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OfflineThebooedocksaint
Dead Dictator
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Registered: 05/11/09
Posts: 5,723
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Last seen: 17 days, 16 hours
BAM HEALTHCARE
    #388003 - 03/21/10 08:56 PM (14 years, 11 days ago)

LMAO LISTENING TO REPUBLICANS BITCH AND MOAN AS WE SPEAK!

But really, freakin sweet that it passed. My mom dad and I can finally get insurance.


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"Je pense, donc je suis (I am thinking, therefore I am)." -Rene Descartes

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InvisibleFarBeyondDriven
Truthfully, I'm a bullshitter
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Registered: 04/22/08
Posts: 13,834
Loc: Greenbow, Alabama
Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Thebooedocksaint]
    #388030 - 03/21/10 10:20 PM (14 years, 11 days ago)

details?


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OfflineThebooedocksaint
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Registered: 05/11/09
Posts: 5,723
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: FarBeyondDriven]
    #388032 - 03/21/10 10:23 PM (14 years, 11 days ago)

Quote:

FarBeyondDriven said:
details?




The healthcare bill passed.


--------------------
"Je pense, donc je suis (I am thinking, therefore I am)." -Rene Descartes

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InvisibleFarBeyondDriven
Truthfully, I'm a bullshitter
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Registered: 04/22/08
Posts: 13,834
Loc: Greenbow, Alabama
Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Thebooedocksaint]
    #388033 - 03/21/10 10:28 PM (14 years, 11 days ago)

details of the bill :rofl:


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InvisibleFurrowedBrowM
Free yourself from yourself
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Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 12,041
Loc: Carpal Tunnel
Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: FarBeyondDriven]
    #388035 - 03/21/10 10:33 PM (14 years, 11 days ago)

its 2700 pages long.


--------------------





Multidisciplinary Association for Psychedelic Studies - Become a member!
The Growery's Herb Museum (post #24)
I prefer dangerous freedom to peaceful slavery.
~ Thomas Jefferson ~

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OfflineDoitagain
Smoothie therapist
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Posts: 7,226
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: FurrowedBrow]
    #388036 - 03/21/10 10:36 PM (14 years, 11 days ago)

and full of pork probably.


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ltd said:
fgts just don't understand

keep the shit

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OfflineTHEBats
The Bridge Master
Male


Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 8,488
Last seen: 10 years, 9 months
Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Doitagain]
    #388037 - 03/21/10 10:43 PM (14 years, 11 days ago)

not quite. it still has to go to the senate I believe.  if the senate makes change then it has to be voted on again. other wise it's straight to the presidents signature.


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kickin-two-hundo said:
you know what i did in english class? I came to class stoned out of my mind every day, i chugged vodka in the back of class, i put dead fish in the ceiling tiles. i put a gallon of old milk and orange juice in the file cabinet before winter vacation. i brought snakes in a tied up sweater and let them loose during class. i didnt go to school to learn, i went because i had to. i didnt care, and i didn't fucking listen to that stupid bitch. and i still don't fucking care. i tore the pages out of her books and burned them, and threw away all the books in the class, two books per day.  :twobooks:

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OfflineThebooedocksaint
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Registered: 05/11/09
Posts: 5,723
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: FarBeyondDriven]
    #388046 - 03/21/10 11:09 PM (14 years, 11 days ago)

Quote:

FarBeyondDriven said:
details of the bill :rofl:




Extra money for seniors not covered well enough; Adult children under 26 can be covered by parents insurance; Insurance companies cannot put a cap on payout to individuals with serious illnesses for example cancer, emphysema, etc...

I could go on and on, I think abortion funding got taken out.

And yes there has to be a reconciliation bill, but it will be passed. As Obama put it "What this day represents is another stone firmly laid in the foundation of the American Dream. " 

Now for the next stone! :rastamon:


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"Je pense, donc je suis (I am thinking, therefore I am)." -Rene Descartes

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OfflineLouiscypher
The Ancient One
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Registered: 09/13/09
Posts: 78
Loc: Great PNW
Last seen: 10 years, 2 months
Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: THEBats]
    #388047 - 03/21/10 11:15 PM (14 years, 11 days ago)

Quote:

THEBats said:
not quite. it still has to go to the senate I believe.  if the senate makes change then it has to be voted on again. other wise it's straight to the presidents signature.




Actually I believe they did it in reverse this time. Congress voted for and passed the Senate health care bill. I think it now goes to the president for signing.

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InvisibleFarBeyondDriven
Truthfully, I'm a bullshitter
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Registered: 04/22/08
Posts: 13,834
Loc: Greenbow, Alabama
Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Thebooedocksaint]
    #388048 - 03/21/10 11:19 PM (14 years, 11 days ago)

Quote:

Thebooedocksaint said:
Quote:

FarBeyondDriven said:
details of the bill :rofl:



As Obama put it "What this day represents is another stone firmly laid in the foundation of the American Dream. " 

Now for the next stone! :rastamon:




:rofl2:

I hear ya buddy. I just laid my stone :awehigh:


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OfflineThebooedocksaint
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Louiscypher]
    #388050 - 03/21/10 11:21 PM (14 years, 11 days ago)

Also the stone to be laid after that.



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"Je pense, donc je suis (I am thinking, therefore I am)." -Rene Descartes

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OfflineThebooedocksaint
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: THEBats]
    #388054 - 03/21/10 11:47 PM (14 years, 11 days ago)

Quote:

THEBats said:
not quite. it still has to go to the senate I believe.  if the senate makes change then it has to be voted on again. other wise it's straight to the presidents signature.




Also, if you mean the reconciliation bill.

It cant be signed until Obama signs, i think it needs to already be law to have the reconciliation.


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"Je pense, donc je suis (I am thinking, therefore I am)." -Rene Descartes

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OfflineDungenessDank
Lord of the Flies


Registered: 05/05/08
Posts: 9,372
Loc: PNW
Last seen: 10 years, 10 months
Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Thebooedocksaint]
    #388144 - 03/22/10 07:02 AM (14 years, 10 days ago)

"Senate Republicans have indicated they will use any and all legislative tactics in order to slow -- even stop -- the reconciliation bill from passing."

What a bunch of cock munchers. I'm glad we pay these people hundreds of thousands of dollars to do our bidding.

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Invisiblestill beLIEve
State Property..Again
Male

Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 17,167
Loc: a world thats not my own
Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: DungenessDank]
    #388145 - 03/22/10 07:05 AM (14 years, 10 days ago)

im happy.


--------------------
niteowl said:
See, that term pedo gets thrown around a lot.
Is a 16 year old guy having sex w/a 16 year old girl a pedophile?
If not, then how is a 30 year old considered a pedophile for doing the same thing?
I think y'all need to look up the definition for pedophile.

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OfflineDungenessDank
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Registered: 05/05/08
Posts: 9,372
Loc: PNW
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: still beLIEve]
    #388151 - 03/22/10 08:10 AM (14 years, 10 days ago)

There is nothing for americans to be happy about with this thing.

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Invisiblestill beLIEve
State Property..Again
Male

Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 17,167
Loc: a world thats not my own
Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: DungenessDank]
    #388156 - 03/22/10 09:13 AM (14 years, 10 days ago)

lol ok


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niteowl said:
See, that term pedo gets thrown around a lot.
Is a 16 year old guy having sex w/a 16 year old girl a pedophile?
If not, then how is a 30 year old considered a pedophile for doing the same thing?
I think y'all need to look up the definition for pedophile.

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Offlinehopanshrubman
The Rabble Rouser

Registered: 02/12/10
Posts: 347
Last seen: 12 years, 11 months
Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: still beLIEve]
    #388183 - 03/22/10 10:40 AM (14 years, 10 days ago)

Sure everyones going to be able to get healthcare but its going to be shitty healthcare....

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InvisibleHarry_Ba11sachM
cannoisseur
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Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 11,753
Loc: Nepal Flag
Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: DungenessDank]
    #388187 - 03/22/10 10:47 AM (14 years, 10 days ago)

Quote:

DungenessDank said:
There is nothing for americans to be happy about with this thing.




care to elaborate?

Quote:

DungenessDank said:
"Senate Republicans have indicated they will use any and all legislative tactics in order to slow -- even stop -- the reconciliation bill from passing."

What a bunch of cock munchers. I'm glad we pay these people hundreds of thousands of dollars to do our bidding.





I'm so fucking sick of that "us vs them" mentality in politics. Why are there two opposing "teams" when it comes to legislating bills for the wellbeing of america? I can't fucking stand how Americans have to fight with EVERYBODY, even ourselves. What a joke


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OfflineTomCollins


Registered: 10/06/09
Posts: 2,943
Last seen: 3 months, 15 days
Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: DungenessDank]
    #388188 - 03/22/10 10:52 AM (14 years, 10 days ago)

Quote:

DungenessDank said:
There is nothing for americans to be happy about with this thing.




:facepalm:

Hooray for the bill. It's big news over here as well. We Europeans find your politics very interesting for some reason. :shrug: Something to talk about in between stones I guess. :vaped:


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andyistic said:
Ok so let me bring you idiots up to speed.
The admins are tired of this shitfest being made the joke of the weed community on the Internet.

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Offlineb0b gnarley
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: TomCollins]
    #388190 - 03/22/10 10:56 AM (14 years, 10 days ago)

i'm happy it passed

my healthcare can't get any shittier, right?

and it should be a fundamental human right

makin a difference
on the growery
on the reg.

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OfflineThebooedocksaint
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: DungenessDank]
    #388192 - 03/22/10 11:00 AM (14 years, 10 days ago)

Quote:

Harry_Ba11sach said:
Quote:

DungenessDank said:
There is nothing for americans to be happy about with this thing.




care to elaborate?

Quote:

DungenessDank said:
"Senate Republicans have indicated they will use any and all legislative tactics in order to slow -- even stop -- the reconciliation bill from passing."

What a bunch of cock munchers. I'm glad we pay these people hundreds of thousands of dollars to do our bidding.





I'm so fucking sick of that "us vs them" mentality in politics. Why are there two opposing "teams" when it comes to legislating bills for the wellbeing of america? I can't fucking stand how Americans have to fight with EVERYBODY, even ourselves. What a joke




Blame redneck christian republicans.
So many of the things the republicans argue make me just go "...ok ... now tell me the bad part." or "You know, that 'majority' of americans that disapprove this bill mostly think is isn't LIBERAL enough, so why are CONSERVATIVES argueing?"

Quote:

DungenessDank said:
There is nothing for americans to be happy about with this thing.




Really? We shouldn't be happy about adult children being insurable up to age 26? We shouldn't be happy about removing a cap from insurance companies toward serious illness? We shouldn't be happy about making healthcare available to uninsured Americans (like my family who has monthly medical bill in the thousands). I mean damn, with insurance I might be able to see a dentist for the first time in 4-5 years, go to the doctor to get a check up for the first time in a year and a half, or hell MAYBE JUST GO TO THE DOCTOR BECAUSE I'M YOU KNOW SICK.

And you know what makes me feel best, it will eventually get better after republicans stop just going "No, You Lie, and Baby Killer."

I'm so happy.


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"Je pense, donc je suis (I am thinking, therefore I am)." -Rene Descartes

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OfflineThebooedocksaint
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: TomCollins]
    #388193 - 03/22/10 11:02 AM (14 years, 10 days ago)

Quote:

Spency said:
Quote:

DungenessDank said:
There is nothing for americans to be happy about with this thing.




:facepalm:




QFT. extremely facepalm worth, almost bad ratings worthy to me. :rofl:


--------------------
"Je pense, donc je suis (I am thinking, therefore I am)." -Rene Descartes

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Invisiblestill beLIEve
State Property..Again
Male

Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 17,167
Loc: a world thats not my own
Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Thebooedocksaint]
    #388196 - 03/22/10 11:21 AM (14 years, 10 days ago)

Quote:

Thebooedocksaint said:

I mean damn, with insurance I might be able to see a dentist for the first time in 4-5 years, go to the doctor to get a check up for the first time in a year and a half, or hell MAYBE JUST GO TO THE DOCTOR BECAUSE I'M YOU KNOW SICK.

I'm so happy.




word.


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niteowl said:
See, that term pedo gets thrown around a lot.
Is a 16 year old guy having sex w/a 16 year old girl a pedophile?
If not, then how is a 30 year old considered a pedophile for doing the same thing?
I think y'all need to look up the definition for pedophile.

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OfflineThebooedocksaint
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Registered: 05/11/09
Posts: 5,723
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: still beLIEve]
    #388199 - 03/22/10 11:30 AM (14 years, 10 days ago)

I'm curious, anyone that is a bussiness major should be able to happy.

How do tax increases generally affect individual's propensity to save? More directly, individuals in the top 5% income bracket.


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"Je pense, donc je suis (I am thinking, therefore I am)." -Rene Descartes

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OfflineHomosapian
DMT
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Registered: 12/25/09
Posts: 484
Loc: Austin , TX
Last seen: 13 years, 8 months
Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Thebooedocksaint]
    #388203 - 03/22/10 11:43 AM (14 years, 10 days ago)

if you don't get it you will have to pay a fine! but otherwise its good news


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Offline81renaissance
Coachella '13 KKOTY
Male


Registered: 04/20/08
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: hopanshrubman]
    #388209 - 03/22/10 11:50 AM (14 years, 10 days ago)

Quote:

hopanshrubman said:
Sure everyones going to be able to get healthcare but its going to be shitty healthcare....




Source?

Ask our Hawaiian friends on the forum about public health care in HI, and I bet they're pretty happy with it.
Republicans don't want it to be common knowledge how successful it has been out there, but ask around and see what you think then.


--------------------
"So it goes."
-Kurt Vonnegut


BlueBerry_Swisher said:I want French fries. No, I want a penis French. Thank you. I'm so excited. I can not contain myself. Now I eat chocolate. It is so good. I'm trying to rub it all over myself. And then lick. Now I need a hot shower. The end.

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OfflineDoitagain
Smoothie therapist
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: TomCollins]
    #388212 - 03/22/10 11:55 AM (14 years, 10 days ago)

Quote:

Spency said:
Quote:

DungenessDank said:
There is nothing for americans to be happy about with this thing.




:facepalm:

Hooray for the bill. It's big news over here as well. We Europeans find your politics very interesting for some reason. :shrug: Something to talk about in between stones I guess. :vaped:



agreed, america is the only western nation without some form of socialized health-care, time to catch up with the times.

The USSA argument is retarded, oh yeah our entire capitalist system is going to crumble now because we're semi-socializing health-care.  Everyone better start reppin their hammer and sickle durr durr derp


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ltd said:
fgts just don't understand

keep the shit

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OfflineThebooedocksaint
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Doitagain]
    #388214 - 03/22/10 12:02 PM (14 years, 10 days ago)

Quote:

Doitagain said:
Quote:

Spency said:
Quote:

DungenessDank said:
There is nothing for americans to be happy about with this thing.




:facepalm:

Hooray for the bill. It's big news over here as well. We Europeans find your politics very interesting for some reason. :shrug: Something to talk about in between stones I guess. :vaped:



agreed, america is the only western nation without some form of socialized health-care, time to catch up with the times.

The USSA argument is retarded, oh yeah our entire capitalist system is going to crumble now because we're semi-socializing health-care.  Everyone better start reppin their hammer and sickle durr durr derp




Dude, if america ever gives up capitalism, north Korea will open its boarders. lol (not saying one will cause the other, just a snowballs chance in hell)

I'm no republican, but even I understand the advantages of Capitalism.


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"Je pense, donc je suis (I am thinking, therefore I am)." -Rene Descartes

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InvisibleTriptonic
Male


Registered: 06/13/08
Posts: 15,581
Loc: Flag
Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Thebooedocksaint]
    #388296 - 03/22/10 03:51 PM (14 years, 10 days ago)

I dont think it was a great idea that it passed. I think the healthcare is going to be shittier. Also where the hell is obama getting all this money? Talk about digging ourself a hole.

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InvisibleHarry_Ba11sachM
cannoisseur
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Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 11,753
Loc: Nepal Flag
Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Triptonic]
    #388299 - 03/22/10 03:53 PM (14 years, 10 days ago)

You don't think the last 8 years dug us into a hole?


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InvisibleTriptonic
Male


Registered: 06/13/08
Posts: 15,581
Loc: Flag
Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Harry_Ba11sach]
    #388300 - 03/22/10 03:54 PM (14 years, 10 days ago)

Oh no, it did. But why make it bigger?

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InvisibleHarry_Ba11sachM
cannoisseur
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Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 11,753
Loc: Nepal Flag
Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Triptonic] * 1
    #388302 - 03/22/10 03:55 PM (14 years, 10 days ago)

because this time we're spending money to save lives, instead of destroy them. there are millions of people without health care in this country


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Invisibleltd
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Registered: 04/20/08
Posts: 6,042
Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Harry_Ba11sach]
    #388304 - 03/22/10 03:56 PM (14 years, 10 days ago)

meanwhile we're still in the middle east hunting tusken raiders

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InvisibleTriptonic
Male


Registered: 06/13/08
Posts: 15,581
Loc: Flag
Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Harry_Ba11sach]
    #388306 - 03/22/10 04:00 PM (14 years, 10 days ago)

Quote:

Harry_Ba11sach said:
because this time we're spending money to save lives, instead of destroy them. there are millions of people without health care in this country



Yeah but we are all going to be broke as hell and in poverty when we are older. I just dont know how we pull billions of dollars out of our asses.

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OfflineTangerines
Grease Wizard
Male


Registered: 04/20/08
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Triptonic]
    #388308 - 03/22/10 04:05 PM (14 years, 10 days ago)

So this Bill is going to make it illegal for people not to have health insurance...what a complete load of bullshit.  How they can make people have health insurance is beyond comprehension.  Talk about unconstitutional...

Not to mention this healthcare bullshit will overload the already overloaded healthcare system.  WOOHOO nothing like waiting a day in the ER.

Where is all this money going to come from?  From the tax payers.  Man I sure love paying for other peoples health.  Yea...that is awesome. Not.  How about we get rid of frivolous lawsuits?  THOSE are the reason health care cost so much.  Get rid of the bullshit lawsuits and doctors spend less on insurance and charge less for treatment.  This healthcare bill is absolute bullshit.

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InvisibleTriptonic
Male


Registered: 06/13/08
Posts: 15,581
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Tangerines]
    #388309 - 03/22/10 04:10 PM (14 years, 10 days ago)

Tang I never thought I would say this but you are right.

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OfflineDoitagain
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Tangerines]
    #388400 - 03/22/10 07:00 PM (14 years, 10 days ago)

Quote:

Tangerines said:
So this Bill is going to make it illegal for people not to have health insurance...what a complete load of bullshit.  How they can make people have health insurance is beyond comprehension.  Talk about unconstitutional...

Not to mention this healthcare bullshit will overload the already overloaded healthcare system.  WOOHOO nothing like waiting a day in the ER.

Where is all this money going to come from?  From the tax payers.  Man I sure love paying for other peoples health.  Yea...that is awesome. Not.  How about we get rid of frivolous lawsuits?  THOSE are the reason health care cost so much.  Get rid of the bullshit lawsuits and doctors spend less on insurance and charge less for treatment.  This healthcare bill is absolute bullshit.



lol everybody has an opinion on this


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ltd said:
fgts just don't understand

keep the shit

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OfflineTangerines
Grease Wizard
Male


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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Doitagain]
    #388401 - 03/22/10 07:10 PM (14 years, 10 days ago)

The difference is mine is correct.

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InvisibleTriptonic
Male


Registered: 06/13/08
Posts: 15,581
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Tangerines]
    #388410 - 03/22/10 07:24 PM (14 years, 10 days ago)

Quote:

Tangerines said:
The difference is mine is correct.



agreed

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OfflineDoitagain
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Tangerines] * 1
    #388435 - 03/22/10 07:56 PM (14 years, 10 days ago)

Quote:

Tangerines said:
The difference is mine is correct.



not really, unless you've read the entire bill yours is as uniformed as mine.

I do know that the US is the only western nation without some form of socialized health-care, us we're behind the rest of the world and just catching up. 

It's a little fucked up that I can get better health care in Israel than I can in the US, although thankfully not anymore.

Until this bill passes i have no health-care in this country, where as in Israel anything that happened to me would be taken care of.


--------------------
ltd said:
fgts just don't understand

keep the shit

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InvisibleFurrowedBrowM
Free yourself from yourself
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Posts: 12,041
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Doitagain] * 2
    #388453 - 03/22/10 08:26 PM (14 years, 10 days ago)

Here's the fact of the matter.  None of you read the bill.  You are ALL relying on the interpretations of others who may have read some of it or may have heard an interpretation and thought it sounded good so they said it.  no one knows what's goign to happen.  it's all speculation.  I wont take part in any of it.


--------------------





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Invisibleltd
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: FurrowedBrow]
    #388457 - 03/22/10 08:35 PM (14 years, 10 days ago)

+1

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OfflineTHEBats
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: ltd]
    #388464 - 03/22/10 08:42 PM (14 years, 10 days ago)

At 2700 pages I would be surprised if most of our congressmen have read the bill.  Student loan reform is also attached with this as well.


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kickin-two-hundo said:
you know what i did in english class? I came to class stoned out of my mind every day, i chugged vodka in the back of class, i put dead fish in the ceiling tiles. i put a gallon of old milk and orange juice in the file cabinet before winter vacation. i brought snakes in a tied up sweater and let them loose during class. i didnt go to school to learn, i went because i had to. i didnt care, and i didn't fucking listen to that stupid bitch. and i still don't fucking care. i tore the pages out of her books and burned them, and threw away all the books in the class, two books per day.  :twobooks:

Edited by THEBats (03/22/10 08:42 PM)

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InvisibleFurrowedBrowM
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: THEBats]
    #388470 - 03/22/10 08:46 PM (14 years, 10 days ago)

yeah, it's ridiculous how a single line buried deep inside some otherwise insignificant block of text can have such a profound effect on the final outcome of how the law is enacted.  That is a process that is always over looked.  I doubt it will be with this one.  i just hope this doesn't end up being another unsustainable entitlement program.


--------------------





Multidisciplinary Association for Psychedelic Studies - Become a member!
The Growery's Herb Museum (post #24)
I prefer dangerous freedom to peaceful slavery.
~ Thomas Jefferson ~

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Offlineb0b gnarley
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: FurrowedBrow]
    #388483 - 03/22/10 09:06 PM (14 years, 10 days ago)

Quote:

FurrowedBrow said:
Here's the fact of the matter.  None of you read the bill.  You are ALL relying on the interpretations of others who may have read some of it or may have heard an interpretation and thought it sounded good so they said it.  no one knows what's goign to happen.  it's all speculation.  I wont take part in any of it.



tried viewing it in .pdf


my computer crashed

:carl:

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OfflineDoitagain
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: FurrowedBrow]
    #388539 - 03/22/10 11:09 PM (14 years, 10 days ago)

lol i just said that.


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ltd said:
fgts just don't understand

keep the shit

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Invisibleniteowl
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Tangerines]
    #388572 - 03/23/10 12:23 AM (14 years, 10 days ago)

This plan may not be perfect...but it is a step in the right direction


--------------------
The Ego is a pathological condition
like a calcareous tumor or cyst
that begins growing in the personality
in the absence of hallucinogenic substances
-Terence McKenna-

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InvisibleTriptonic
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: niteowl]
    #388574 - 03/23/10 12:25 AM (14 years, 10 days ago)

I just want to know where they plan on getting all the money for this.

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Offlineb0b gnarley
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: niteowl]
    #388577 - 03/23/10 12:31 AM (14 years, 10 days ago)

Quote:

niteowl said:
This plan may not be perfect...but it is a step in the right direction



straight off the fox news poll

LOL

http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2010/03/21/decide-health-care-victory-america/

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Invisibleniteowl
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Triptonic]
    #388579 - 03/23/10 12:50 AM (14 years, 10 days ago)

You don't seem to understand how much profit there is in the health care industry

When 10 companies in the Fortune 500
make more than the other 490 combined
and those 10 companies are Pharmaceutical companies
bilking money outta your pocket to buy another house

then there is a SERIOUS problem that needs to be addressed

this is an attempt to curb some of the greed involved in the mess America calls health care

profit should be taken out of the health care equation
just like it was done with the police, fire dept and public schools

its wrong for the fire dept to not put out a fire
if you didn't pay your monthly tides to the fire dept

that's what insurance has done for health care
you either don't get treatment, or you go in debt for it

that is WRONG and should not happen in America

The U.S. needs to go the way of every other industrial nation
and give health care to everyone for a reasonable price

the long term benefits are well worth it


--------------------
The Ego is a pathological condition
like a calcareous tumor or cyst
that begins growing in the personality
in the absence of hallucinogenic substances
-Terence McKenna-

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InvisibleTriptonic
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: niteowl]
    #388582 - 03/23/10 12:57 AM (14 years, 10 days ago)

Quote:

niteowl said:
You don't seem to understand how much profit there is in the health care industry

When 10 companies in the Fortune 500
make more than the other 490 combined
and those 10 companies are Pharmaceutical companies
bilking money outta your pocket to buy another house

then there is a SERIOUS problem that needs to be addressed

this is an attempt to curb some of the greed involved in the mess America calls health care

profit should be taken out of the health care equation
just like it was done with the police, fire dept and public schools

its wrong for the fire dept to not put out a fire
if you didn't pay your monthly tides to the fire dept

that's what insurance has done for health care
you either don't get treatment, or you go in debt for it

that is WRONG and should not happen in America

The U.S. needs to go the way of every other industrial nation
and give health care to everyone for a reasonable price

the long term benefits are well worth it



The reason doctors get paid what they do, is because they have to go to school for long periods of time. And also have lots of loans to pay off. Even if that wasnt what you were saying.

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Invisibleniteowl
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Triptonic]
    #388588 - 03/23/10 01:08 AM (14 years, 10 days ago)

profit has nothing to do with Dr's pay or school loans mang

:sorry:


Here is a basic run down of some of the changes

  1. Insurance companies can no longer impose lifetime coverage limits on your insurance. Never again will you face the risk of getting really sick and then, a few months in, having your insurer tell you "sorry, you've 'run out' of coverage." Almost everyone I've met knows someone who had insurance but got really, really sick (or had a kid get really sick) and ran into a lifetime cap.
  2. If you don't know someone who has run into a lifetime cap, you probably know someone who has run into an annual cap. The use of these will be sharply limited. (They'll be eliminated entirely in 2014.)
  3. Insurers can no longer tell kids with pre-existing conditions that they'll insure them "except for" the pre-existing condition. That's called pre-existing condition exclusion, and it's out the window.
  4. A special, temporary program will help adults with pre-existing conditions get coverage. It expires in 2014, when the health insurance exchanges—basically big "pools" of businesses and individuals—come on-line. That's when all insurers will have to cover everyone, pre-existing condition or not.
  5. Insurance companies can't drop you when you get sick, either—this plan means the end of "rescissions."
  6. You can stay on your parents' insurance until you're 26.
  7. Seniors get $250 towards closing the "donut hole" in their prescription drug coverage. Currently, prescription drug coverage ends once you've spent $2,700 on drugs and it doesn't kick in again until you've spent nearly $6,200. James Ridgeway wrote about the problems with the donut hole for Mother Jones in the September/October 2008 issue. Eventually, the health care reform bill will close the donut hole entirely. The AARP has more on immediate health care benefits for seniors. Next year (i.e. in nine months), 50 percent of the donut hole will be covered.
  8. Medicare's preventive benefits now come with a free visit with your primary care doctor every year to plan out your prevention services. And there are no more co-pays for preventative services in Medicare.
  9. This is a big one: small businesses get big tax credits—up to 50 percent of premium costs—for offering health insurance to their workers.
  10. Insurers with unusually high administrative costs have to offer rebates to their customers, and every insurance company has to reveal how much it spends on overhead.


--------------------
The Ego is a pathological condition
like a calcareous tumor or cyst
that begins growing in the personality
in the absence of hallucinogenic substances
-Terence McKenna-

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InvisibleTriptonic
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: niteowl]
    #388589 - 03/23/10 01:09 AM (14 years, 10 days ago)

:shrug: I guess all we can do is wait and see huh.

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OfflineTomCollins


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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Triptonic]
    #388596 - 03/23/10 02:20 AM (14 years, 10 days ago)

To triptonic and all the other people that don't necessarily support the bill passing. Why are you guys so worried? This has been in place in Europe for over 50 years. This is a good thing.

It's kinda backwards to not have a mandatory socialized health care system.

How can you complain about it being mandatory? It's a safety thing. It's kind of like how it's mandatory to buy insurance for your car.

Do you know what it's like to be a father and husband, and then suddenly you get hurt at work and can't work anymore? You can't get any medical help either because you can't afford health insurance. I find that really backwards. That's what it's like in Africa and Asia. Why do you guys want to be like the rest of the third world?

That shit is also bad for the economy and for the government anyway, because then you have unemployed people on unemployment benefits or on some other kind of government help program. Sometimes those folks go homeless, and then that's more money and more paper work and it's just fucking sad too.

The point of this bill is so that this kind of shit doesn't happen.

With all these complaints lately about "where the money is going" this should seem like a step in the right direction. At least you guys are going to see money being spent on the home front rather than on Iraq and Afghanistan.

I really think this is a good thing, and I think you guys are going to actually bounce back economically with this bill. There are huge benefits to this bill that I think some of you are over looking. This kind of system works, and has for a very long time in Germany, the Netherlands, Sweden, Norway, France, you name it.

In my opinion, it should be a human right to be able to seek out medical assistance if you need it. No matter how much money you have in your bank account.


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andyistic said:
Ok so let me bring you idiots up to speed.
The admins are tired of this shitfest being made the joke of the weed community on the Internet.

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InvisibleTriptonic
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: TomCollins]
    #388599 - 03/23/10 02:29 AM (14 years, 10 days ago)

I never said I didnt support it, it just seems like a waste of money right now. How about him trying to find jobs for the millions of people out of work right now. Then worry about healthcare. I think he just hasnt thought it out quite enough.

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Invisibleniteowl
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Triptonic]
    #388603 - 03/23/10 02:41 AM (14 years, 10 days ago)

Gotta have a healthy populace in order for them to work :flowstone:


--------------------
The Ego is a pathological condition
like a calcareous tumor or cyst
that begins growing in the personality
in the absence of hallucinogenic substances
-Terence McKenna-

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OfflineTomCollins


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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Triptonic]
    #388604 - 03/23/10 02:42 AM (14 years, 10 days ago)

Quote:

Triptonic said:
I never said I didnt support it, it just seems like a waste of money right now. How about him trying to find jobs for the millions of people out of work right now. Then worry about healthcare. I think he just hasnt thought it out quite enough.




You can't find work for people who can't work because they're injured/sick and can't afford medical bills trip. That's what it's about. This bill is going to give your country a standing and reliable work force.

Plus just enacting this bill is going to open a multitude of jobs in the government and in health care!


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andyistic said:
Ok so let me bring you idiots up to speed.
The admins are tired of this shitfest being made the joke of the weed community on the Internet.

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OfflineDoitagain
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: TomCollins]
    #388609 - 03/23/10 03:02 AM (14 years, 10 days ago)

Quote:

Spency said:
To triptonic and all the other people that don't necessarily support the bill passing. Why are you guys so worried? This has been in place in Europe for over 50 years. This is a good thing.

It's kinda backwards to not have a mandatory socialized health care system.

How can you complain about it being mandatory? It's a safety thing. It's kind of like how it's mandatory to buy insurance for your car.

Do you know what it's like to be a father and husband, and then suddenly you get hurt at work and can't work anymore? You can't get any medical help either because you can't afford health insurance. I find that really backwards. That's what it's like in Africa and Asia. Why do you guys want to be like the rest of the third world?

That shit is also bad for the economy and for the government anyway, because then you have unemployed people on unemployment benefits or on some other kind of government help program. Sometimes those folks go homeless, and then that's more money and more paper work and it's just fucking sad too.

The point of this bill is so that this kind of shit doesn't happen.

With all these complaints lately about "where the money is going" this should seem like a step in the right direction. At least you guys are going to see money being spent on the home front rather than on Iraq and Afghanistan.

I really think this is a good thing, and I think you guys are going to actually bounce back economically with this bill. There are huge benefits to this bill that I think some of you are over looking. This kind of system works, and has for a very long time in Germany, the Netherlands, Sweden, Norway, France, you name it.

In my opinion, it should be a human right to be able to seek out medical assistance if you need it. No matter how much money you have in your bank account.



this is what i have been saying, even Israel is able to provide quality health-care for its citizens, everyone does this but us and it's about time we joined the 21st century in terms of healthcare.


American politics is  generally about rhetoric and not substance, people tend to associate socialism with USSR, and assume socialized healthcare is bad, it's complete BS.  The system is badly in need of reform, and this hopefully won't be the end-all-be all framework of our re-structured health system but it's at least  a step in the right direction.


--------------------
ltd said:
fgts just don't understand

keep the shit

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OfflineDoitagain
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Triptonic]
    #388610 - 03/23/10 03:09 AM (14 years, 10 days ago)

Quote:

Triptonic said:
I never said I didnt support it, it just seems like a waste of money right now. How about him trying to find jobs for the millions of people out of work right now. Then worry about healthcare. I think he just hasnt thought it out quite enough.



lol yeah he should just write a law that creates jobs for all the unemployed people, and then he can write another law that ends the war in Iraq.

cause presidents totally have the power to do all that shit. :bucktoothfattygangsta:


--------------------
ltd said:
fgts just don't understand

keep the shit

Edited by Doitagain (03/23/10 03:10 AM)

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OfflineDieselB
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Doitagain]
    #388656 - 03/23/10 09:29 AM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Sorry, but a lot of you guys need to wake up and smell the java.. I don't even know where to begin.. How about Obama PROMISING bipartisan support, and the only bipartisanship is dems and repubs voting against it! Obama PROMISED complete trasparency. He delivered nan.. Instead you got Pelosi up there telling us that (paraphrasing) "We can't find out whats in the bill till we vote it in, its so special, its a surprise!"

I don't like surprises from my government, how about you, do you really feel comfortable with the rate government is growing? They have done nothing but fuck up continually on both sides, now they control 1/6th of the economy!? We're already goin' down the toilet.

Europe is doing so great, huh? Why? because they have better pot laws? Their healthcare sucks, you tell me whats better when it comes to ANYTHING, the free version or the pay version.. Remember, "You get what you pay for"?

Dems are gonna regret this come november, mark my words.

And no, I'm not some sour repub. I am a proud American that can't believe his eyes, one that's starting to be not so proud, one that's fearing for his countries destruction. Everyday we go deeper into debt, not long ago Sec. Clinton was in China begging them to keep buying our debt, they're gonna realize we're not gonna be able to pay it back, they're gonna drop our debt... You think the past little while has been a recession, some say DEPRESSION. You've seen nothing yet.


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If you ain't smokin' dro, you're smokin' reggie. :shrug:

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OfflineDungenessDank
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: DieselB]
    #388658 - 03/23/10 09:40 AM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Its just another sign of the death of the American dream.

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InvisibleHarry_Ba11sachM
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: DungenessDank]
    #388661 - 03/23/10 09:57 AM (14 years, 9 days ago)

the American Dream is to die of a curable disease because you can't afford health care?


Well shit, I better move then


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OfflineDungenessDank
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Harry_Ba11sach]
    #388663 - 03/23/10 10:00 AM (14 years, 9 days ago)

I know I have a different perspective than most folks, but if I get going on it I'll never shut up. I just hope they know there's at least 2 times the number of illegal immigrants in this country than they estimate. They are going to be a very heavy burden on this system. My state has had socialized health care for years, and its gotten so bad economically that they had to stop taking new people into the system.

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OfflineTangerines
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: DungenessDank]
    #388680 - 03/23/10 11:10 AM (14 years, 9 days ago)

So my Grandfather is going to have to pay more money for medicaid and now some doctors won't be accepting medicaid because they will be getting paid less.  How is that fair?  He pays more for less.  That is fucked up in my eyes.

I do not understand why they lumped all the parts of the bill together instead of working with the issues seperately.  More bullshit.  Sure there are parts of the bill that are nice but there are some majorly bad parts.

I have no problem paying for someone to go to the ER, but I do have a problem paying for someone to go get regular check ups etc.  So when I get a job I will have to pay for my own health care and the health care of degenerates.

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OfflineTomCollins


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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Tangerines]
    #388690 - 03/23/10 11:31 AM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

DieselB said:
Europe is doing so great, huh? Why? because they have better pot laws? Their healthcare sucks, you tell me whats better when it comes to ANYTHING, the free version or the pay version.. Remember, "You get what you pay for"?




Do you have evidence to support this statement?

I have lived in 5 different countries here in Europe and am currently on government health care and I seriously question what you just said. Do you even own a passport?

Your logic is completely flawed in my eyes anyway. You ask what's better, the pay version or the free version. I ask you this. What's better: something or nothing at all.

Your ignoring the point behind this bill because people like you have to dish out more cash. Cry me a river. This bill is meant to provide healthcare for those who can't afford it. Plain and simple.

If you want better, go spend more money.

Quote:

Tangerines said:
So my Grandfather is going to have to pay more money for medicaid and now some doctors won't be accepting medicaid because they will be getting paid less.  How is that fair?  He pays more for less.  That is fucked up in my eyes.




Sure. There are people on various already existing healthcare. Sure there are people that are in great health and shouldn't be forced to pay for health care if they don't want to. Of course it sucks for those people, but unfortunately this bill is for the greater majority and future generations of your country men. This bill will make 15 million Americans eligible for health care. That's not a good thing?

I'm sorry to say this but your grandfather is not a special unique person. There are other people with needs far greater than him and that have no money. This bill is for those people. Remind yourself that your grandfather will survive this "horrible tragedy" as will many other people including yourself. This I'm sure of.

It will no doubt be a difficult transition, but quite honestly, universal mandatory healthcare is a human right that your government is denying your citizens. Plain and simple. If you guys plan to keep "promoting and preserving freedom" around the world, perhaps it's best you shape up on the home front a little.

I think you have a very biased opinion, because someone you are closely related to is getting the short end of the stick with this bill. The fact is there are almost 400 million Americans that share the same country as you.

Also, any doctor that denies government health care because it's not enough for his pockets is no better than a drug dealer quite honestly. Evidently the doctors your grandfather is seeing are those greedy over prescribers I read about everyday. I hope this bill leads your grandfather to more honest doctors who are interested in helping people and not money.


--------------------
andyistic said:
Ok so let me bring you idiots up to speed.
The admins are tired of this shitfest being made the joke of the weed community on the Internet.

Edited by TomCollins (03/23/10 11:36 AM)

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OfflineTangerines
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: TomCollins]
    #388693 - 03/23/10 11:38 AM (14 years, 9 days ago)

So now if my grandfather cannot afford the increase he is just SOL?  Fuck you man.  It's not like he is rich or anything.  Just a poor old man who now won't be able to afford his own health care because he has to pay for others.

The government is going to make it ILLEGAL to not have health insurance.  That is fucking unconstitutional.  They cannot make anyone get health care.  Fuck that.

Why should people have to pay for other peoples health?  Health should be a family issue the government should not be getting involved.  Why should people have to pay for crackhead suzie and her 5 illegitimate babies?

This is just going to increase taxes to pay for this shit.  Our country was pretty much FOUNDED because we disliked heavy taxes.  :picard:

It's like BO thinks we can just pull money out of our asses.

If I work hard for my money why should I have to give it away to help people that don't work for their money? 

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OfflineTomCollins


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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Tangerines]
    #388698 - 03/23/10 11:54 AM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Tangerines said:
So now if my grandfather cannot afford the increase he is just SOL?  Fuck you man.  It's not like he is rich or anything.  Just a poor old man who now won't be able to afford his own health care because he has to pay for others.




Unfortunately this is what most of us actually call fair. He's always going to have health care now.

Quote:

Tangerines said:The government is going to make it ILLEGAL to not have health insurance.  That is fucking unconstitutional.  They cannot make anyone get health care.  Fuck that.

Why should people have to pay for other peoples health?  Health should be a family issue the government should not be getting involved.  Why should people have to pay for crackhead suzie and her 5 illegitimate babies?




Yes they can, and that's how it should be. No matter who you are, you should have the right to seek medical help. This bill ensures everyone has help if they need it, and that everyone is contributing their fair share to make that a reality.

Quote:

Tangerines said:This is just going to increase taxes to pay for this shit.  Our country was pretty much FOUNDED because we disliked heavy taxes.  :picard:




Actually, I don't mean to be an asshole here, but I believe it was because your country was being taxed WITHOUT REPRESENTATION by a tyrannical foreign entity. :wink:

It will increase taxes, but it's for a good cause. Don't you care about anyone else other than you and your immediate circle of family and friends?

Quote:

Tangerines said:It's like BO thinks we can just pull money out of our asses.

If I work hard for my money why should I have to give it away to help people that don't work for their money? 




Because some people can't work at all because they're injured or sick and can't pay for the medical bills. Some people are severely mentally or physically handicapped and cannot work at all - that's the problem.

Try and understand. I sympathize for your grandfather and I know it must be hard financially, but quite honestly I can't really shed a tear for your grandfather when there are people who are completely helpless and in need. It's just not fair.


--------------------
andyistic said:
Ok so let me bring you idiots up to speed.
The admins are tired of this shitfest being made the joke of the weed community on the Internet.

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Invisibleniteowl
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Tangerines]
    #388699 - 03/23/10 11:56 AM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Tangerines said:
Why should people have to pay for other peoples health?  Health should be a family issue the government should not be getting involved.  Why should people have to pay for crackhead suzie and her 5 illegitimate babies?





Why should people have to pay for other peoples property protection?  Protection should be a family issue the government should not be getting involved.  Why should people have to pay for crackhead suzie and her 5 illegitimate babies when their house burns down because she was smoking crack?

your arguments are retarded and based on ignorance
health care is a social issue and needs to be handled by the society

same with property protection and public education


--------------------
The Ego is a pathological condition
like a calcareous tumor or cyst
that begins growing in the personality
in the absence of hallucinogenic substances
-Terence McKenna-

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: TomCollins]
    #388703 - 03/23/10 12:06 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Yes I only care about my direct circle of people.  My clan if you will.  That is how it should be I do not need the government to be breathing down my neck.  I will take care of my own.  If people cannot take care of their own then they should fade away.  Survival of the fittest should apply to humans as well.

And it is unconstitutional to force people to have health insurance.  If I do not want health insurance I should not be forced to have it.  That is fucked up man.


I do not believe health care should be a social issue.  Why do I care if someone I don't know can afford health care?  I'm not going to lie, I don't care about people I don't know.  I don't have time to worry about every American.  I would rather spend my time and money on my family.  Family comes first.  If someone in my family had a terrible disease my family would band together to get them help  Close knit families FTW.

Yea, I'm an asshole.

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: niteowl]
    #388704 - 03/23/10 12:07 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

:facepalm:

i agree with tang

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: DieselB]
    #388707 - 03/23/10 12:10 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

DieselB said:
Sorry, but a lot of you guys need to wake up and smell the java.. I don't even know where to begin.. How about Obama PROMISING bipartisan support, and the only bipartisanship is dems and repubs voting against it! Obama PROMISED complete trasparency. He delivered nan.. Instead you got Pelosi up there telling us that (paraphrasing) "We can't find out whats in the bill till we vote it in, its so special, its a surprise!"

I don't like surprises from my government, how about you, do you really feel comfortable with the rate government is growing? They have done nothing but fuck up continually on both sides, now they control 1/6th of the economy!? We're already goin' down the toilet.

Europe is doing so great, huh? Why? because they have better pot laws? Their healthcare sucks, you tell me whats better when it comes to ANYTHING, the free version or the pay version.. Remember, "You get what you pay for"?

Dems are gonna regret this come november, mark my words.

And no, I'm not some sour repub. I am a proud American that can't believe his eyes, one that's starting to be not so proud, one that's fearing for his countries destruction. Everyday we go deeper into debt, not long ago Sec. Clinton was in China begging them to keep buying our debt, they're gonna realize we're not gonna be able to pay it back, they're gonna drop our debt... You think the past little while has been a recession, some say DEPRESSION. You've seen nothing yet.



bro it's absolutely clear that you have no idea what the fuck you are talking about, and are just spouting your mouth off and  you're clearly influenced by the great american delusion that we must be the best at everything.

It's clear you've probably never left your country, so i will let you in on a secret.  The system works, period.  The united states does not have better health-care than Israel, Australia, Germany pretty much any 1st world western nation has the system in place and it works better than ours.

In Israel the quality of health-care i received was every bit as good as it was when I was insured here.  Health-care doesn't need to cost nearly as much as it does to be good, the main reason it is so costly is because of the massive amounts of profits made by pharmaceutical and biomedical companies, this is an issue that needs addressed.

you may very well find yourself losing your job someday or in a situation that would have left you w/o healthcare.  When you get sick and get treatment for it you will thank the dems for getting this through.


--------------------
ltd said:
fgts just don't understand

keep the shit

Edited by Doitagain (03/23/10 12:11 PM)

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OfflineDoitagain
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Tangerines]
    #388708 - 03/23/10 12:13 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Tangerines said:
Yes I only care about my direct circle of people.  My clan if you will.  That is how it should be I do not need the government to be breathing down my neck.  I will take care of my own.  If people cannot take care of their own then they should fade away.  Survival of the fittest should apply to humans as well.

And it is unconstitutional to force people to have health insurance.  If I do not want health insurance I should not be forced to have it.  That is fucked up man.


I do not believe health care should be a social issue.  Why do I care if someone I don't know can afford health care?  I'm not going to lie, I don't care about people I don't know.  I don't have time to worry about every American.  I would rather spend my time and money on my family.  Family comes first.  If someone in my family had a terrible disease my family would band together to get them help  Close knit families FTW.

Yea, I'm an asshole.



i seriously doubt any fine are going to be levied on ppl for not having it, honestly who gives a shit, everybody should have health insurance, we are just now catching up with other 1st world western nations.

Have the things our government does are unconstitutional but they still do them, some of them are actually necessary.


--------------------
ltd said:
fgts just don't understand

keep the shit

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Doitagain]
    #388709 - 03/23/10 12:14 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Doitagain said:
Quote:

Triptonic said:
I never said I didnt support it, it just seems like a waste of money right now. How about him trying to find jobs for the millions of people out of work right now. Then worry about healthcare. I think he just hasnt thought it out quite enough.



lol yeah he should just write a law that creates jobs for all the unemployed people, and then he can write another law that ends the war in Iraq.

cause presidents totally have the power to do all that shit. :bucktoothfattygangsta:




--------------------
ltd said:
fgts just don't understand

keep the shit

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Tangerines]
    #388712 - 03/23/10 12:21 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Tangerines said:
Yes I only care about my direct circle of people.  My clan if you will.  That is how it should be I do not need the government to be breathing down my neck.  I will take care of my own.  If people cannot take care of their own then they should fade away.  Survival of the fittest should apply to humans as well.

And it is unconstitutional to force people to have health insurance.  If I do not want health insurance I should not be forced to have it.  That is fucked up man.


I do not believe health care should be a social issue.  Why do I care if someone I don't know can afford health care?  I'm not going to lie, I don't care about people I don't know.  I don't have time to worry about every American.  I would rather spend my time and money on my family.  Family comes first.  If someone in my family had a terrible disease my family would band together to get them help  Close knit families FTW.





So what do orphans do? What do people without families do? Displaced refugees? Oh right... you don't care about people. I guess if your born lucky that just gives you the right to give everyone else the finger. Take all you can for yourself and burn all in your path. America... fuck yeah. Alright. Suit yourself.

To reiterate the point the niteowl made. This is just like saying "it's unconstitutional for the government to force your kids to go to school." This is just like saying, "if someone can't afford education for their children, then too bad." This is just like saying, "why should I have to pay for someone elses kids to go to school." :shrug:

Once again, here is the answer: Just like healthcare, access to education is a human right. 

I guess there is just nothing more to be said.

Quote:

Tangerines said:Yea, I'm an asshole.



QFT


--------------------
andyistic said:
Ok so let me bring you idiots up to speed.
The admins are tired of this shitfest being made the joke of the weed community on the Internet.

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: TomCollins]
    #388717 - 03/23/10 12:34 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Since when is health care and education a human right?  It's a privilege.  We shouldn't forget that.  Thinking otherwise is taking things for granted.  What's next?  Is driving a car a right? "No child left behind" we should give them all cars.

We can't save everyone and we should not want to save everyone.  And just to clarify I did not grow up in a rich household.  Just an average American household.

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Tangerines]
    #388720 - 03/23/10 12:37 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Tangerines said:
Since when is health care and education a human right?  It's a privilege.  We shouldn't forget that.  Thinking otherwise is taking things for granted.  What's next?  Is driving a car a right? "No child left behind" we should give them all cars.

We can't save everyone and we should not want to save everyone.  And just to clarify I did not grow up in a rich household.  Just an average American household.



Every other western country has advanced to the point where it is a right...

What do you have against progress?


--------------------
ltd said:
fgts just don't understand

keep the shit

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Doitagain]
    #388722 - 03/23/10 12:40 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Just because every other western nation has done it does not mean it is progress...

America is not "every other western country"... why do we have to play follow the leader?

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Tangerines]
    #388725 - 03/23/10 12:47 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Tangerines said:
Since when is health care and education a human right?  It's a privilege.  We shouldn't forget that.  Thinking otherwise is taking things for granted. 




No it's a right. Everyone should have access to education. Just like everyone should have access to food and clean water. A child born in Nigeria should have the same chances that a child born in America has.

Quote:

Tangerines said:What's next?  Is driving a car a right? "No child left behind" we should give them all cars.




A car is not necessary to sustain life. Education, access to medical aid, food and clean water all are.

Quote:

Tangerines said:We can't save everyone and we should not want to save everyone.



Nope you definitely can't save EVERYONE. This isn't about saving people, it's about giving the helpless and severely poor a chance.

Quote:

Tangerines said:And just to clarify I did not grow up in a rich household.  Just an average American household.




What does this have to do with anything? Your still extremely lucky and wealthy in my perspective. Your incredibly lucky at least compared to me.

Quote:

Tangerines said:
America is not "every other western country"... why do we have to play follow the leader?




Your country is not playing follow the leader. There are apparently a large number of people in your government that would like to see the United States become a civilized country.


--------------------
andyistic said:
Ok so let me bring you idiots up to speed.
The admins are tired of this shitfest being made the joke of the weed community on the Internet.

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Tangerines]
    #388726 - 03/23/10 12:51 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Tangerines said:
Just because every other western nation has done it does not mean it is progress...




no the fact that every other western nation has done it does not mean it is progress, the fact that every other western nation is able to provide healthcare for all it's citizens means its progress, and now we will too means its progress.


--------------------
ltd said:
fgts just don't understand

keep the shit

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: TomCollins]
    #388727 - 03/23/10 12:51 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

The only reason I seem wealthy is because my people worked their asses off to get to where we are. If people would actually put forth some effort and work to the bone they could afford the nice things in life.

Also, education is not needed to sustain life.

People do not have the right to take my money for their own use.  That is what it comes down to for me.  I have to foot the bill for people that I do not even know.  I'd rather save the money and use it for when my family needs it.  But no I can't do that anymore.

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Doitagain]
    #388728 - 03/23/10 12:53 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Doitagain said:
Quote:

Tangerines said:
Just because every other western nation has done it does not mean it is progress...




no the fact that every other western nation has done it does not mean it is progress, the fact that every other western nation is able to provide healthcare for all it's citizens means its progress, and now we will too means its progress.





Yes it will provide healthcare for many people but at what expense?  Where is all the money going to come from?

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Tangerines]
    #388729 - 03/23/10 12:56 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Tangerines said:
Quote:

Doitagain said:
Quote:

Tangerines said:
Just because every other western nation has done it does not mean it is progress...




no the fact that every other western nation has done it does not mean it is progress, the fact that every other western nation is able to provide healthcare for all it's citizens means its progress, and now we will too means its progress.





Yes it will provide healthcare for many people but at what expense?  Where is all the money going to come from?



you have to realize the actual cost of health-care is a lot lower than the practical cost of health-care as the system is now.

You have to pay a premium so pharmaceutical and biomedical companies make obscene profits, also you will be paying for other people's health care but you are not likely to even notice the tax burden and they will also be paying for yours so it works out.


--------------------
ltd said:
fgts just don't understand

keep the shit

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Doitagain]
    #388730 - 03/23/10 01:01 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

I don't want anyone to pay for my health care though.  I'll still go the private route.

Health care cost so much because doctors have to pay extreme insurance payments.  We need Tort Reform...ie get rid of the bullshit lawsuits.  That would lower health care costs.  What we are doing now is not going to work.  I know people in the UK that have to wait in obscene lines at the doctor because they are overburdened.

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Tangerines]
    #388731 - 03/23/10 01:03 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Tangerines said:
The only reason I seem wealthy is because my people worked their asses off to get to where we are. If people would actually put forth some effort and work to the bone they could afford the nice things in life.




You have a very distorted and simple way of looking at things. Try and understand, some people cannot even work. I've said this several times before. Some people are incapable of working because of injury, sickness, condition, etc.

Go tell the laid off factory worker, "you know, if you actually would have put some effort into your work, you could afford health care."

Go tell the financially independent college student "you know, if you actually worked harder you could afford health care."

Go tell the quadriplegic veteran that if he "put some more back into it, he could afford some new prosthetic arms!"

Go tell the child born in Mogadishu "ya know, if you work hard you can afford nice things! Like me!"

I really don't know what to say to you anymore. It seems that your beliefs are quite radical.

Quote:

Tangerines said:Also, education is not needed to sustain life.




Try getting a job when you can't read or write. To sustain ones own life in the Western world, one needs an education to work. This is fact.

Quote:

Tangerines said:People do not have the right to take my money for their own use.  That is what it comes down to for me.  I have to foot the bill for people that I do not even know.  I'd rather save the money and use it for when my family needs it.  But no I can't do that anymore.




If you went to public school, you mooched off someone else too. Sorry buddy, but you've benefited from the same kind of system. Stop pretending you've worked for everything you have and you've earned everything you've gotten.

Quote:

Tangerines said:
I don't want anyone to pay for my health care though.  I'll still go the private route.




If you can afford that then you are evidently a very privileged person and shouldn't even be debating this.


--------------------
andyistic said:
Ok so let me bring you idiots up to speed.
The admins are tired of this shitfest being made the joke of the weed community on the Internet.

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: TomCollins]
    #388736 - 03/23/10 01:10 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Go tell the laid off factory worker, "you know, if you actually would have put some effort into your work, you could afford health care."




Hey you are probably getting unemployment payments.  That should hold you off until you find another job.

Quote:

Go tell the financially independent college student "you know, if you actually worked harder you could afford health care."




Hey college friend.  Good thing that in order to even attend this college we must have health insurance.  The school even has a cost friendly plan for students who have no other options.

Quote:

Go tell the quadriplegic veteran that if he "put some more back into it, he could afford some new prosthetic arms!"




Hey thanks for your service.  Good thing our country takes care of vets and give them money for the rest of their lives if need be.  The government will buy you your plastic arm no doubt about that.


Quote:

Go tell the child born in Mogadishu "ya know, if you work hard you can afford nice things! Like me!"




Hey child.  Don't work because I do not condone child labor like Spency does.



Also, I was home schooled and now go to a major public university.  I took loans out in order to pay for it.  When I graduate I will get a job and pay the loans off.  Sorry I have no sympathy.  Sure the new health care will help out some people that actually need it, but like Welfare the majority of people will abuse the shit out of it.  Lazy people come to mind.

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: TomCollins]
    #388738 - 03/23/10 01:11 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

yeah the midwest is gonna have a hard time with this one because they still think in lock-step with the republican party line, but the fact is this isa good thing and the beenfits will become apparent to all in a few years.

Also tang liability costs are only part of the reason for high costs of health-care, far more of a problem is the major pharmaceutical and biomedical companies, and the high costs of prescriptin drugs. 

Major corporatons should not be making billions in profit off people's suffering, healthcare should not be a for profit venture.

Right now the healthcare companies have far more of an incentive to make a drug that you need to take forever, instead of a treatment that will cure you permanently after a month, one makes them more money.


--------------------
ltd said:
fgts just don't understand

keep the shit

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Doitagain]
    #388739 - 03/23/10 01:13 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

If there was no profit involved in medicine then the medicine that people take would never have been developed.  You forget that.  It takes years and years of testing for a drug to come to the market.  You think that is free?  you think the thousands of scientists in the R&D work for free?

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Doitagain]
    #388744 - 03/23/10 01:20 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Doitagain said:
Quote:

DieselB said:
Sorry, but a lot of you guys need to wake up and smell the java.. I don't even know where to begin.. How about Obama PROMISING bipartisan support, and the only bipartisanship is dems and repubs voting against it! Obama PROMISED complete trasparency. He delivered nan.. Instead you got Pelosi up there telling us that (paraphrasing) "We can't find out whats in the bill till we vote it in, its so special, its a surprise!"

I don't like surprises from my government, how about you, do you really feel comfortable with the rate government is growing? They have done nothing but fuck up continually on both sides, now they control 1/6th of the economy!? We're already goin' down the toilet.

Europe is doing so great, huh? Why? because they have better pot laws? Their healthcare sucks, you tell me whats better when it comes to ANYTHING, the free version or the pay version.. Remember, "You get what you pay for"?

Dems are gonna regret this come november, mark my words.

And no, I'm not some sour repub. I am a proud American that can't believe his eyes, one that's starting to be not so proud, one that's fearing for his countries destruction. Everyday we go deeper into debt, not long ago Sec. Clinton was in China begging them to keep buying our debt, they're gonna realize we're not gonna be able to pay it back, they're gonna drop our debt... You think the past little while has been a recession, some say DEPRESSION. You've seen nothing yet.




bro it's absolutely clear that you have no idea what the fuck you are talking about, and are just spouting your mouth off and  you're clearly influenced by the great american delusion that we must be the best at everything.

It's clear you've probably never left your country, so i will let you in on a secret.  The system works, period.  The united states does not have better health-care than Israel, Australia, Germany pretty much any 1st world western nation has the system in place and it works better than ours.

In Israel the quality of health-care i received was every bit as good as it was when I was insured here.  Health-care doesn't need to cost nearly as much as it does to be good, the main reason it is so costly is because of the massive amounts of profits made by pharmaceutical and biomedical companies, this is an issue that needs addressed.

you may very well find yourself losing your job someday or in a situation that would have left you w/o healthcare.  When you get sick and get treatment for it you will thank the dems for getting this through.




You telegraph ignorance by your uncalled for remarks, insults, and contradicting yourself in the same post, which I bolded for you in case you didn't notice. If I'm just spouting off and "don't know what the fuck I'm talking about" why are you getting mad? Show these people some facts that I don't know what I'm talking about.

How about I give you a fact that YOU don't know what you're talking about? I have been out of work for two years because of two hurniated discs in my back.. Most days I can't hardly get out of bed, I have no insurance, can't get medicaid, or any kinda help except the occasional ER visit for some BS pain med, when it's so bad I wanna blow my damn brains out. Guess what!? I'm still not for this health care bill. I don't want a damn hand out! Instead I'm living like shit for the past two years to hustle, scrimp, and scrape by and save a few bucks so I can start my own business and take care of my own problems. Which I may add that I'm only a few months away from starting. The rest of the country doesn't deserve to pay for my problems when they have problems of their own they can't handle. It is most certainly not the governments job to tell them otherwise, either!

We already have states doing this, it's not working for them, they are losing money.. Going bankrupt.. You're right though, we should make sure the whole country feels that pain. Maybe then people will wake up, but guess what? Its gonna be too late.

I really give a damn about any other countries working "system", and it's not because I think America is the best, it's because our current system does not permit us to implement the same measures they have. It's all good though, I'm not mad.. I don't come on the Growery to cry about politics, I just felt compelled to try and help some people to see through the non-sense.

Just for the record, I harbor no ill-will against any of you for your beliefs.. Like I said, just wanted to give people a different perspective, this thing seemed kinda one sided to me, thats all.


--------------------
If you ain't smokin' dro, you're smokin' reggie. :shrug:

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Tangerines]
    #388745 - 03/23/10 01:20 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Tangerines said:
If there was no profit involved in medicine then the medicine that people take would never have been developed.  You forget that.  It takes years and years of testing for a drug to come to the market.  You think that is free?  you think the thousands of scientists in the R&D work for free?



true but by government regulation of the pricing strucutre of pharmaceuticals it ensures we are paying a fair price that will both fund the r & D of new drugs, and keep the pharmaceutical companies from making these obscene products.  Pump all the profits back into health-care system and not into the pockets of the titans of industry.

I'm a capitalist through and through, but when it comes to healthcare the system just works.  I've seen it firsthand, whereas you have not.


--------------------
ltd said:
fgts just don't understand

keep the shit

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Doitagain]
    #388747 - 03/23/10 01:22 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Seeing it means nothing.  You can see anything through the internet.  I know people who live in the UK, Germany, and Spain who have explained to me how it is.  I don't have to be in the country to be able to form an opinion.

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Tangerines]
    #388748 - 03/23/10 01:22 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Tangerines said:Also, I was home schooled




:facepalm: It is clear your homeschooling was poor.

Quote:

Tangerines said:
Go tell the laid off factory worker, "you know, if you actually would have put some effort into your work, you could afford health care."




Hey you are probably getting unemployment payments.  That should hold you off until you find another job.

Unemployment runs out and doesn't cover health insurance. :shrug:

Quote:

Tangerines said:Hey college friend.  Good thing that in order to even attend this college we must have health insurance.




Nail on the head buddy! Good job!:thumbup:

Quote:

Tangerines said:Hey thanks for your service.  Good thing our country takes care of vets and give them money for the rest of their lives if need be.  The government will buy you your plastic arm no doubt about that.




http://www.nchv.org/background.cfm Please read this. It's sad that a European has to help an American understand what's happening in his country.

Here's a quote:
Quote:

In addition to the complex set of factors influencing all homelessness – extreme shortage of affordable housing, livable income and access to health care – a large number of displaced and at-risk veterans live with lingering effects of post-traumatic stress disorder (PTSD) and substance abuse, which are compounded by a lack of family and social support networks.




Quote:

Tangerines said: Hey child.  Don't work because I do not condone child labor like Spency does.




I didn't say that. Plus you wouldn't care anyway would you?

Quote:

Tangerines said:I took loans out in order to pay for it.  When I graduate I will get a job and pay the loans off.




This has nothing to do with anything.

Quote:

Tangerines said:Sorry I have no sympathy.  Sure the new health care will help out some people that actually need it, but like Welfare the majority of people will abuse the shit out of it.




Please explain? How can you abuse your health care if your paying the taxes for it?

Quote:

Tangerines said:Lazy people come to mind.




Like nice rich people like you.

Quote:

Tangerines said:
You can see anything through the internet.




Ignorance is incredible.


--------------------
andyistic said:
Ok so let me bring you idiots up to speed.
The admins are tired of this shitfest being made the joke of the weed community on the Internet.

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OfflineTangerines
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: TomCollins]
    #388750 - 03/23/10 01:25 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

How am I rich?  I am far from rich you judgemental prick. Just because I do not want socialized health care does not mean I am rich. Your argument is stupid.  I know plenty of vets who get everything paid for them.  EVERYTHING.

Are you seriously going to sit and call me rich and lazy? :picard:


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OfflineTangerines
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: TomCollins]
    #388751 - 03/23/10 01:27 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

How am I ignorant?  because I have spent many hours talking on the phone with people from Germany, UK, and Spain?

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InvisibleFurrowedBrowM
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Tangerines]
    #388752 - 03/23/10 01:31 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

I am AMAZED at the amount of effort and blind passion you all have put into the argument.  :facepalm:


--------------------





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The Growery's Herb Museum (post #24)
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OfflineTangerines
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: TomCollins]
    #388753 - 03/23/10 01:32 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Good post.  Glad you could contribute your absolute worthlessness to this thread.

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OfflineTomCollins


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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Tangerines]
    #388755 - 03/23/10 01:34 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Tangerines said:Nice edit.

Here is what Spency wrote...last line of his post.
Quote:

Like nice rich people like you.








Umm.... it's still there buddy... just scroll up a bit.


Quote:

Tangerines said:
How am I rich?  I am far from rich you judgemental prick. Just because I do not want socialized health care does not mean I am rich.




If you plan to pay for private health insurance I'd say your better off than about 90% of the world. Why are you getting so upset over this anyway.

Lol, your telling me my arguments are stupid when you attempt to mock me with such quotes as "Beer is a human right." Wow man, your mind blowing. Homeschooling did not help at all!

Quote:

Tangerines said:I know plenty of vets who get everything paid for them.  EVERYTHING.




This is what's wrong with your logic. You go only by what you see. In reality things are different. Please read.

I see you still haven't read that article... *sigh* here you go again. From that same website I posted.
Quote:

Veteran-specific highlights from the USICH report include:
23% of the homeless population are veterans
33% of the male homeless population are veterans





Quote:

Tangerines said:
Good post.  Glad you could contribute your absolute worthlessness to this thread.




Are you talking to FB or me?

In any case, I can see your upset and I apologies for this. I didn't mean to make you angry or offend you, I'm just voicing my opinion on the matter.


--------------------
andyistic said:
Ok so let me bring you idiots up to speed.
The admins are tired of this shitfest being made the joke of the weed community on the Internet.

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InvisibleFurrowedBrowM
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Tangerines]
    #388756 - 03/23/10 01:36 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Tangerines said:
Good post.  Glad you could contribute your absolute worthlessness to this thread.




right back atcha!


--------------------





Multidisciplinary Association for Psychedelic Studies - Become a member!
The Growery's Herb Museum (post #24)
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~ Thomas Jefferson ~

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: TomCollins]
    #388757 - 03/23/10 01:37 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

The beer thing was a joke dude.  If you are taking the internet that seriously where you believe every word then you probably need to utilize that social medicine and check yourself in to a psych ward.

Those stats are lame man.  If they are even reliable, most of them are homeless because they choose to ignore help.  There are plenty of ways to get help if they wanted it.  I have hung out with a lot of homeless people and have heard it all.

I'm far from upset.  If you think I get upset over the internet you are sadly mistaken.  You on the otherhand obviously are pretty upset judging by the rating you keep editing for me. :smirk:

It's funny.

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Tangerines]
    #388758 - 03/23/10 01:38 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Everyone chill out and go smoke a bowl, we are all here for what we have in common, we like to.. Well you already know that. We are something like colleagues and should be treating each other as such.


--------------------
If you ain't smokin' dro, you're smokin' reggie. :shrug:

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OfflineDoitagain
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: TomCollins]
    #388759 - 03/23/10 01:39 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

both of you quit your bitching, i have seen the promised land and socialized beer does exist.  Go to a kibbutz in Israel, and the beers at the pub are 1.50 for a 22 oz Tuborg Red (beats pretty much any american beer including most microbrews here)

Until it actually comes into place and the effects are made clear we're all just speculating so no need to take it so seriously.

both you 2 need a beer


--------------------
ltd said:
fgts just don't understand

keep the shit

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OfflineTangerines
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Doitagain]
    #388760 - 03/23/10 01:41 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

I'm already 3 ahead of you. :cheers:

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OfflineTomCollins


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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Tangerines]
    #388762 - 03/23/10 01:43 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Tangerines said:
The beer thing was a joke dude.  If you are taking the internet that seriously where you believe every word then you probably need to utilize that social medicine and check yourself in to a psych ward.




Oh no don't get me wrong, I don't. It was obviously a pun at me but the joke made you look like a bit of a tool imo.

Quote:

Tangerines said:Those stats are lame man.




Who are you exactly?

Quote:

Tangerines said:If they are even reliable, most of them are homeless because they choose to ignore help.  There are plenty of ways to get help if they wanted it.




Alright here you go again...

Quote:

In addition to the complex set of factors influencing all homelessness – extreme shortage of affordable housing, livable income and access to health care – a large number of displaced and at-risk veterans live with lingering effects of post-traumatic stress disorder (PTSD) and substance abuse, which are compounded by a lack of family and social support networks.




http://www.nchv.org/background.cfm

It's a big lie by the government right?

Quote:

Tangerines said:
I'm far from upset.  If you think I get upset over the internet you are sadly mistaken.  You on the otherhand obviously are pretty upset judging by the rating you keep editing for me. :smirk:

It's funny.




Wow I apologized to you man, what's wrong with you.


Quote:

Tangerines said:You on the otherhand obviously are pretty upset judging by the rating you keep editing for me. :smirk:

It's funny.




Oh no not at all, you are very sadly mistaken - this has been a laughing fit to say the least!

In any case, I've come to learn that there is someone who will disagree with me no matter what. Even if it defies all logic.

I can't see how you weren't upset considering you gave me a bad rating over a health care reform debate. :facepalm::lmafo:

I originally gave you a 5 for your rating. So I guess initially I couldn't have been that upset. The other two edits haaad to go in though. No one should miss either of those two quotes.


--------------------
andyistic said:
Ok so let me bring you idiots up to speed.
The admins are tired of this shitfest being made the joke of the weed community on the Internet.

Edited by TomCollins (03/23/10 01:53 PM)

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OfflineDoitagain
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Tangerines]
    #388763 - 03/23/10 01:44 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Tangerines said:
I'm already 3 ahead of you. :cheers:



nice, LOL.  I'm just waiting for my hook to pick up today, so i can go grab a zip of coasty nugs.


--------------------
ltd said:
fgts just don't understand

keep the shit

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OfflineTangerines
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: TomCollins]
    #388766 - 03/23/10 01:53 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

:yawn:
yea just because someone disagrees with you means they have no logic.  The bottom line is I do not want to foot the bill for other people.  I'd rather save the money myself and use it for my family. :shrug: I guess that is too much to ask for.

I gave you a bad rating because you did not have any bad ratings.  No one should have perfect ratings. This is serious business.

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Tangerines]
    #388767 - 03/23/10 01:57 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Tangerines said:
:yawn:
yea just because someone disagrees with you means they have no logic.




I made a general statement. Please don't twist my words.


Quote:

Tangerines said:The bottom line is I do not want to foot the bill for other people.  I'd rather save the money myself and use it for my family. :shrug: I guess that is too much to ask for.




No it's not and your totally entitled to your opinion and your beliefs. But lol jesus christ man, take a chillpill next time.

Quote:

Tangerines said:I gave you a bad rating because you did not have any bad ratings.




lol, uh-huh. Keep talking. :bonghit:


--------------------
andyistic said:
Ok so let me bring you idiots up to speed.
The admins are tired of this shitfest being made the joke of the weed community on the Internet.

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OfflineTangerines
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: TomCollins]
    #388769 - 03/23/10 01:58 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

You have no room to tell me to take a chill pill haha we both went on tangents for no reason.

but yea the rating...no one can have perfect ones.

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OfflineTomCollins


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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Tangerines]
    #388772 - 03/23/10 02:01 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Tangerines said:
You have no room to tell me to take a chill pill haha we both went on tangents for no reason.




:facepalm::lmafo: Wow man.


--------------------
andyistic said:
Ok so let me bring you idiots up to speed.
The admins are tired of this shitfest being made the joke of the weed community on the Internet.

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InvisibleHarry_Ba11sachM
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Tangerines]
    #388773 - 03/23/10 02:05 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

you're a fuckin' weird one tang......


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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Harry_Ba11sach]
    #388776 - 03/23/10 02:12 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

:blah:

I quit chill pills anyways.

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Doitagain]
    #388777 - 03/23/10 02:12 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Doitagain said:
Quote:

Doitagain said:
Quote:

Triptonic said:
I never said I didnt support it, it just seems like a waste of money right now. How about him trying to find jobs for the millions of people out of work right now. Then worry about healthcare. I think he just hasnt thought it out quite enough.



lol yeah he should just write a law that creates jobs for all the unemployed people, and then he can write another law that ends the war in Iraq.

cause presidents totally have the power to do all that shit. :bucktoothfattygangsta:






Yes he has the power to create jobs god you are dumb. Presidents before him did it. How do you think we have the hoover dam and such.

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OfflineTangerines
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Triptonic]
    #388779 - 03/23/10 02:13 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Yea FDR created a bunch of jobs.

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OfflineDoitagain
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Triptonic]
    #388782 - 03/23/10 02:15 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Triptonic said:
Quote:

Doitagain said:
Quote:

Doitagain said:
Quote:

Triptonic said:
I never said I didnt support it, it just seems like a waste of money right now. How about him trying to find jobs for the millions of people out of work right now. Then worry about healthcare. I think he just hasnt thought it out quite enough.



lol yeah he should just write a law that creates jobs for all the unemployed people, and then he can write another law that ends the war in Iraq.

cause presidents totally have the power to do all that shit. :bucktoothfattygangsta:






Yes he has the power to create jobs god you are dumb. Presidents before him did it. How do you think we have the hoover dam and such.



Quote:

The first attempt to gain Congressional approval for construction of Boulder Dam came in 1922 with the introduction of two bills in the House of Representatives and the Senate. The bills were introduced by Congressman Phil D. Swing and Senator Hiram W. Johnson and were known as the Swing-Johnson bills. The bills failed to come up for a vote and were subsequently reintroduced several times. In December 1928, both the House and the Senate finally approved the bill and sent it to the President for approval. On December 21, 1928, President Calvin Coolidge signed the bill approving the Boulder Canyon Project. The initial appropriation for construction was made in July 1930, by which time Herbert Hoover had become President.




Lol, all he has the power to do is sign or veto bills, and control the army.  There are others but those are the main 2.


--------------------
ltd said:
fgts just don't understand

keep the shit

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OfflineDoitagain
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Tangerines]
    #388786 - 03/23/10 02:18 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Tangerines said:
Yea FDR created a bunch of jobs.



Quote:

The New Deal was a series of economic programs passed by Congress during the first term of Franklin D. Roosevelt, 32nd President of the United States, from 1933 to his reelection in 1937. Few new programs were enacted after 1936, and many agencies were disbanded during World War II. The programs were responses to the Great Depression, and focused on what historians call the 3 Rs: relief, recovery and reform.




no all he did was sign the bills.


--------------------
ltd said:
fgts just don't understand

keep the shit

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InvisibleTriptonic
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Doitagain]
    #388788 - 03/23/10 02:19 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Yes and if he didnt there wouldnt be any jobs. +1 for me.

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OfflineTangerines
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Doitagain]
    #388789 - 03/23/10 02:19 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

He was a major proponent though.  Presidents can create bills that would otherwise never be created beccause no one would have thought of it or had the balls to create it. If that makes sense.

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Triptonic]
    #388845 - 03/23/10 03:24 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Triptonic said:
Yes and if he didnt there wouldnt be any jobs. +1 for me.



no you still fail cause obama can't sign any job-creation bills until they are sent to him, it's honestly frightening triptonic how little you understand our government considering you had the same us public school education as i did. 

You people are seriously over-estimating the power the president has to fix our economy, it's one thing when the legislature is cooperative but it's not and bitterly divided, the sore-loser republicans are opposing every bit of progress the dems try to make.  Roosevelt had the support of the new-deal coalition.

Roosevelt served over 12 years as pres, obama hasn't gotten through 2 yet so cool ur jets ppl.
Especially you trip, you seem to just be repeating the prevailing midwestern ideology because you clearly do not understand our political system at all.

I'm literally embarassed for you, and how uninformed you make yourself look in this thread, at least Tang makes some good points, i disagree with him but i know he has a shred of understanding about how things work. 

You however are just running your mouth about things you don't understand, but with an arrogant certitude that is completely unwarranted for your level of ignorance.


--------------------
ltd said:
fgts just don't understand

keep the shit

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InvisibleTriptonic
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Doitagain]
    #388862 - 03/23/10 03:46 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Doitagain said:
Quote:

Triptonic said:
Yes and if he didnt there wouldnt be any jobs. +1 for me.



no you still fail cause obama can't sign any job-creation bills until they are sent to him, it's honestly frightening triptonic how little you understand our government considering you had the same us public school education as i did. 

You people are seriously over-estimating the power the president has to fix our economy, it's one thing when the legislature is cooperative but it's not and bitterly divided, the sore-loser republicans are opposing every bit of progress the dems try to make.  Roosevelt had the support of the new-deal coalition.

Roosevelt served over 12 years as pres, obama hasn't gotten through 2 yet so cool ur jets ppl.
Especially you trip, you seem to just be repeating the prevailing midwestern ideology because you clearly do not understand our political system at all.

I'm literally embarassed for you, and how uninformed you make yourself look in this thread, at least Tang makes some good points, i disagree with him but i know he has a shred of understanding about how things work. 

You however are just running your mouth about things you don't understand, but with an arrogant certitude that is completely unwarranted for your level of ignorance.



Dude midwestern public schools are way better than yours. Its ok though you can think what you want, you are clearly wrong.
Thats why you take the ITBS out there in california, its called the Iowa test of basic skills.

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OfflineThebooedocksaint
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: DieselB]
    #388864 - 03/23/10 03:59 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

DieselB said:
Sorry, but a lot of you guys need to wake up and smell the java.. I don't even know where to begin.. How about Obama PROMISING bipartisan support, and the only bipartisanship is dems and repubs voting against it! Obama PROMISED complete trasparency. He delivered nan.. Instead you got Pelosi up there telling us that (paraphrasing) "We can't find out whats in the bill till we vote it in, its so special, its a surprise!"

I don't like surprises from my government, how about you, do you really feel comfortable with the rate government is growing? They have done nothing but fuck up continually on both sides, now they control 1/6th of the economy!? We're already goin' down the toilet.

Europe is doing so great, huh? Why? because they have better pot laws? Their healthcare sucks, you tell me whats better when it comes to ANYTHING, the free version or the pay version.. Remember, "You get what you pay for"?

Dems are gonna regret this come november, mark my words.

And no, I'm not some sour repub. I am a proud American that can't believe his eyes, one that's starting to be not so proud, one that's fearing for his countries destruction. Everyday we go deeper into debt, not long ago Sec. Clinton was in China begging them to keep buying our debt, they're gonna realize we're not gonna be able to pay it back, they're gonna drop our debt... You think the past little while has been a recession, some say DEPRESSION. You've seen nothing yet.




To bad chinas economy required us to buy from them, if we stop paying THEY go into recession. And then the rest of the world.


--------------------
"Je pense, donc je suis (I am thinking, therefore I am)." -Rene Descartes

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OfflineThebooedocksaint
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Tangerines]
    #388868 - 03/23/10 04:10 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Tangerines said:
So now if my grandfather cannot afford the increase he is just SOL?  Fuck you man.  It's not like he is rich or anything.  Just a poor old man who now won't be able to afford his own health care because he has to pay for others.

This is just going to increase taxes to pay for this shit.  Our country was pretty much FOUNDED because we disliked heavy taxes.  :picard:




1. The top 5% of the country pays most of the taxes, unless your grandpa is in the top 5% I'd say hes not doing to bad.

2. This bill improves Medicare Services.

3. out country was FOUNDED because we wanted representation with taxation. The MAJORITY of Americans that want public healthcare wanted it, so the MAJORITY of representation voted it in.

All the statistics that say that so many Americans don't want this bill, a lot (read: most) of those Americans think it isn't LIBERAL ENOUGH.

Quote:

Tangerines said:

And it is unconstitutional to force people to have health insurance.  If I do not want health insurance I should not be forced to have it.  That is fucked up man.





Really, health isn't part of Life, Liberty, and The Pursuit of Happiness?

I'd say its unconstitutional NOT to have everyone with health insurance.


--------------------
"Je pense, donc je suis (I am thinking, therefore I am)." -Rene Descartes

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OfflineDoitagain
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Triptonic]
    #388869 - 03/23/10 04:13 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Triptonic said:
Quote:

Doitagain said:
Quote:

Triptonic said:
Yes and if he didnt there wouldnt be any jobs. +1 for me.



no you still fail cause obama can't sign any job-creation bills until they are sent to him, it's honestly frightening triptonic how little you understand our government considering you had the same us public school education as i did. 

You people are seriously over-estimating the power the president has to fix our economy, it's one thing when the legislature is cooperative but it's not and bitterly divided, the sore-loser republicans are opposing every bit of progress the dems try to make.  Roosevelt had the support of the new-deal coalition.

Roosevelt served over 12 years as pres, obama hasn't gotten through 2 yet so cool ur jets ppl.
Especially you trip, you seem to just be repeating the prevailing midwestern ideology because you clearly do not understand our political system at all.

I'm literally embarassed for you, and how uninformed you make yourself look in this thread, at least Tang makes some good points, i disagree with him but i know he has a shred of understanding about how things work. 

You however are just running your mouth about things you don't understand, but with an arrogant certitude that is completely unwarranted for your level of ignorance.



Dude midwestern public schools are way better than yours. Its ok though you can think what you want, you are clearly wrong.
Thats why you take the ITBS out there in california, its called the Iowa test of basic skills.



Trip i have to question if you even know what you are saying when you post on here, we don't take the Iowa standardized tests in california we have our own system and it's called STAR.  Are you really dumb enough to assume that because you took the Iowa standardized tests (in Iowa) that every other state uses the same test?

Seriously bro think before you post something on here and anyways I wasn't trying to say that midwestern public schools are bad.  I am sure they are fine, I am saying that we both had a US Public school education so we should both know essentially how our government works.

Quote:

Triptonic said:
Yes he has the power to create jobs god you are dumb. Presidents before him did it. How do you think we have the hoover dam and such.




The above statement shows clearly that you lack an understanding of the frame-work of our government, I'm not calling your school system out for not teaching you that, I'm saying that they definitely would have taught you and you were just too thick to pick up on it.


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ltd said:
fgts just don't understand

keep the shit

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OfflineThebooedocksaint
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Triptonic]
    #388870 - 03/23/10 04:13 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Triptonic said:
Quote:

Doitagain said:
Quote:

Doitagain said:
Quote:

Triptonic said:
I never said I didnt support it, it just seems like a waste of money right now. How about him trying to find jobs for the millions of people out of work right now. Then worry about healthcare. I think he just hasnt thought it out quite enough.



lol yeah he should just write a law that creates jobs for all the unemployed people, and then he can write another law that ends the war in Iraq.

cause presidents totally have the power to do all that shit. :bucktoothfattygangsta:






Yes he has the power to create jobs god you are dumb. Presidents before him did it. How do you think we have the hoover dam and such.




We passed a bill, not an executive action.

Because Presidents can't pass a bill alone :thumbup:


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OfflineThebooedocksaint
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Triptonic]
    #388871 - 03/23/10 04:16 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Triptonic said:
Quote:

Doitagain said:
Quote:

Triptonic said:
Yes and if he didnt there wouldnt be any jobs. +1 for me.



no you still fail cause obama can't sign any job-creation bills until they are sent to him, it's honestly frightening triptonic how little you understand our government considering you had the same us public school education as i did. 

You people are seriously over-estimating the power the president has to fix our economy, it's one thing when the legislature is cooperative but it's not and bitterly divided, the sore-loser republicans are opposing every bit of progress the dems try to make.  Roosevelt had the support of the new-deal coalition.

Roosevelt served over 12 years as pres, obama hasn't gotten through 2 yet so cool ur jets ppl.
Especially you trip, you seem to just be repeating the prevailing midwestern ideology because you clearly do not understand our political system at all.

I'm literally embarassed for you, and how uninformed you make yourself look in this thread, at least Tang makes some good points, i disagree with him but i know he has a shred of understanding about how things work. 

You however are just running your mouth about things you don't understand, but with an arrogant certitude that is completely unwarranted for your level of ignorance.



Dude midwestern public schools are way better than yours. Its ok though you can think what you want, you are clearly wrong.
Thats why you take the ITBS out there in california, its called the Iowa test of basic skills.




False, Midwestern schools suck.

They teach how to take a test well though, I suppose most people around here need to learn how to pass a test without knowing the test info.

I mean look trip, you went through it. :feelsgoodman:


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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Thebooedocksaint]
    #388872 - 03/23/10 04:16 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

I disagree.

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Thebooedocksaint]
    #388873 - 03/23/10 04:18 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

If the world hadn't made itself so dickwet over money, most of the problems we have nowadays could be avoided.

And Trip, creating jobs doesn't mean you just sign a piece of fucking paper and magically there's jobs the next day.


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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Doitagain]
    #388874 - 03/23/10 04:20 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Doitagain said:
Quote:

Triptonic said:
Quote:

Doitagain said:
Quote:

Triptonic said:
Yes and if he didnt there wouldnt be any jobs. +1 for me.



no you still fail cause obama can't sign any job-creation bills until they are sent to him, it's honestly frightening triptonic how little you understand our government considering you had the same us public school education as i did. 

You people are seriously over-estimating the power the president has to fix our economy, it's one thing when the legislature is cooperative but it's not and bitterly divided, the sore-loser republicans are opposing every bit of progress the dems try to make.  Roosevelt had the support of the new-deal coalition.

Roosevelt served over 12 years as pres, obama hasn't gotten through 2 yet so cool ur jets ppl.
Especially you trip, you seem to just be repeating the prevailing midwestern ideology because you clearly do not understand our political system at all.

I'm literally embarassed for you, and how uninformed you make yourself look in this thread, at least Tang makes some good points, i disagree with him but i know he has a shred of understanding about how things work. 

You however are just running your mouth about things you don't understand, but with an arrogant certitude that is completely unwarranted for your level of ignorance.



Dude midwestern public schools are way better than yours. Its ok though you can think what you want, you are clearly wrong.
Thats why you take the ITBS out there in california, its called the Iowa test of basic skills.



Trip i have to question if you even know what you are saying when you post on here, we don't take the Iowa standardized tests in california we have our own system and it's called STAR.  Are you really dumb enough to assume that because you took the Iowa standardized tests (in Iowa) that every other state uses the same test?

Seriously bro think before you post something on here and anyways I wasn't trying to say that midwestern public schools are bad.  I am sure they are fine, I am saying that we both had a US Public school education so we should both know essentially how our government works.

Quote:

Triptonic said:
Yes he has the power to create jobs god you are dumb. Presidents before him did it. How do you think we have the hoover dam and such.




The above statement shows clearly that you lack an understanding of the frame-work of our government, I'm not calling your school system out for not teaching you that, I'm saying that they definitely would have taught you and you were just too thick to pick up on it.




--------------------
ltd said:
fgts just don't understand

keep the shit

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Tangerines]
    #388876 - 03/23/10 04:21 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Tangerines said:
I disagree.




And you are allowed to.

I still think you are wrong, but with the feeling being mutual. And with me having already seen all my views stated I will just quote this great post by niteowl.

Quote:

niteowl said:
  1. Insurance companies can no longer impose lifetime coverage limits on your insurance. Never again will you face the risk of getting really sick and then, a few months in, having your insurer tell you "sorry, you've 'run out' of coverage." Almost everyone I've met knows someone who had insurance but got really, really sick (or had a kid get really sick) and ran into a lifetime cap.
  2. If you don't know someone who has run into a lifetime cap, you probably know someone who has run into an annual cap. The use of these will be sharply limited. (They'll be eliminated entirely in 2014.)
  3. Insurers can no longer tell kids with pre-existing conditions that they'll insure them "except for" the pre-existing condition. That's called pre-existing condition exclusion, and it's out the window.
  4. A special, temporary program will help adults with pre-existing conditions get coverage. It expires in 2014, when the health insurance exchanges—basically big "pools" of businesses and individuals—come on-line. That's when all insurers will have to cover everyone, pre-existing condition or not.
  5. Insurance companies can't drop you when you get sick, either—this plan means the end of "rescissions."
  6. You can stay on your parents' insurance until you're 26.
  7. Seniors get $250 towards closing the "donut hole" in their prescription drug coverage. Currently, prescription drug coverage ends once you've spent $2,700 on drugs and it doesn't kick in again until you've spent nearly $6,200. James Ridgeway wrote about the problems with the donut hole for Mother Jones in the September/October 2008 issue. Eventually, the health care reform bill will close the donut hole entirely. The AARP has more on immediate health care benefits for seniors. Next year (i.e. in nine months), 50 percent of the donut hole will be covered.
  8. Medicare's preventive benefits now come with a free visit with your primary care doctor every year to plan out your prevention services. And there are no more co-pays for preventative services in Medicare.
  9. This is a big one: small businesses get big tax credits—up to 50 percent of premium costs—for offering health insurance to their workers.
  10. Insurers with unusually high administrative costs have to offer rebates to their customers, and every insurance company has to reveal how much it spends on overhead.




To mean that spells.

S-A-V-E-D-B-Y-T-H-E-G-O-V-E-R-N-M-E-N-T

Socialism > Capitalism.

Although I still believe neither extreme is good.


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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: niteowl]
    #388877 - 03/23/10 04:21 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Hit post when I was just getting a quote from a different page of the forum.


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Edited by Thebooedocksaint (03/23/10 04:22 PM)

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Thebooedocksaint]
    #388878 - 03/23/10 04:24 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Capitalism is the shit.  The government should be minimally involved in the affairs of companies.

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Tangerines]
    #388880 - 03/23/10 04:26 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

except in the case of essential services like health-care.


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ltd said:
fgts just don't understand

keep the shit

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Tangerines]
    #388883 - 03/23/10 04:27 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Tangerines said:
Capitalism is the shit.  The government should be minimally involved in the affairs of companies.




Capitalism doesn't give the opportunity for everyone. And Pure Capitalism creates monopolies, monopolies can cause poverty to increase, an increase in poverty can create an increase in loss of life, loss of life can cause social unrest, social unrest can cause riots, riots can cause death, riots/deaths in riots can spark revolution, revolution causes death, revolution leads to a completely new government.

/done


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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Doitagain]
    #388884 - 03/23/10 04:28 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

I don't understand why we are so worried about preserving peoples lives.  There are too many damn people on this rock anyways.

Ya know it used to be you got a disease and you died but now there are all sorts of measures that can be taken to keep the person alive. :nonono:

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Thebooedocksaint]
    #388886 - 03/23/10 04:29 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Thebooedocksaint said:
Quote:

Tangerines said:
Capitalism is the shit.  The government should be minimally involved in the affairs of companies.




Capitalism doesn't give the opportunity for everyone. And Pure Capitalism creates monopolies, monopolies can cause poverty to increase, an increase in poverty can create an increase in loss of life, loss of life can cause social unrest, social unrest can cause riots, riots can cause death, riots/deaths in riots can spark revolution, revolution causes death, revolution leads to a completely new government.

/done





A little extreme there...but I get it.  That is why I said minimal government control.  Like not allowing monopolies.  I never said Pure capitalism you are just putting words in my mouth now. That way everyone has an oppurtunity to start a biz.

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Tangerines]
    #388887 - 03/23/10 04:29 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

not just alive but healthy, at least if we get sick people healthy again they can work.

people who are sick & old though i am all for pulling the plug on


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ltd said:
fgts just don't understand

keep the shit

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Thebooedocksaint]
    #388888 - 03/23/10 04:30 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Thebooedocksaint said:
Quote:

Tangerines said:
Capitalism is the shit.  The government should be minimally involved in the affairs of companies.




Capitalism doesn't give the opportunity for everyone. And Pure Capitalism creates monopolies, monopolies can cause poverty to increase, an increase in poverty can create an increase in loss of life, loss of life can cause social unrest, social unrest can cause riots, riots can cause death, riots/deaths in riots can spark revolution, revolution causes death, revolution leads to a completely new government.

/done




Defcon 3, NAO!


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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Tangerines]
    #388890 - 03/23/10 04:31 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

that's called technological advancement.
we're lengthening the human lifespan.
whereas a few centurys ago people lived only about 40 years or so, now it's closer to 80.
in 50 years age expectancy should be raised to 120.


--------------------

Edited by ShutTheFuckUp (03/23/10 04:36 PM)

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Doitagain]
    #388891 - 03/23/10 04:32 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

That is what I am saying though.  Why keep terminally ill people alive and in a hospital for the next 3 years when they are just going to die in the hospital anyways?  Same with old people.  It should be if you are over 65 and get terminally sick then oh well you lose good night vietnam.

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: ShutTheFuckUp]
    #388892 - 03/23/10 04:32 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

That would be fuckin crazy to have everybody livin to be old as fuck.  The population would skyrocket and that would bring in a whole new cluster of problems.

Welcome to the growery STFU :getstoned:


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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: ShutTheFuckUp]
    #388893 - 03/23/10 04:33 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

ShutTheFuckUp said:
that's called technological advancement.
we're lengthening the human lifespan.
whereas 2000 years ago people lived only about 20 years or so, now it's closer to 80.
in 50 years age expectancy should be raised to 120.





And overpopulation will increase and increase and increase because of it.  Not good in my eyes.

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Tangerines]
    #388894 - 03/23/10 04:33 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Tangerines said:
Quote:

Thebooedocksaint said:
Quote:

Tangerines said:
Capitalism is the shit.  The government should be minimally involved in the affairs of companies.




Capitalism doesn't give the opportunity for everyone. And Pure Capitalism creates monopolies, monopolies can cause poverty to increase, an increase in poverty can create an increase in loss of life, loss of life can cause social unrest, social unrest can cause riots, riots can cause death, riots/deaths in riots can spark revolution, revolution causes death, revolution leads to a completely new government.

/done





A little extreme there...but I get it.  That is why I said minimal government control.  Like not allowing monopolies.  I never said Pure capitalism you are just putting words in my mouth now. That way everyone has an oppurtunity to start a biz.




I didn't say you advocated that much capitalism, just doing my Debate impact death spiral.

In debate you learn pretty much everything can be linked to the complete destruction of mankind, mostly through nuclear holocaust. Shit's like autopilot by now.


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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Tangerines]
    #388897 - 03/23/10 04:34 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Tangerines said:
Quote:

ShutTheFuckUp said:
that's called technological advancement.
we're lengthening the human lifespan.
whereas 2000 years ago people lived only about 20 years or so, now it's closer to 80.
in 50 years age expectancy should be raised to 120.





And overpopulation will increase and increase and increase because of it.  Not good in my eyes.




Hmmm, time to so switch major to hydroponic agricultural engineer?


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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Thebooedocksaint]
    #388898 - 03/23/10 04:35 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Funny you mention that considering it is my major.

What are you doing to help? Nothing I bet.

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Thebooedocksaint]
    #388899 - 03/23/10 04:39 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Thebooedocksaint said:
Quote:

Tangerines said:
Quote:

ShutTheFuckUp said:
that's called technological advancement.
we're lengthening the human lifespan.
whereas 2000 years ago people lived only about 20 years or so, now it's closer to 80.
in 50 years age expectancy should be raised to 120.





And overpopulation will increase and increase and increase because of it.  Not good in my eyes.




Hmmm, time to so switch major to hydroponic agricultural engineer?



not necessarily. methods of preventing child birth should be perfected very soon. overpopulation should fix itself in time. after the economy crumbles and all that


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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Tangerines]
    #388905 - 03/23/10 04:45 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Tangerines said:
I don't understand why we are so worried about preserving peoples lives.  There are too many damn people on this rock anyways.

Ya know it used to be you got a disease and you died but now there are all sorts of measures that can be taken to keep the person alive. :nonono:




If those people are kept in good health they can have more pull their own weight. If you have more people in good health (Read: everyone has the opportunity to get heathcare), you then have more people that can work, less people taking sick days, better attendance in schools, through better attendance better grades.

Splitting here.

Workforce: More people in good health means more production in workplace from less sick days, more people in good health also increases the ammount of people that can seek jobs, and be able to work at them. By increasing production and employable people you can show direct increase in commerce changing hands (Read: Economy).

Education: More children in school, better grades. Less kids being sick for 6+months and failing back a grade. Better productivity through school, from taking less time, means quick womb to work turnover. Better turnover means less money spent to get those children to work.

Education: Grants being easier to get makes education available to the masses. (I won't impact this out as much, pretty much just more educated workers the better)


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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Tangerines]
    #388907 - 03/23/10 04:46 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Tangerines said:
Funny you mention that considering it is my major.

What are you doing to help? Nothing I bet.




Organic chem, going to help people live longer/better/higher. PILLS NIGGA!

But really, is that the correct title for that major? I was just guessing, and if I'm wrong I'd like to know the real term.


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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Thebooedocksaint]
    #388910 - 03/23/10 04:49 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

I hear you on more healthy people, but why do people wanna pull their own weight when the government is gonna pull it for them, by emptying the pockets of those who work hard for it? Come on, if most of America was offered a paycheck to do nothing, how many are gonna stand up and cry that nobody is letting them pull their own weight?


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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Thebooedocksaint]
    #388911 - 03/23/10 04:50 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Well it's more like bio-systems /ag engineer.

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: DieselB]
    #388913 - 03/23/10 04:55 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

DieselB said:
I hear you on more healthy people, but why do people wanna pull their own weight when the government is gonna pull it for them, by emptying the pockets of those who work hard for it? Come on, if most of America was offered a paycheck to do nothing, how many are gonna stand up and cry that nobody is letting them pull their own weight?




Okkk can you please take a stance.

Either A) Complain that everyone is forced to pay taxes, or B) Complain about people getting it free.

I don't know the bill, or the specifics of its funding. But I know some of the taxes, are just applied to insurance companies that have plans over a certain threshold. So they will be paying, with their punishment for having high costs. The higher they charge, they higher the tax I beleive.

I don't want total socialism. So the amount of capitalism that is within the status quo is sufficient to keep people from just living off the government. Those that do solely live off the government, probably had to look up/learn how to, and do certain things to qualify.

(I'm sure there are plenty of unintended loopholes within enough legislature to allow someone(s) to live off uncle sam).


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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Tangerines]
    #388914 - 03/23/10 04:55 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Tangerines said:
Well it's more like bio-systems /ag engineer.




Ok, thanks for that.


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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Thebooedocksaint]
    #389022 - 03/23/10 08:11 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Bahahaha I like how everyone claims I dont know what I'm talking about and no one in here has even read the bill. So Doitagain please explain how you know more about it than I do.

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Tangerines]
    #389036 - 03/23/10 08:23 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

I saw this at the shroomery and thought of you Tang, because it fits you so perfectly

Quote:

supernovasky said:
This is so true guys. For those of you who havent caught this yet:





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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: niteowl]
    #389040 - 03/23/10 08:27 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

I'm not even going to read something that someone on the internet thinks "fits me". Thanks though.

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Triptonic]
    #389051 - 03/23/10 08:37 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

:facepalm:

Im starting to see why so many people around here think you are an idiot

Quote:

niteowl said:
I saw this at the shroomery and thought of you Tang, because it fits you so perfectly




--------------------
The Ego is a pathological condition
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that begins growing in the personality
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: niteowl]
    #389057 - 03/23/10 08:57 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Anyone who thinks I am an idiot is an idiot themselves. I dont care to read something that you think describes me.

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Triptonic]
    #389060 - 03/23/10 09:02 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Triptonic said:
Anyone who thinks I am an idiot is an idiot themselves. I dont care to read something that you think describes me.




are you tang?!  :lol:  but seriously that's a pretty dumb statement.  the former that is.


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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Triptonic]
    #389066 - 03/23/10 09:26 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Triptonic said:
Anyone who thinks I am an idiot is an idiot themselves. I dont care to read something that you think describes me.




I think you just pulled a chillwillis.


--------------------
kickin-two-hundo said:
you know what i did in english class? I came to class stoned out of my mind every day, i chugged vodka in the back of class, i put dead fish in the ceiling tiles. i put a gallon of old milk and orange juice in the file cabinet before winter vacation. i brought snakes in a tied up sweater and let them loose during class. i didnt go to school to learn, i went because i had to. i didnt care, and i didn't fucking listen to that stupid bitch. and i still don't fucking care. i tore the pages out of her books and burned them, and threw away all the books in the class, two books per day.  :twobooks:

Edited by THEBats (03/23/10 09:29 PM)

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Thebooedocksaint]
    #389071 - 03/23/10 09:40 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Thebooedocksaint said:
Quote:

DieselB said:
I hear you on more healthy people, but why do people wanna pull their own weight when the government is gonna pull it for them, by emptying the pockets of those who work hard for it? Come on, if most of America was offered a paycheck to do nothing, how many are gonna stand up and cry that nobody is letting them pull their own weight?




Okkk can you please take a stance.

Either A) Complain that everyone is forced to pay taxes, or B) Complain about people getting it free.

I don't know the bill, or the specifics of its funding. But I know some of the taxes, are just applied to insurance companies that have plans over a certain threshold. So they will be paying, with their punishment for having high costs. The higher they charge, they higher the tax I beleive.

I don't want total socialism. So the amount of capitalism that is within the status quo is sufficient to keep people from just living off the government. Those that do solely live off the government, probably had to look up/learn how to, and do certain things to qualify.

(I'm sure there are plenty of unintended loopholes within enough legislature to allow someone(s) to live off uncle sam).





Do you not understand that tax hikes are part of the free health care deal? How do you think they are gonna pay for it? There's no A and B there. I oppose all of it.


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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: FurrowedBrow]
    #389083 - 03/23/10 10:01 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

FurrowedBrow said:
Quote:

Triptonic said:
Anyone who thinks I am an idiot is an idiot themselves. I dont care to read something that you think describes me.




are you tang?!  :lol:  but seriously that's a pretty dumb statement.  the former that is.



Nah he edited it to just tang.

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Triptonic]
    #389087 - 03/23/10 10:09 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Triptonic said:
Quote:

FurrowedBrow said:
Quote:

Triptonic said:
Anyone who thinks I am an idiot is an idiot themselves. I dont care to read something that you think describes me.




are you tang?!  :lol:  but seriously that's a pretty dumb statement.  the former that is.



Nah he edited it to just tang.




Nope, I replied to tang
and addressed him in the post
so as to prevent any confusion


looks like I failed :facepalm:


--------------------
The Ego is a pathological condition
like a calcareous tumor or cyst
that begins growing in the personality
in the absence of hallucinogenic substances
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: niteowl]
    #389095 - 03/23/10 10:38 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

every admission of failure is a success.  for some people anyway.


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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Triptonic]
    #389096 - 03/23/10 10:43 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Triptonic said:
Bahahaha I like how everyone claims I dont know what I'm talking about and no one in here has even read the bill. So Doitagain please explain how you know more about it than I do.



i'm not talking about the bill, i'm saying you fail at having even the most basic understanding of the structure of our government, never-mind the bill.


--------------------
ltd said:
fgts just don't understand

keep the shit

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Doitagain]
    #389099 - 03/23/10 10:56 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Doitagain said:
Quote:

Triptonic said:
Bahahaha I like how everyone claims I dont know what I'm talking about and no one in here has even read the bill. So Doitagain please explain how you know more about it than I do.



i'm not talking about the bill, i'm saying you fail at having even the most basic understanding of the structure of our government, never-mind the bill.



:rolleyes: whatever man.

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Triptonic]
    #389104 - 03/23/10 11:07 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

:obamadre:


--------------------
kickin-two-hundo said:
you know what i did in english class? I came to class stoned out of my mind every day, i chugged vodka in the back of class, i put dead fish in the ceiling tiles. i put a gallon of old milk and orange juice in the file cabinet before winter vacation. i brought snakes in a tied up sweater and let them loose during class. i didnt go to school to learn, i went because i had to. i didnt care, and i didn't fucking listen to that stupid bitch. and i still don't fucking care. i tore the pages out of her books and burned them, and threw away all the books in the class, two books per day.  :twobooks:

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Triptonic]
    #389105 - 03/23/10 11:07 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Triptonic said:
Quote:

Doitagain said:
Quote:

Triptonic said:
Bahahaha I like how everyone claims I dont know what I'm talking about and no one in here has even read the bill. So Doitagain please explain how you know more about it than I do.



i'm not talking about the bill, i'm saying you fail at having even the most basic understanding of the structure of our government, never-mind the bill.



:rolleyes: whatever man.



whatever yourself.

Quote:

Triptonic said:
Yes he has the power to create jobs god you are dumb. Presidents before him did it. How do you think we have the hoover dam and such.




:rofl:


--------------------
ltd said:
fgts just don't understand

keep the shit

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Doitagain]
    #389106 - 03/23/10 11:08 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Dude I was totally right saying that.

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Doitagain]
    #389117 - 03/23/10 11:36 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Triptonic said:
Dude I was totally right saying that.



no you weren't you were completely wrong, and you still are.  A few other people pointed it out to you as well, and you rebuffed their remarks.  Honestly the health care thing is something where there can be a differece of an opinion, however on this you are factually wrong, and that really cannot be disputed.

Quote:

Triptonic said:
Yes he has the power to create jobs god you are dumb. Presidents before him did it. How do you think we have the hoover dam and such.




WRONG, WRONG, WRONG, WRONG. wrong wrong wrong wrong


--------------------
ltd said:
fgts just don't understand

keep the shit

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Doitagain]
    #389119 - 03/23/10 11:41 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

No I'm not factually wrong. You however are wrong.

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Triptonic]
    #389120 - 03/23/10 11:43 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

:macdre::macdre::obamadre:


--------------------
kickin-two-hundo said:
you know what i did in english class? I came to class stoned out of my mind every day, i chugged vodka in the back of class, i put dead fish in the ceiling tiles. i put a gallon of old milk and orange juice in the file cabinet before winter vacation. i brought snakes in a tied up sweater and let them loose during class. i didnt go to school to learn, i went because i had to. i didnt care, and i didn't fucking listen to that stupid bitch. and i still don't fucking care. i tore the pages out of her books and burned them, and threw away all the books in the class, two books per day.  :twobooks:

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: THEBats]
    #389122 - 03/23/10 11:50 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

:bushdre: guess who's back?


--------------------
--->
200/~218 Days
It's all a bunch of fucking bribble!

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Triptonic]
    #389123 - 03/23/10 11:51 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Triptonic said:
I'm am factually wrong, and i probably know this, but i refuse to admit it because i am such a small person




--------------------
ltd said:
fgts just don't understand

keep the shit

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Doitagain]
    #389125 - 03/23/10 11:53 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

I'm bigger than you (and smarter), and that is why I will now leave this thread and not come back :bye:

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Triptonic]
    #389130 - 03/23/10 11:57 PM (14 years, 9 days ago)

Quote:

Triptonic said:I will still come back to this thread, and i'm still wrong :bye:




--------------------
ltd said:
fgts just don't understand

keep the shit

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Doitagain]
    #389271 - 03/24/10 12:32 PM (14 years, 8 days ago)

interesting read.


--------------------
kickin-two-hundo said:
you know what i did in english class? I came to class stoned out of my mind every day, i chugged vodka in the back of class, i put dead fish in the ceiling tiles. i put a gallon of old milk and orange juice in the file cabinet before winter vacation. i brought snakes in a tied up sweater and let them loose during class. i didnt go to school to learn, i went because i had to. i didnt care, and i didn't fucking listen to that stupid bitch. and i still don't fucking care. i tore the pages out of her books and burned them, and threw away all the books in the class, two books per day.  :twobooks:

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Doitagain]
    #389299 - 03/24/10 01:18 PM (14 years, 8 days ago)

Quote:

Doitagain said:
Quote:

Triptonic said:
Bahahaha I like how everyone claims I dont know what I'm talking about and no one in here has even read the bill. So Doitagain please explain how you know more about it than I do.



i'm not talking about the bill, i'm saying you fail at having even the most basic understanding of the structure of our government, never-mind the bill.





Enlighten me, oh wise one.


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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: DieselB]
    #389307 - 03/24/10 01:25 PM (14 years, 8 days ago)

Forgive me i haven't read all the preceding dribble but does no one else feel that healthcare is a fundamental of a human right as is the right to control what we put in our body.  If you are involved in a catastrophic injury in the US you will receive medical treatment.  The paramedics don't check for your nationality or your legal status in the country.  Instead the focus on saving a life.  Otherwise it would be inhumane.  Why is it any different for healthcare on a preventative basis?  Surely that's in our best interest collectively.  The problem here is the insurance companies.  This healthcare 'reform' is no different than a slight shift in drug policy to send more troops over to Juarez to help combat the violence.  We aren't attacking this thing at the source.  But, in reality, no member of congress will ever stand up and demand the health insurance companies be dissolved and the government take it over in its entirety.  Call it socialism if you want.  It would be as much socialism as the mail system.  Which operates as a private organization - it gets none of your tax dollars.  It can be done people.  wake the fuck up.


--------------------





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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: FurrowedBrow]
    #389315 - 03/24/10 01:29 PM (14 years, 8 days ago)

Quote:

FurrowedBrow said:
Forgive me i haven't read all the preceding dribble but does no one else feel that healthcare is a fundamental of a human right as is the right to control what we put in our body.  If you are involved in a catastrophic injury in the US you will receive medical treatment.  The paramedics don't check for your nationality or your legal status in the country.  Instead the focus on saving a life.  Otherwise it would be inhumane.  Why is it any different for healthcare on a preventative basis?  Surely that's in our best interest collectively.  The problem here is the insurance companies.  This healthcare 'reform' is no different than a slight shift in drug policy to send more troops over to Juarez to help combat the violence.  We aren't attacking this thing at the source.  But, in reality, no member of congress will ever stand up and demand the health insurance companies be dissolved and the government take it over in its entirety.  Call it socialism if you want.  It would be as much socialism as the mail system.  Which operates as a private organization - it gets none of your tax dollars.  It can be done people.  wake the fuck up.





I agree with that, but the question is, and I have talked to people reading the bill now, can they do it without incurring extra charges/taxes on us?


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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: DieselB]
    #389329 - 03/24/10 02:18 PM (14 years, 8 days ago)

Quote:

DieselB said:
Quote:

FurrowedBrow said:
Forgive me i haven't read all the preceding dribble but does no one else feel that healthcare is a fundamental of a human right as is the right to control what we put in our body.  If you are involved in a catastrophic injury in the US you will receive medical treatment.  The paramedics don't check for your nationality or your legal status in the country.  Instead the focus on saving a life.  Otherwise it would be inhumane.  Why is it any different for healthcare on a preventative basis?  Surely that's in our best interest collectively.  The problem here is the insurance companies.  This healthcare 'reform' is no different than a slight shift in drug policy to send more troops over to Juarez to help combat the violence.  We aren't attacking this thing at the source.  But, in reality, no member of congress will ever stand up and demand the health insurance companies be dissolved and the government take it over in its entirety.  Call it socialism if you want.  It would be as much socialism as the mail system.  Which operates as a private organization - it gets none of your tax dollars.  It can be done people.  wake the fuck up.





I agree with that, but the question is, and I have talked to people reading the bill now, can they do it without incurring extra charges/taxes on us?




Of course they can, but profit has to be taken out of the equation first.
That is the hard part, too much greed associated with it now for it to work properly

Health care (like criminal justice) should not be a for profit industry
these issues address the commonwealth of the nation
and should be socialized, not privatized
people should not be trying to profit
from me being injured or robbed


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The Ego is a pathological condition
like a calcareous tumor or cyst
that begins growing in the personality
in the absence of hallucinogenic substances
-Terence McKenna-

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: DieselB]
    #389348 - 03/24/10 02:56 PM (14 years, 8 days ago)

Quote:

DieselB said:
Quote:

Doitagain said:
Quote:

Triptonic said:
Bahahaha I like how everyone claims I dont know what I'm talking about and no one in here has even read the bill. So Doitagain please explain how you know more about it than I do.



i'm not talking about the bill, i'm saying you fail at having even the most basic understanding of the structure of our government, never-mind the bill.





Enlighten me, oh wise one.



i'm not even claiming to be wise here, i'm claiming to understand the fundamental structure of our government as learned in k-12 education.  As in we have a system of checks and balances, and the fact that the president really can't do shit w/o the cooperation of congress (except command the armed forces)

I have quoted multipe times the post of trips i was talking about, why don't you follow the content of the thread because it's in there, i feel no need to explain myself to you.  If you don't see immediately how stupid triptonics comment was then it's possible your understanding of the government if as weak as his.


Quote:

Triptonic said:
Yes he has the power to create jobs god you are dumb. Presidents before him did it. How do you think we have the hoover dam and such.




That's the last time i quote his post, if you don't see why thats stupid chances are you might be stupid too.  Because most 8th graders who went through my school system could tell you why it is.

Obviously none of us have read the bill in it's entirety, but comments like that show trip has nothing of intellectual value to contribute to this conversation.  I'm not saying nobody on your side does, because tang has made some good arguments even though i disagree with them.

But it is 100% clear, that triptonic has NOTHING to contribute to a political discussion and would do better to stay out of it.


--------------------
ltd said:
fgts just don't understand

keep the shit

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Doitagain]
    #389362 - 03/24/10 03:43 PM (14 years, 8 days ago)

fuck this thread

death to america! :osama:

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: FurrowedBrow]
    #389406 - 03/24/10 05:14 PM (14 years, 8 days ago)

Quote:

FurrowedBrow said:
Forgive me i haven't read all the preceding dribble but does no one else feel that healthcare is a fundamental of a human right as is the right to control what we put in our body?




Welcome to the club. I was arguing this for about 3 pages the other day.

Tang so far is the only one around here as far as I know that doesn't.


--------------------
andyistic said:
Ok so let me bring you idiots up to speed.
The admins are tired of this shitfest being made the joke of the weed community on the Internet.

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: TomCollins]
    #389607 - 03/24/10 09:16 PM (14 years, 8 days ago)

I said nothing to or about Triptonic.. I don't know why you're trying to tell me if I don't think he's dumb than I am too? Why do you feel the need to degrade people, is everyone not entitled to their opinion?


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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: DieselB]
    #389609 - 03/24/10 09:17 PM (14 years, 8 days ago)

He's European so he's better than us lowly Americans. We don't know whats good for us, so we should listen and do whatever our government tells us.

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: DieselB]
    #389633 - 03/24/10 10:06 PM (14 years, 8 days ago)

Quote:

DieselB said:
I said nothing to or about Triptonic.. I don't know why you're trying to tell me if I don't think he's dumb than I am too? Why do you feel the need to degrade people, is everyone not entitled to their opinion?



of course people are entitled to their opinion, but when they assert something that is factually wrong I am entitled to correct them.

No matter how much trip bitches and whines the president cannot make laws creating jobs, all he can do is approve bills passed by congress and the senate.


--------------------
ltd said:
fgts just don't understand

keep the shit

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Offlineb0b gnarley
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Doitagain]
    #389641 - 03/24/10 10:20 PM (14 years, 8 days ago)

ITT: trolls, tards, and optimism

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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: b0b gnarley]
    #389680 - 03/25/10 12:43 AM (14 years, 8 days ago)

:lol:


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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: DungenessDank]
    #389692 - 03/25/10 03:23 AM (14 years, 7 days ago)

Quote:

DungenessDank said:
He's European so he's better than us lowly Americans. We don't know whats good for us, so we should listen and do whatever our government tells us.




DieselB wasn't talking to me. :facepalm: Nice trolling.


--------------------
andyistic said:
Ok so let me bring you idiots up to speed.
The admins are tired of this shitfest being made the joke of the weed community on the Internet.

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OfflineThebooedocksaint
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: DungenessDank]
    #389708 - 03/25/10 06:39 AM (14 years, 7 days ago)

Quote:

DungenessDank said:
He's European so he's better than us lowly Americans. We don't know whats good for us, so we should listen and do whatever our government tells us.




And your a troll.


--------------------
"Je pense, donc je suis (I am thinking, therefore I am)." -Rene Descartes

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OfflineTHEBats
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Thebooedocksaint]
    #389709 - 03/25/10 06:42 AM (14 years, 7 days ago)

:andyistic:


--------------------
kickin-two-hundo said:
you know what i did in english class? I came to class stoned out of my mind every day, i chugged vodka in the back of class, i put dead fish in the ceiling tiles. i put a gallon of old milk and orange juice in the file cabinet before winter vacation. i brought snakes in a tied up sweater and let them loose during class. i didnt go to school to learn, i went because i had to. i didnt care, and i didn't fucking listen to that stupid bitch. and i still don't fucking care. i tore the pages out of her books and burned them, and threw away all the books in the class, two books per day.  :twobooks:

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OfflineThebooedocksaint
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Thebooedocksaint]
    #389710 - 03/25/10 06:50 AM (14 years, 7 days ago)

Quote:

THEBats said:
:andyistic:




Sigh, I need to wait longer after waking up to post.

Ill rephrase that.


Quote:

DungenessDank said:
He's European so he's better than us lowly Americans. We don't know whats good for us, so we should listen and do whatever our government tells us.




And you're a troll.


--------------------
"Je pense, donc je suis (I am thinking, therefore I am)." -Rene Descartes

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OfflineTHEBats
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Thebooedocksaint]
    #389713 - 03/25/10 07:27 AM (14 years, 7 days ago)

:highfive:


--------------------
kickin-two-hundo said:
you know what i did in english class? I came to class stoned out of my mind every day, i chugged vodka in the back of class, i put dead fish in the ceiling tiles. i put a gallon of old milk and orange juice in the file cabinet before winter vacation. i brought snakes in a tied up sweater and let them loose during class. i didnt go to school to learn, i went because i had to. i didnt care, and i didn't fucking listen to that stupid bitch. and i still don't fucking care. i tore the pages out of her books and burned them, and threw away all the books in the class, two books per day.  :twobooks:

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InvisibleFurrowedBrowM
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Posts: 12,041
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Doitagain]
    #389720 - 03/25/10 08:02 AM (14 years, 7 days ago)

Quote:

Doitagain said:
Quote:

DieselB said:
I said nothing to or about Triptonic.. I don't know why you're trying to tell me if I don't think he's dumb than I am too? Why do you feel the need to degrade people, is everyone not entitled to their opinion?



of course people are entitled to their opinion, but when they assert something that is factually wrong I am entitled to correct them.

No matter how much trip bitches and whines the president cannot make laws creating jobs, all he can do is approve bills passed by congress and the senate.




you were gone during the bush administration right?  Thanks to Cheney we've never had a more powerful president.  The almighty executive order is king here now.


--------------------





Multidisciplinary Association for Psychedelic Studies - Become a member!
The Growery's Herb Museum (post #24)
I prefer dangerous freedom to peaceful slavery.
~ Thomas Jefferson ~

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OfflineDieselB
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Doitagain]
    #389722 - 03/25/10 08:20 AM (14 years, 7 days ago)

Quote:

Doitagain said:
Quote:

DieselB said:
I said nothing to or about Triptonic.. I don't know why you're trying to tell me if I don't think he's dumb than I am too? Why do you feel the need to degrade people, is everyone not entitled to their opinion?



of course people are entitled to their opinion, but when they assert something that is factually wrong I am entitled to correct them.

No matter how much trip bitches and whines the president cannot make laws creating jobs, all he can do is approve bills passed by congress and the senate.




Thats bullshit and you know it. Did you hear waht Biden said this morning? "If we did'nt get this passed, this administration was through. Absolutely through."

If you think the president has no influence, and can't push a bill the senate and house's way just to come back to him, you're crazy.


They convinced all the Democrats that if they didn't pass this bill then Obama would be looked upon as a failure. Notice how they had to buy off the Pro-Life Democrats that were gonna hold up the process? Thats when Obama signed the bill banning federally funded abortions, except in cases of rape, incest or danger to the life of the mother. Notice how it got almost no coverage the day after the health care bill was signed.


--------------------
If you ain't smokin' dro, you're smokin' reggie. :shrug:

Edited by DieselB (03/25/10 08:22 AM)

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OfflineDungenessDank
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Thebooedocksaint]
    #389723 - 03/25/10 08:25 AM (14 years, 7 days ago)

Listen to your government people, marijuana is a dangerous harmful drug, war in the middle east is necessary, and this health care bill is gonna save us all.

Just because I don't agree with everyone I'm a troll. Makes sense to me.

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OfflineTomCollins


Registered: 10/06/09
Posts: 2,943
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: DungenessDank]
    #389737 - 03/25/10 09:22 AM (14 years, 7 days ago)

Quote:

DungenessDank said:
Just because I don't agree with everyone I'm a troll. Makes sense to me.




:facepalm:


--------------------
andyistic said:
Ok so let me bring you idiots up to speed.
The admins are tired of this shitfest being made the joke of the weed community on the Internet.

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OfflineThebooedocksaint
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: DungenessDank]
    #389784 - 03/25/10 10:42 AM (14 years, 7 days ago)

Quote:

DungenessDank said:
He's European so he's better than us lowly Americans. We don't know whats good for us, so we should listen and do whatever our government tells us.




My trollenesse may be a bit dull, but I highlighted the trollish segment IMO.

You A) Try to make him look like he thinks he is better than us (Read: The Americans posting in the thread). B) Act like we are listening to our government this whole time. I've been in support of public health care for quite awhile.


--------------------
"Je pense, donc je suis (I am thinking, therefore I am)." -Rene Descartes

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OfflineDoitagain
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: DieselB]
    #389857 - 03/25/10 12:07 PM (14 years, 7 days ago)

Quote:

FurrowedBrow said:
Quote:

Doitagain said:
Quote:

DieselB said:
I said nothing to or about Triptonic.. I don't know why you're trying to tell me if I don't think he's dumb than I am too? Why do you feel the need to degrade people, is everyone not entitled to their opinion?



of course people are entitled to their opinion, but when they assert something that is factually wrong I am entitled to correct them.

No matter how much trip bitches and whines the president cannot make laws creating jobs, all he can do is approve bills passed by congress and the senate.




you were gone during the bush administration right?  Thanks to Cheney we've never had a more powerful president.  The almighty executive order is king here now.



Yeah uhm not really, show me so called examples where the "executive order" was used to change existing laws, or change anything of significance.  The main abuse of Bush's power was his commandment of the armed forces, which is technically not an abuse.

The president is fully allowed to invade a sovereign nation without the approval of congress as long as he does not call the action a "war."  Seriously furrowed, maybe i'm wrong but then surely you can give me an example where bush used an executive order to alter existing law.

Quote:

DieselB said:
Quote:

Doitagain said:
Quote:

DieselB said:
I said nothing to or about Triptonic.. I don't know why you're trying to tell me if I don't think he's dumb than I am too? Why do you feel the need to degrade people, is everyone not entitled to their opinion?



of course people are entitled to their opinion, but when they assert something that is factually wrong I am entitled to correct them.

No matter how much trip bitches and whines the president cannot make laws creating jobs, all he can do is approve bills passed by congress and the senate.




Thats bullshit and you know it. Did you hear waht Biden said this morning? "If we did'nt get this passed, this administration was through. Absolutely through."

If you think the president has no influence, and can't push a bill the senate and house's way just to come back to him, you're crazy.


They convinced all the Democrats that if they didn't pass this bill then Obama would be looked upon as a failure. Notice how they had to buy off the Pro-Life Democrats that were gonna hold up the process? Thats when Obama signed the bill banning federally funded abortions, except in cases of rape, incest or danger to the life of the mother. Notice how it got almost no coverage the day after the health care bill was signed.



No it's not bullshit and you know it, of course he has influnece, but that's all he has is influence he cannot force congress to pass legislation he can only hope they co-operate with him.


Also he did not sign a bill banning federally funded abortions, he issued an executive order saying that he will uphold the current ban on federal funding.  Some critics assert that the current health-care reform bill will provide loopholes for federal abortion funding anyways.

What is certain is that this executive order has no real legal bearing, and federal funding for abortions is already restricted by a legislative provision called the "hyde amendment"  It was a shrewd political move by obama though, because he promised nothing that was binding and got these so-called "pro-life dems" in on his bill.

It's very possible we could still see federal funding for abortion, because the whole executive order means fuck-all in our legal system.


--------------------
ltd said:
fgts just don't understand

keep the shit

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InvisibleFurrowedBrowM
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Doitagain]
    #389895 - 03/25/10 01:20 PM (14 years, 7 days ago)

Quote:

Doitagain said:
Quote:

FurrowedBrow said:
Quote:

Doitagain said:
Quote:

DieselB said:
I said nothing to or about Triptonic.. I don't know why you're trying to tell me if I don't think he's dumb than I am too? Why do you feel the need to degrade people, is everyone not entitled to their opinion?



of course people are entitled to their opinion, but when they assert something that is factually wrong I am entitled to correct them.

No matter how much trip bitches and whines the president cannot make laws creating jobs, all he can do is approve bills passed by congress and the senate.




you were gone during the bush administration right?  Thanks to Cheney we've never had a more powerful president.  The almighty executive order is king here now.



Yeah uhm not really, show me so called examples where the "executive order" was used to change existing laws, or change anything of significance.  The main abuse of Bush's power was his commandment of the armed forces, which is technically not an abuse.

The president is fully allowed to invade a sovereign nation without the approval of congress as long as he does not call the action a "war."  Seriously furrowed, maybe i'm wrong but then surely you can give me an example where bush used an executive order to alter existing law.






You are correct.  The president has broad ranging powers in 'war time'.  I didn't mean to argue that the exec orders changed laws.  They are a means of delegated legislation.  I am no expert but it's my understanding that as long as the OLC approves the orders they can do a huge number of things.  So i guess my point was that if he wanted to create a new government agency on a whim, if the olc approves of the legal arguements for doing so, then he can do it, thus creating jobs out of nowhere.

"One extreme example of an executive order is Executive Order 9066, where Franklin D. Roosevelt delegated military authority to remove any or all people (used to target specifically Japanese Americans and German Americans) in a military zone." (wiki)  Surely some of those tasks were new jobs.  All new jobs real are is work.  geeez how did i get so far off topic.


--------------------





Multidisciplinary Association for Psychedelic Studies - Become a member!
The Growery's Herb Museum (post #24)
I prefer dangerous freedom to peaceful slavery.
~ Thomas Jefferson ~

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OfflineDoitagain
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: FurrowedBrow]
    #389901 - 03/25/10 01:32 PM (14 years, 7 days ago)

Yeah but that was using the military authority, the president can execute his wishes if he gets the military to do them, but that doesn't really create jobs, because those people are already in the military.

Basically, the president is free to do whatever he can accomplish with the military, a prime example is when the supreme court ruled that we had to honor existing land agreements with the native american nations, so President Andrew Jackson used the military to remove them all in something called the trail of tears.

To assert that the president has much power to create jobs without working in concert with congress is extremely fallacious.  Look at any major public work that created jobs, like the Hoover dam or anything from FDR's new deal and you will find that it was accomplished by a bill passed through congress and signed by the president

Incidentally i'm sure the task of administering the new healthcare reforms will create jobs, and i'm sure some of the stuff he's done has created jobs. 

At any rate, trips expectations of the president are wholly unrealistic and seem to be based on a seriously flawed understanding of the office of the president, i don't think you would dispute that.


--------------------
ltd said:
fgts just don't understand

keep the shit

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Offlinearachnospore
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Doitagain]
    #390010 - 03/25/10 04:36 PM (14 years, 7 days ago)

Wow, I just read all 10 pages of this and that was intense! I'm still confused as why some people don't want semi-socialist health care when they already have a socialist police force and fire brigade.  Any of you ever seen Sicko? Admittedly Michael Moore is quite annoying but some so the points he brings up are good. 

For example, A man loses 2 of his fingers in an industrial accident and goes to the ER. So they ask him if he has health insurance but he doesn't have any because A) He can't afford it because even though he works a full week he's on minimum wage and thus can't afford that and to feed his family or B) He's been denied Healthcare because of one of the many pre-existing conditions that make him ineligible for it.  Either way, the doctor says it'll cost you $60,000 for the index finger or $12,000 for the ring finger. He can only afford one if he breaks into his savings so he goes for the ring finger.  Sadly now though he can't work in that same job because of this accident.

In what country would you not be outraged to hear that?? In Canada, Cuba or any European country (and many more) they'd have re-attached his fingers without a moments notice and he'd be fine.  You might have to pay more taxes which always sucks but it's for the greater good.   

Just my 2p


--------------------
We can't stop here, this is bat country!

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OfflineTangerines
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Registered: 04/20/08
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: arachnospore]
    #390011 - 03/25/10 04:37 PM (14 years, 7 days ago)

2p? Are you Mexican? My two cents are worth more.

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OfflineDoitagain
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Tangerines]
    #390015 - 03/25/10 04:44 PM (14 years, 7 days ago)

hes probably from england and talking about pence.

in which case his are worth nearly 4 of our american cents.


Also you people running your mouths about how awful england's health-care system is don't know what the fuck you are talking about.  No one from there is complaining, and they are all laughing at what we are saying about it.

It has almost zero basis in reality, sometimes there are waiting lists for operations that are not emergencies but everyone gets the care that they need, and by and large the british i have talked to don't seem to be complaining.

You fucking neo-cons just latch on to whatever pseudo-fact you hear in the right-wing media and repeate it ad nauseum.


--------------------
ltd said:
fgts just don't understand

keep the shit

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Offlinearachnospore
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Doitagain]
    #390026 - 03/25/10 05:10 PM (14 years, 7 days ago)

I'm from Scotland but close enough.  Yeah we have to wait a short time for non-emergency operations but I don't have to wait to see my personal doctor or dentist so I'm pretty happy.  In no way am I saying our healthcare system is the best in the world though but it seems to work quite well.


--------------------
We can't stop here, this is bat country!

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OfflineDoitagain
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: arachnospore]
    #390031 - 03/25/10 05:25 PM (14 years, 7 days ago)

yeah it's funny how delusional the neo-cons are.

In america it's "common knowledge" that in the UK they have to wait weeks just go get a simple doctor's appointment.


--------------------
ltd said:
fgts just don't understand

keep the shit

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OfflineChillWillis
old school fool


Registered: 06/14/09
Posts: 2,213
Last seen: 7 years, 3 months
Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: Doitagain]
    #390035 - 03/25/10 05:46 PM (14 years, 7 days ago)

In the UK it's "common knowledge" that in America they have to wait 6 months just to get a simple dental examination.


--------------------

It's not a war on drugs, it's a war on personal freedom.

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InvisibleFurrowedBrowM
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: ChillWillis]
    #390051 - 03/25/10 06:37 PM (14 years, 7 days ago)

Quote:

arachnospore said:
Wow, I just read all 10 pages of this and that was intense! I'm still confused as why some people don't want semi-socialist health care when they already have a socialist police force and fire brigade.  Any of you ever seen Sicko? Admittedly Michael Moore is quite annoying but some so the points he brings up are good. 

For example, A man loses 2 of his fingers in an industrial accident and goes to the ER. So they ask him if he has health insurance but he doesn't have any because A) He can't afford it because even though he works a full week he's on minimum wage and thus can't afford that and to feed his family or B) He's been denied Healthcare because of one of the many pre-existing conditions that make him ineligible for it.  Either way, the doctor says it'll cost you $60,000 for the index finger or $12,000 for the ring finger. He can only afford one if he breaks into his savings so he goes for the ring finger.  Sadly now though he can't work in that same job because of this accident.

In what country would you not be outraged to hear that?? In Canada, Cuba or any European country (and many more) they'd have re-attached his fingers without a moments notice and he'd be fine.  You might have to pay more taxes which always sucks but it's for the greater good.   

Just my 2p




In America every employer who has over a certain number of employees must carry work comp insurance or be in violation of the law.  An 'industrial accident' would be covered under work comp, most likely.  So for that type of injury he wouldn't have to pay anything out of pocket.  Just an fyi for everyone i guess.


--------------------





Multidisciplinary Association for Psychedelic Studies - Become a member!
The Growery's Herb Museum (post #24)
I prefer dangerous freedom to peaceful slavery.
~ Thomas Jefferson ~

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Offlinearachnospore
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Re: BAM HEALTHCARE [Re: FurrowedBrow]
    #390065 - 03/25/10 07:01 PM (14 years, 7 days ago)

Fair play, I don't have that much of an idea of his situation.  Might have been a small company or self employed.  Mostly getting the point across that he could be turned away at the hospital for not having the cash to re-attach his fingers seems pretty cold.  Also, I've never heard anybody over here think that it takes 6 months to get a dental appointment, I personally always thought it was a pretty quick turnaround.


--------------------
We can't stop here, this is bat country!

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