really think we would ever hear about it, say via media ?
I highly doubt it
These Heads of the Country / World , if you will
OWN THAT SH!T
&
P.S
Just because you cant prove something doesnt mean it does not exist
I can spot you fuckers out man............
Nice pic btw
--------------------
I am the person that stands in front of you in line ,
The person that you walk by and don't notice
I am the person who cares about you and your rights
I AM ANONYMOUS
Edited by Mr.Hybrid (04/10/12 04:31 PM)
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Mr.Hybrid
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: Mr.Hybrid]
#617410 - 04/10/12 04:27 PM (12 years, 16 days ago) |
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If a tree falls in the woods when no1 is around
Does it make a sound?
Of course it does
Hurpa durpa
--------------------
I am the person that stands in front of you in line ,
The person that you walk by and don't notice
I am the person who cares about you and your rights
I AM ANONYMOUS
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DeadHearts
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: Mr.Hybrid]
#617413 - 04/10/12 04:29 PM (12 years, 16 days ago) |
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I only try to post information that makes people think about things in a different
light, IE not just what the see on TV. Its all bullshit. Now if someone come at me and tells
me Im wrong without providing any sort of proof of such I will treat them accordingly.
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kyuzo
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: OoBYCoO]
#617416 - 04/10/12 04:34 PM (12 years, 16 days ago) |
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Quote:
OoBYCoO said:
Quote:
kyuzo said:
Quote:
OoBYCoO said:
And how many specific incidences/issues need to be cited before it proves that the practice, in general, is harmful to the soil?
when the practice actually has something to do with the specific practice, as opposed to the splicing of specific genes, for specific effects
lol And what is the difference?
That IS the practice!
because an issue with a specific gene splice, solely based on the effects of that splice, doesn't speak to every other possible gene splice and their completely different effects.
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Mr.Hybrid
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: DeadHearts]
#617418 - 04/10/12 04:36 PM (12 years, 16 days ago) |
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Quote:
DeadHearts said:
I only try to post information that makes people think about things in a different
light, IE not just what the see on TV. Its all bullshit. Now if someone come at me and tells
me Im wrong without providing any sort of proof of such I will treat them accordingly.
And I saw in my other post
"That you didnt care about the "Jewish" thing
No wonder
You belong to a JEWISH brotherhood
Correct?
Tell me you're not a mason
( Your symbolism flows through your avatar )
LOL
You're probably a 3rd degree or some shit
( I ALSO NOTICED HOW YOU USED THE WORD LIGHT, IN YOUR LAST COMMENT )
--------------------
I am the person that stands in front of you in line ,
The person that you walk by and don't notice
I am the person who cares about you and your rights
I AM ANONYMOUS
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DeadHearts
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: Mr.Hybrid]
#617421 - 04/10/12 04:38 PM (12 years, 16 days ago) |
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Quote:
Mr.Hybrid said:
And I saw in my other post
"That you didnt care about the "Jewish" thing
No wonder
You belong to a JEWISH brotherhood
Correct?
Tell me you're not a mason
( Your symbolism flows through your avatar )
LOL
You're probably a 3rd degree or some shit
( I ALSO NOTICED HOW YOU USED THE WORD LIGHT, IN YOUR LAST COMMENT )
Naw man Im just trying not to be one of these crazy ass antisemitic folks that
seems to be just as nuts as good ol Israel. I cannot stand Israel. The US hangs
off their nuts and vice verse and it is indeed sickening.
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kyuzo
Stranger Than Fiction
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: DeadHearts]
#617423 - 04/10/12 04:39 PM (12 years, 16 days ago) |
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Quote:
DeadHearts said:
Talk about straw man
Please quote the relvent text and explain to me how it's a straw man. Because I can't recall anything I wrote that could be considered such
Quote:
DeadHearts said:As dude said above how many negative findings have to be cited until you get the point?
Your evidence doesn't actually support your argument. So I am unsure what I am not getting
Quote:
DeadHearts said:Do you want mainstream media to come out and say they have proof that GM food and
crops have negative effects on people and land? Because thats not going to happen.
the only people that have been citing popular media here is you and OoBYCoO. I've been citing peer-reviewed papers
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Mr.Hybrid
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: DeadHearts]
#617424 - 04/10/12 04:41 PM (12 years, 16 days ago) |
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Quote:
DeadHearts said:
Quote:
Mr.Hybrid said:
And I saw in my other post
"That you didnt care about the "Jewish" thing
No wonder
You belong to a JEWISH brotherhood
Correct?
Tell me you're not a mason
( Your symbolism flows through your avatar )
LOL
You're probably a 3rd degree or some shit
( I ALSO NOTICED HOW YOU USED THE WORD LIGHT, IN YOUR LAST COMMENT )
Naw man Im just trying not to be one of these crazy ass antisemitic folks that
seems to be just as nuts as good ol Israel. I cannot stand Israel. The US hangs
off their nuts and vice verse and it is indeed sickening.
Thank you for admitting that
You never did answer my question though ....
Are you a mason ?
--------------------
I am the person that stands in front of you in line ,
The person that you walk by and don't notice
I am the person who cares about you and your rights
I AM ANONYMOUS
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Mr.Hybrid
Constitutionalist
Registered: 01/08/12
Posts: 977
Loc: Astana, Kazakhstan
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: Mr.Hybrid]
#617425 - 04/10/12 04:43 PM (12 years, 16 days ago) |
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And your Dead Hearts
Charles (presumably after Charlemagne)
Twelve years they served Chedorlaomer, and the thirteenth year they REBELLED.....Hmmmm...nvm
--------------------
I am the person that stands in front of you in line ,
The person that you walk by and don't notice
I am the person who cares about you and your rights
I AM ANONYMOUS
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DeadHearts
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: kyuzo]
#617427 - 04/10/12 04:44 PM (12 years, 16 days ago) |
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Quote:
kyuzo said:
Quote:
DeadHearts said:
Talk about straw man
Please quote the relvent text and explain to me how it's a straw man. Because I can't recall anything I wrote that could be considered such
Quote:
DeadHearts said:As dude said above how many negative findings have to be cited until you get the point?
Your evidence doesn't actually support your argument. So I am unsure what I am not getting
Quote:
DeadHearts said:Do you want mainstream media to come out and say they have proof that GM food and
crops have negative effects on people and land? Because thats not going to happen.
the only people that have been citing popular media here is you and OoBYCoO. I've been citing peer-reviewed papers
Listen agree to disagree. This is a merry go round of facepalm.
I cite articles and information that suggests GM crops and pesticides have harmful
effects even from sites you have gotten info from and you throw them out the window.
You even agreed that some of the findings that suggest that are not harmful
contradict themselves at times.
Carry on if you will but again I will agree to disagree here.
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kyuzo
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: Mr.Hybrid]
#617430 - 04/10/12 04:46 PM (12 years, 16 days ago) |
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Quote:
Mr.Hybrid said:
Dead hearts and kyuzo
Seem to post in these NWO posts
AN EVERY TIME
They seem to TRY an make others feel ignorant for posting
Everything the elite do
Is very well thought out,
Even if it was proven that monsanto is harming us with their food
Do you really think we would ever hear about it, say via media ?
I highly doubt it
These Heads of the Country / World , if you will
OWN THAT SH!T
&
P.S
Just because you cant prove something doesnt mean it does not exist
I can spot you fuckers out man............
Nice pic btw
I feast on the blood of unicorns and quench my thirst on the tears of angels
http://www.ibiblio.org/pub/electronic-publications/subgenius/bobapps/eyemovebob/eyemoveBob3.GIF
Edited by kyuzo (04/10/12 04:47 PM)
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DeadHearts
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: Mr.Hybrid]
#617431 - 04/10/12 04:47 PM (12 years, 16 days ago) |
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Naw no mason here. I really dont even know how to feel about them.
Im more concerned with groups like skulls and bones and such. The masons are warshed up bruuu
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kyuzo
Stranger Than Fiction
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: DeadHearts]
#617432 - 04/10/12 04:50 PM (12 years, 16 days ago) |
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Quote:
DeadHearts said:
I cite articles and information that suggests GM crops and pesticides have harmful
effects even from sites you have gotten info from and you throw them out the window.
I'm not sure how directly addressing them, and pointing out they don't say what you think they say, is "throwing them out the window"
Quote:
DeadHearts said:You even agreed that some of the findings that suggest that are not harmful
contradict themselves at times.
no, I agreed that scientific research, in general, is often contradictory
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OoBYCoO
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: DeadHearts] 1
#617434 - 04/10/12 05:03 PM (12 years, 16 days ago) |
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Quote:
kyuzo said:
Quote:
OoBYCoO said:
Quote:
kyuzo said:
Quote:
OoBYCoO said:
And how many specific incidences/issues need to be cited before it proves that the practice, in general, is harmful to the soil?
when the practice actually has something to do with the specific practice, as opposed to the splicing of specific genes, for specific effects
lol And what is the difference?
That IS the practice!
because an issue with a specific gene splice, solely based on the effects of that splice, doesn't speak to every other possible gene splice and their completely different effects.
Ok now I know you're making arguments for the sake of arguing...
Quote:
kyuzo said:
the only people that have been citing popular media here is you and OoBYCoO. I've been citing peer-reviewed papers
Yeah, that's all I've posted in this entire thread. Yup you got me.
Quote:
DeadHearts said:This is a merry go round of facepalm.
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OoBYCoO
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: OoBYCoO]
#620481 - 04/27/12 03:30 PM (11 years, 11 months ago) |
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Edited by OoBYCoO (04/27/12 06:07 PM)
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OoBYCoO
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: OoBYCoO]
#629116 - 06/23/12 04:09 PM (11 years, 9 months ago) |
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kyuzo
Stranger Than Fiction
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: OoBYCoO]
#629160 - 06/24/12 01:41 AM (11 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
OoBYCoO said:Ok now I know you're making arguments for the sake of arguing...
the negative effect he cited was dependent on one gene, not the process of splicing that gene. Hence, to attribute it's effects to all gene splices, that could have an endless number of effects, unlike the one he cited, is fallacious.
Pretty simple
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OoBYCoO
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: kyuzo]
#629185 - 06/24/12 01:57 PM (11 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
kyuzo said:
Quote:
OoBYCoO said:Ok now I know you're making arguments for the sake of arguing...
the negative effect he cited was dependent on one gene, not the process of splicing that gene. Hence, to attribute it's effects to all gene splices, that could have an endless number of effects, unlike the one he cited, is fallacious.
Pretty simple
That still encompasses GENETIC MODIFICATION does it not?
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Harry_Ba11sach
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: OoBYCoO]
#629192 - 06/24/12 03:07 PM (11 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
OoBYCoO said:
Quote:
kyuzo said:
the only people that have been citing popular media here is you and OoBYCoO. I've been citing peer-reviewed papers
Yeah, that's all I've posted in this entire thread. Yup you got me.
Quote:
OoBYCoO said:
http://www.alternet.org/food/154951/millions_against_monsanto:_the_food_fight_of_our_lives/
http://www.digitaljournal.com/article/322545
http://www.organicconsumers.org/articles/article_25209.cfm
http://www.naturalnews.com/035688_Monsanto_honey_bees_colony_collapse.html
NONE of those are peer reviewed journals. They are ALL popular media. You literally proved his point with your very next post.
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OoBYCoO
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: Harry_Ba11sach]
#629193 - 06/24/12 03:15 PM (11 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
Yeah, that's all I've posted in this entire thread. Yup you got me.
...and the rest of the thread?
Edited by OoBYCoO (06/24/12 03:17 PM)
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Harry_Ba11sach
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: OoBYCoO]
#629194 - 06/24/12 03:16 PM (11 years, 9 months ago) |
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Don't feel like running back through this entire shit-fest to find out what the rest of your posts entail, but don't you think that was a bit of a ridiculous response right there? He accuses you of pop-media pandering and you immediately respond with more pop-media.
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King Koopa
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: Harry_Ba11sach]
#629196 - 06/24/12 03:28 PM (11 years, 9 months ago) |
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I've actually tried to trace the news articles sources only to find out their only sources are other news articles. 
Antways, Monsanto=/=GMO. I still find it surprising people who lack critical thinking skills are HIGHLY opinionated more so than those who do. Also, I don't think anyone in this thread has a grasp on not even a generalized idea of the science of GMO's.
--------------------
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OoBYCoO
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: Harry_Ba11sach]
#629197 - 06/24/12 03:30 PM (11 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
Harry_Ba11sach said:
Don't feel like running back through this entire shit-fest to find out what the rest of your posts entail, but don't you think that was a bit of a ridiculous response right there? He accuses you of pop-media pandering and you immediately respond with more pop-media.
Why? Those articles pertain mostly to actions taken by Monsanto or movements against Monsanto or the movements themselves... they're not scientific journals.
...I didn't know you need peer review for matters of public record.
Edited by OoBYCoO (06/24/12 03:32 PM)
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Harry_Ba11sach
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: King Koopa]
#629198 - 06/24/12 03:35 PM (11 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
King Koopa said:
I've actually tried to trace the news articles sources only to find out their only sources are other news articles.
Antways, Monsanto=/=GMO. I still find it surprising people who lack critical thinking skills are HIGHLY opinionated more so than those who do. Also, I don't think anyone in this thread has a grasp on not even a generalized idea of the science of GMO's.
I agree, which is why pop news is such BS. also
And you're right about the opinion thing. Usually the people yelling the loudest are the least educated, and THAT is why they're scared.
In college I took a 6000 level bio class actually titled "Genetically Engineering Organisms." I am WAY far from an expert still, but I feel that I can speak with at least a relatively informed opinion on the subject. GMO's really aren't anything to be scared of. Sure, there's a potential for some sketchy shit to go down with them, but name me one thing we deal with on a daily basis that doesn't have that potential. I can probably find 100 different children's cereals that will kill you in 5 years if you eat enough of it.
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OoBYCoO
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: Harry_Ba11sach]
#629200 - 06/24/12 03:41 PM (11 years, 9 months ago) |
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Hmmmm if I recall I to went to an accredited university w/ a Bio major on academic scholarship...
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King Koopa
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: OoBYCoO]
#629201 - 06/24/12 03:51 PM (11 years, 9 months ago) |
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Then excuse me. I really couldn't tell with all the videos and news articles you were posting. Someone asked for your opinion earlier in the thread and told a the guy to do his own research. So, you're just trying to get people to think about this GMO controversy?
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The only requirement for membership is a desire to stop drinking. There are no dues or fees for A.A. membership; we are self-supporting through our own contributions. A.A. is not allied with any sect, denomination, politics, organization or institution; does not wish to engage in any controversy; neither endorses nor opposes any causes. Our primary purpose is to stay sober and help other alcoholics to achieve sobriety.
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OoBYCoO
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: King Koopa]
#629203 - 06/24/12 04:05 PM (11 years, 9 months ago) |
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Oh I'm sorry.. I didn't end up answering him right after that? If one does their own research they come to their OWN CONCLUSIONS! Yes, it would be nice if people thought about it.
http://www.biolsci.org/v05p0706.htm#headingA11
http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?context=va&aid=21251 ; (link to study at bottom)
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/jat.2712/abstract
Edited by OoBYCoO (06/24/12 04:09 PM)
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King Koopa
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: OoBYCoO]
#629204 - 06/24/12 04:11 PM (11 years, 9 months ago) |
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Don't be sorry! I just think our motivations should be as easily identifiable as communicating our ideas or opinions, clearly. Not only does it make for a more effective conversation, it's the prerequisite for a great learning experience.
Irrelevant: I know you have a music thread over at the Shroomery, why don't you have one here?
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Alcoholics Anonymous is a fellowship of men and women who share their experience, strength and hope with each other that they may solve their common problem and help others to recover from alcoholism.
The only requirement for membership is a desire to stop drinking. There are no dues or fees for A.A. membership; we are self-supporting through our own contributions. A.A. is not allied with any sect, denomination, politics, organization or institution; does not wish to engage in any controversy; neither endorses nor opposes any causes. Our primary purpose is to stay sober and help other alcoholics to achieve sobriety.
Edited by King Koopa (06/24/12 04:32 PM)
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OoBYCoO
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: King Koopa]
#629206 - 06/24/12 04:21 PM (11 years, 9 months ago) |
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 lol I dunno... different vibe I guess.
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kyuzo
Stranger Than Fiction
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: OoBYCoO] 1
#629215 - 06/24/12 05:10 PM (11 years, 9 months ago) |
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Quote:
OoBYCoO said:
Quote:
kyuzo said:
Quote:
OoBYCoO said:Ok now I know you're making arguments for the sake of arguing...
the negative effect he cited was dependent on one gene, not the process of splicing that gene. Hence, to attribute it's effects to all gene splices, that could have an endless number of effects, unlike the one he cited, is fallacious.
Pretty simple
That still encompasses GENETIC MODIFICATION does it not?
this is like citing a guy trying to hammer a board together with a glass nail as proof hammering things together doesn't work: the negative effect arised directly from the traits of the introduced genetic material (the nail), not the practice itself (hammering).
Edited by kyuzo (06/24/12 05:25 PM)
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OoBYCoO
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Re: The World According To Monsanto [Re: kyuzo]
#632006 - 07/18/12 12:38 PM (11 years, 9 months ago) |
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Stand-off looms over U.S. plans to cut GMO crop oversight
by Charles Abbott and Carey Gillam
(Reuters) - Efforts to write benefits for biotech seed companies into U.S. legislation, including the new Farm Bill, are sparking a backlash from groups that say the multiple measures would severely limit U.S. oversight of genetically modified crops.
From online petitions to face-to-face lobbying on Capitol Hill, an array of consumer and environmental organizations and individuals are ringing alarm bells over moves they say will eradicate badly needed safety checks on crops genetically modified to withstand herbicides, pests and pesticides.
Article continues here: http://in.reuters.com/article/2012/07/17/us-usa-agriculture-biotech-idINBRE86G0XF20120717
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